I refer to this: @mapleleaf,
If you want to make a point about gun ownership and control, that's fine, but saying that you take pleasure when kids die is offensive and does not add to the conversation. It is not acceptable on this site.

Yes, what this world needs is non-Americans *also* talking non-stop about America.

*yawn*

Americans are FULLY aware BY NOW that their lack of gun control coupled with their ridiculous availability of guns, result in a school shooting around every two weeks. In other words, dead kids.

Americans, including MANY on this site, are infected with the inane notion that this sea of guns equal freedom.

I satirize this prevailing American stupidity by affecting an attitude of giddy pleasure when the American children get shot up again and again and again because americans, with their inane Second Amendment, ARE objects of ridicule worthy of this treatment.

One CANNOT support that Second Amendment AND adopt an attitude of sorrow when the kids die.

Understand, boy?

"One CANNOT support that Second Amendment AND adopt an attitude of sorrow when the kids die."

You know that there are many, perhaps millions of people who do both, right?

Clearly you can.

You're missing the point, steephie. I don't agree with maple's methods, but the point he raises is a valid one. It has also been beaten to death on this forum enough already, so I'm not going to rehash it.

I don't think I'm missing the point. I'm just pointing out that what maple said isn't true. I know what he means, but what he's saying isn't true.

One can support the second amendment and be sorry for dead children.

Not reasonably.

You're not sorry enough to support restrictions on the 2nd amendment or better yet a repeal. So how many dead kids is the 2nd amendment worth? How many lives are you willing to see destroyed? IS there any threshold whatsoever?

Hey, I'm in favour of restrictions on the 2nd amendment. What I'm saying is that those in favour of the 2nd amendment as is could believe that changing the 2nd amendment doesn't change the amount of killed children in a good way, which is quite defensible.

What I'm saying is that this isn't about accepting dead children or not accepting dead children. Some may simply believe that changing that amendment reduces the amount of dead children.

But what these endless gun debates have shown is that on a fundamental level, it doesn't matter what the public safety consequences are, the 2nd amendment is considered a natural law right by gun advocates. Gun rights are held as sacred, completely independent of their actual policy consequences (which is why they consistently bring up the fact that cars and other things result in deaths, and never dispute the fact that more cars = more car deaths). Even if it could be shown, without a shadow of a doubt (in the minds of gun advocates), that more legal guns = more kids dead, they still wouldn't support changes to the law.

If that's not true (for some gun advocates), then I want to know, what level of violence attributed to guns is socially acceptable to you?

I keep seeing my name pop up in this thread.

4, 8, 15, 16, 23, 42

Too many disputed games require attention.

Too many mods/admins FUCKING AROUND IN THE FORUM.

ghug, the point WAS about mapleleaf's methods, and steephie didn't miss it.

Maybe steephie22 ought to be IN CLASS because it seems to miss a LOT in there.....

@maple: when you're trying to offend me, could you at least try to point out what I'm doing wrong?

Not going to, or paying attention in, class is what you're doing wrong. Using this Forum as a substitute for real life is what you're doing wrong.

Great, then I'm doing nothing wrong.

Oh, and steephie22, I've already dedicated a couple of threads to your "Will you all help me, and tell me what I'm doing wrong" troll shtick.

Nice try...

I notice ALL of the 2A morons RUSHING to defend their precious Constitution, written by bigoted White Supremacists.

Here's a question for you Yankee Doodle morons.

I posted a thread a while back about Chris Hedges suing Barack Obama. Predictably, as it was over all of your empty american heads, nobody commented.

The gist of it, as I suppose I must PARAPHRASE for you illiterate american flotsam, is that with the NDAA Title X Subtitle D, the military can carry out extraordinary rendition as domestic policing.

Bye bye First and Fifth Amendments.

Where's the outcry from you MORONS over your PRECIOUS CONSTITUTION?

Here's the link to the article again.... lol..

http://m.truthdig.com/report/item/why_im_suing_barack_obama_20120116?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%253A+Truthdig%252FChrisHedges+Chris+Hedges+on+Truthdig

Well, I usually try to avoid posting in these threads, but I do think mapleleaf has a valid point, but his methods are not the best.

First off, "Americans are FULLY aware BY NOW that their lack of gun control coupled with their ridiculous availability of guns, result in a school shooting around every two weeks."

You heavily underestimate the ignorance of Americans with this comment. I assure you while many Americans should be aware of this correlation, many are not. Now onto your defense of your comments.

"I satirize this prevailing American stupidity by affecting an attitude of giddy pleasure when the American children get shot up again and again and again because americans, with their inane Second Amendment, ARE objects of ridicule worthy of this treatment."
While Americans are very open to ridicule (as are any group of people), your method of choice is rather for. While I am quite aware that satire can be quite biting, there is still very much a line with it. The purpose of satire is indeed to ridicule, but by saying you are happy when children are killed does not help people see your point, it merely causes people to think you are a horrible person. If you going to try "satire" do it in a way that helps promote your cause not alienate its supporters. Also, I would like to point out that satire is infinitely more difficult through text, as tone can not be detected easily. What you did was bad satire at best, and horribly deliberate inflamatory comments at worst.

"Where's the outcry from you MORONS over your PRECIOUS CONSTITUTION?"
Well, actually, stuff like this is usually ridiculed by people like Jon Stewart and Stephen Colbert. However, the most common groups to express their rage are libertarians and part of the Tea Party, but most people find both groups either insane or idiotic.

I guess that is it for my post, and I doubt that I will change your methods, but I wanted to say something. That is all.

No comment on the Hedges(unsuccessful)lawsuit?.....

This entire thread is so obviously in bad faith that I don't understand why anyone is taking it seriously. No one in here, including mapleleaf himself, sincerely believes that gloating over shooting victims is brilliant satire capable of changing anybody's minds about anything.

Furthermore I'm pretty frustrated with several otherwise-reasonable forumites who have a blatant double standard regarding krellin and mapleleaf. Their shtick is EXACTLY the same thing, but most of you call for krellin to get sanctioned, either publicly on the forum or in complaints to the mods, while handwaving mapleleaf's vile rhetoric on the pretense that "he has a point he's making." It's an incredibly dishonest double standard and y'all should be ashamed of it.

mapleleaf is not going to convince anybody who supports gun ownership of the wrongness of their position by squealing with delight every time an American child is shot. This shouldn't even be an argument. Shame on all of you for enabling this vile, fraudulent comic wannabe.

+1 PE

Oh yes the lawsuit. While I do admire the lawsuit, and I do agree with the point of the article, I find it odd that this author decided to sure President Obama. When it comes to actions like this, suing whoever is president at the time seems like playing the blame game. The President did not put in the appropriations of the bill, he signed it (though it does seem to allign with his use of drones). The fact that those appropriations were added are a result of the military (or merely its supporters) wanting more power and finding a way to get it. This is also not to mention that that kind of bill is almost never vetoed as it is used to fund the military (there are controversies concerning the previous NDAAs as well). The fact that things like this happen are sad, and I am glad someone brought them to light, however it would be preferable if you would avoid simply yelling at Americans as it detracts from your objective.

Still no comment on the Hedges lawsuit? Still?
No outcry over your loss of First and Fifth Amendment "rights"?

I DO have a point, P.E.

You DO have shit for brains, P.E. Ask somebody to read the article for you.

Y'all.........lol.....oh my side.

You didn't read my post, did you, maple?

VN +1

Finally......

You don't sincerely believe you're convincing anybody, and neither does anyone else in this thread. This is just a bullshit pretense to justify being an asshole on the forum. Everyone knows it, and it's so frustrating that people delude themselves into the double standard they have about your posting compared to others' vile posting just because they agree with the point you're making.