20 children
6 adults
1 shooter
all at the school between two rooms
also one dead adult at a different outside location
Info from briefing live on CBS

This is very sad.

All societies produce killers, so no blame to the US, or Canada, Britain, Norway, Afghanistan, Burkina Faso, Vanuatu or wherever. My thoughts are with the relatives and friends of the victims, and also witb the cops and paramedics who have had to deal with the aftermath.

Stressed - he isnt' an animal. He's a human being...which is a creature with the unique ability to concoct and commit evil acts. Animals are actually saved from such atrocities, as, generally speaking their killings - even their mass killings. You minimize this act by calling it an act of an animal. that's the problem...that's why it's so bad, because he's human.

If an animal went on a rampage and killed 50 people, it would be met differently, with understanding. THIS can not be comprehended by rational human beings.

Krellin, you know what I mean.

No....I don't know what you mean. That's why I am clarifying and using proper terminology. EVIL is the word to use, not ANIMAL. It is significantly different.

Words have meaning.

@Stressedlines, sadly, no, that disturbed freak of a man is a human. Animals don't go around killing children of their species for fun.

@ Krellin, replace animal with monster, freak, sickly disturbed individual, etc, and you'll understand what he's saying.

regardless of you how say it though, this was a disgusting act and my thoughts go out to everyone affected by what happened today.

jmo -- I know what he was saying...and to make a specific point - one which you made yourself, I corrected him. To call him an animal partially excuses him.

The problem in our society is that we too often refuse to call evil what it is. He is an evil man and he committed and evil act. Our society does not do enough to value life...until there is a mass murder...then we cry alligator tears for a few days and forget about it because we responded in a socially acceptable way.

Not to change the topic...but some people believe in assisted suicide, some people believe in abortion...and others believe those actions devalue human life...but when they suggest all life has meaning, they are called idiots and worse and told they don't' have a right to have an opinion. So no wonder wonder evil men have no qualms about eradicating innocent lives to make a point...we do it for a profit under the right circumstances.

Ok, jmo found the word I want. Monster. Thank you, case closed on the word game of what he was.

Animlas kill without feeling, which is what I was going after.

EVIL.

Monsters are imaginary creatures man creates myths about to explain evil.

This was real EVIL.

How many more fucking shootings are going to endure before we ban fucking guns. How fucking many. This is the 7th mass killing this year. 61 mass killings in the last 30 years. 80% of them committed with legally obtained guns.

Ban the guns. Shut down the NRA. End this violence now.

This is why we need a 2nd amendment, if every child in that school had a gun then this wouldn't happen.

1. NOT THE TIME, PUTIN
2. I sympathize, mostly, except
3. Banning all guns is an atrocious infringement on civil liberties and the 2nd Amendment,
4. I AM NOT AT ALL in the pro-gun lobby, as everyone here can attest, but
5. Banning all guns and shutting down an independent organization is against the law,
6. THIS IS NOT THE TIME and, lest I forget,
7. THIS IS NOT THE TIME

5 year olds....

This is EXACTLY the time. We've had how many tragedies. How long do we have to wait! How long? This continues to happen and we just sit on our hands because our political class has been to craven to address the elephant in the room. LEGAL GUNS ARE KILLING PEOPLE.

A study in the Journal of Trauma and Acute Care Surgery found that the gun murder rate in the U.S. is almost 20 times higher than the next 22 richest and most populous nations combined. Every one of those nations has stricter gun control laws.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/07/gun-deaths-a-familiar-american-experience/

I need to go back into my profile and figure out how many threads I've muted because idiots derailed them and turned them into political anti-gun threads. I'm as anti-gun as it gets BUT THIS THREAD IS ABOUT THE KIDS AND STAFF THAT WERE KILLED BY AN EVIL MONSTER TODAY, NOT YOUR POLITICAL VIEWS. Start a different one so I can mute it if you really want.

I think we may be slightly quick to dismiss the gunman as evil. It strikes me that there was no personal gain for him in this action, and I've seen no evidence that he enjoys killing for killing's sake. Something broke inside him, and whatever evil it was that did the breaking I doubt it originated in him. I do not wish to excuse him, but I do pity him, and for the sake of children who may find themselves in similar situations in the future we have a duty to understand why this happened.

It's too easy to call this guy an animal or a monster and write him off as a lunatic - as if this was just some random event like a bird shitting on your car. Violence is part of human nature. Only when we recognize that this "animal" is human can we begin to face the underlying social factors leading to this kind of tragedy.

@Octavious: One of the teachers that was killed was the gunmans mother. That might be your motif

He killed his mother at home before going to the school.

Oh, I guess I heard it wrong, you sure?

Unless he was acting out of delusion, psychosis, or something like that, the only reasons I can think of for shooting up a elementary school is to 'go out with a bang'. So I'm concerned that the media frenzy around this and other mass shootings is validating it as a method for that purpose.

Yes, she was found dead in her home.

'All societies produce killers, so no blame to the US,
or Canada, Britain, Norway, Afghanistan, Burkina
Faso, Vanuatu or wherever'

Well would say gun laws change the frequency of these crimes; so it does matter what country you live in.

I would agree on the basis that all humans are animals. Calling them monsters doesn't do anything useful for understanding why it happened.

What behaviour are we looking at? Limit breaking; pressure/stress has limits, all animals suffer these limts under stress.

In humans it can result in divorce, sexual violence, dropping out of college, 'mental breakdown', the discovery of God/atheism. Or indeed mass violence.

The massiveness depends on the weapons available.

Your bullshit about not politicizing this is idiotic. You can NOT discuss, explain, or analyse this in a vacumn.

This is a great point to start up a debate which society has left behind.

Yes! Banning arms would be a violation of the secobd admentment; that has got to be one of the most shockingly pathetic appeals to authority and examples of idocy i've seen here in years.

Entirely true, in no way aware of REALITY. The second admendment was a change (or admendment) to a document written by flawed men.

These founding fathers were aware of their flaws, they knew things in the REAL world woukd not always be the same, so they EXPLICITLY enshrined the ability to ademend tue constitution. It is very clear they wanted THE people (well the states, each representing the people) to have the power to CHANGE things when circumstances demanded.

In the modern day, the army has nukes, you can't beat them with small firearms. If you believe that the point if the second admentment is to allow the people rise up against their government then perhaps you should study some civil war history - the last rising failed.

In the 30s state government sent in their troops (the national guard?) to break up striking unions; the only thing which allowed the people to freely express their working rights was when the federalies sent in the US army to protect them.

Look at YOUR OWN history! Educate yourselves before speaking idiocy here.

If you believe guns make people safer, then look at crime statistics. Compare and contrast with Canada, both deaths from legal/illegal guns and number of guns per head of population. The gun culture exists in Canada, but the gun crime does not. Mostly because of people's attitudes to guns.

This isn't about repealling the second admentment, this is about changing attitudes, fighting the 'prevailing wisdom' and building a civil society.

If you offered to study the details of criminology, the behaviours which trigger mass murders, then at least you would be attempting to ACT. To do something positive, to make your society better. But no, you disgust me. You think of the families... Without action you are essentially saying loud and clear 'WE ARE FINE WITH YOUR KIDS BEING MURDERED'

Thank you for being small minded, thank you for making America the pathetic excuse for a civil society it is. Thank you for supporting white men who terrorise your own country.

There are many great things about America which i will not get to see again; because i refuse ti do anything but spit on your soil for the medieval violations of human rights that it represents.

I think i'm more likely to visit Iran.

And yes, hyperactive jam, you're right the 'free press' in america, which feeds off of tradegy like this, is doing it's own part to encourage more murders.

If you can't die a hero, at least an anti-hero is the next best thing.

^^obiwankrellobi

Makes sense though.

^???