Which Assembler? 360/370? AS400? x86? Assembler may have a core set of instructions, but each processor family/BIOS has it's own set of interrupts and ways of handling memory. I've done 360/370, x86, and a little old Apple ][ asembly in the past.

Au contraire...assembly is alive and well in real world engineering here and there, where you want things to work *really well* - where memory is tight and requirements are strict and you are trying to squeeze every last bit of power out of your processors...

We get the need for assembly in the automotive world.

We need more people that understand fundamentals in this world!

@Mapu - 91? Try 87. That was pretty much the last time I touched it. And only did that to hand assemble a new Int13 keyboard handling machine for Turbo PAscal as their keyboard buffer was too small and the routine didn't process the keys quick enough so that external device interfaces that used Int13 (like digital micrometers and such) would drop characters (thank you Borland idiongineers). Talk about a pain in the ass.

If by into you mean can program some something simple while hating every minute of it...not saying I don't appreciate the efficiency of the lower level languages, I just don't have the patience for it most of the time.

@Krellin - why not use modern Pascal or straight C? Easier to read and damn near compiles down to the identical code. Hell, Pascal gen 1 was written in Assembly and virtually every version since than was written in a prior version of *tada* Pascal.

We still get organizations asking us for assembly knowledge. Some of it probably has to do with working with legacy products. I don't always get all the nitty-gritty details on the whys and whats...but it's not infrequent to need someone that understands assembly.

I was wondering. Cause most RISC processors (like are used in the OBD-type automotive computers) are typically programmed with a reduced instruction set of C or even C++ nowadays.

Of course, assembly knowledge is great for disassembling software when you are stealing your competitor's product or "upgrading" EPROMS like performance shops do (e.g. Dooug Rippie Motorsports).

Mostly we are looking for C/C++ guys, yes.

'twas before '91 actually... lol.
x86 just now... Getting back into it! I kinda like seeing all that machine code...
Right now, just tweeking some graphics routines and getting my feet wet...
All those higher level languages end up being compiled into...

I'd like to mix C, Prolog into a concatenated Assembly looking language.

We only write in assembler where we really really need the speed. It's faster and usually smaller than compiled C, but it takes a lot longer to write and it's harder to maintain. We also make sure that it is extremely well documented before it goes in, so that other writers can work out what it was doing and how just in case it has to be changed. We use C or C++ for everything else, except these days MMI's are written in C# or <shudder>Java.

> ... C, Prolog into a concatenated Assembly looking language.
Prolog. Prolog? Prolog!!! Nurse! Nurse! come quickly Nurse! He's out of bed again! (sorry, haven't thought about Prolog for <mumble> years. Hoped that was just a poorly remembered nightmare from long long ago.)

SPEAKER - So where would you use it? Like on firmware, board support packages, etc -- stuff that is unlikely to be changing much but where speed is critical?

I loved writing Assembly for my undergrad Hardware course. Never had to use it outside of that, though.

To state the obvious, you need it in any case to write good compilers for new systems. There's no C until somebody has written an assembler, and if you want it to produce _efficient_ assembler, then it's going to have to be tailored to the processor in question by an expert.

I mean till somebody has written a compiler, obviously.

Anybody here even worked in Ada? Or how about that early OO GUI langunge, Object Vision written for Windows 3.0/3.1?

I've done some Basic, Fortran, Pascal, and... Logo LOL,,,
""where you want things to work *really well*""
It's also about the freedom of playing-and having a totla hands on feel- of what's going on under the hood of the machine, of doing things the way you want, of the (Big) challenge of building a whole thing basically from scratch and from one's own hand. etc....
and

... implementing some AI routines for Dip Bots.
And building an interfacable Math / Science library is also some I'd want to add to the said new language.
( Any one as used the http://golang.org/ ? )

My Master's Thesis was written in FORTRAN.

@Krellin - Yes. Some of the Board Support is written in assembler. We had to write some functions in the main core in assembler too - example: we needed a set of copy-with-bit-shift functions. These functions are written in assembler.

Everything you guys do boils down to Asm, in a manner of speaking.

Dharmaton -- That's why I said when memory is extremely tight, or speed is critical (say in a safety related system) they may get down in to assembly in order to make sure code is 100% optimized.

I hear yah :) I'm ow tweeking an Assembly program that displays '3 ' shapes from user-entered math functions... This, I'll expand to writing a new Assembly-level Language with Math, Scientific, Artificial Intelligence, and High-Level Symbolic routines. (Uh, also rehashing all the x86 OpCode docs and manuals.)

What system are you using that it needs to be done at that level?

Obviously, he is writing a computer algebra system for the SNES.

He's developing base logic for OFRO's....he's a traitor to humanity!

@abgeamcht : my own actually, I've always wanted to do my own 'the big everything' program :) But thought of it yesterday... It could be a languaged (GUIed) so that 'anybody' can program... dunno, just tossing an idea around there...
... uh btw, I can open a web browser, but not sure yet how to had the Java and stuff other that straight pipe HTML add-ons are to be found...
Nah- for now, my target CPU is an x86... What's an OFRO ??
I'm sure it ain't St. Ofros... !?! lol http://holylandshopping.com/m1/The_Three_Arches_Israel/p5602/Saint_Ofros_Unframed_Icon_IC403/product_info.html