Forum
A place to discuss topics/games with other webDiplomacy players.
Page 919 of 1419
FirstPreviousNextLast
cteno4 (100 D)
02 Jun 12 UTC
PASSWORD-PROTECTED ANONYMOUS GAME NEEDS ONE MORE
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=90480
It's called Full Press Cider. 70 D buy-in. Anonymous players, standard map, and 24-hour phases.
2 replies
Open
Sargmacher (0 DX)
01 Jun 12 UTC
Middle East: The Real Problem is Fashion.
"The real problem in the Middle East is fashion. If I opened my wardrobe and all I saw was a black burka and some sandals, I'd blow myself up too. Not one suicide bomber has ever blown themselves up while wearing Marc Jacobs."

Discuss.
3 replies
Open
Sandgoose (0 DX)
01 Jun 12 UTC
National Donut Day!!
In honor of National Donut day I will be hosting a game! 12 hr phases 101 bet pot! So...if you're interested...send me a PM and we'll talk. ;)
11 replies
Open
xiao1108 (453 D)
02 Jun 12 UTC
Question as a noob
Greetings gentlemen, I have a little question about adjudication that happened in last game. gameID=90431 It happened in A03, campaign of Greece.
The result was that Italy occupied Greece which I thought it could be a bounce off if I remember rule book right. Anyway, the influence was really small but I'm just merely curious. Thanks for your time if you did take a look at this. :)
8 replies
Open
cspieker (18223 D)
31 May 12 UTC
Why did this happen? Possible bug?
Check this out: gameID=85524

13 replies
Open
obiwanobiwan (248 D)
02 Jun 12 UTC
OLAY OLAY OLAY--JOHAN SANTANA THROWS THE FIRST METS NO-HITTER!
50 YEARS AND 8,019 GAMES LATER...
AN 8-0 FINAL AND 134 PITCHES LATER...
THE METS HAVE DONE IT--A NO-HITTER BY JOHAN SANTANA!
LET'S GO METS, AND VIVA SANTANA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
12 replies
Open
Stressedlines (1559 D)
02 Jun 12 UTC
Is there any leagues or Tourneys on this site?
I saw the World Cup thread, and am envious I did not get a chance to play in that, but is there other such events here that I could become part of that are starting soon, or going on now that need replacements?
7 replies
Open
achillies27 (100 D)
02 Jun 12 UTC
EoG- Classic Live-2
1 reply
Open
Euan1975 (100 D)
01 Jun 12 UTC
med bash
hey everyone. come and join the game
0 replies
Open
Zmaj (215 D(B))
31 May 12 UTC
EoG: No CDs/NMRs? please
It's nice when everybody's a pussy. Then you can choose when to draw.
33 replies
Open
obiwanobiwan (248 D)
01 Jun 12 UTC
Song and Drink--Drinkify.org Results for Webdip?
Go to Drinkify.org
Put in a musician or singer or band.
Post the drink/recipe they suggest to go with it.
Let's see what we come up with... ;)
14 replies
Open
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
30 May 12 UTC
Retirement
<See Inside>
34 replies
Open
coeus559 (278 D)
07 May 12 UTC
The Boston Massacre (face-to-face tournament), June 23-24
Face-to-face tournament in Cambridge, MA in late June
35 replies
Open
2ndWhiteLine (2611 D(B))
31 May 12 UTC
Teaching evolution
See below.
115 replies
Open
Tettleton's Chew (0 DX)
31 May 12 UTC
Citizen's United and the 2012 election
Working in the Romney campaign. Thought I would pass along some tidbits about the Citizen's United decisions and its effect on the 2012 campaign. Which will be the first presidential election where Unions and non-profit groups won't dominate campaign spending. Equality of opinion is here.
14 replies
Open
Hammourabi (133 D)
30 May 12 UTC
Daily Qur'an Reading
Wherein your souls may find their true calling.
Page 4 of 4
FirstPreviousNextLast
 
Putin33 (111 D)
01 Jun 12 UTC
"I completely disagree with your position and don't see myself ever changing to your side.

Political realism is called realism for a reason."

Many a realist call for scaling back our military commitments.
Vaftrudner (2533 D)
01 Jun 12 UTC
Ok, I'll write a more serious and less pissed off wall of text here. I should add that I'm currently studying Arabic and the Middle East at Stockholm University. A large part of my education is the religions and history of the Middle East, with less emphasis on other regions. Because my focus is Arabic, I've read a ton of Arabic history. I should also add what my disagreement with your attitude is, since we're going around in circles, stuck in minutiae.

You claim that Islam is inherently Arab chauvinist, citing historical examples, and you're not completely wrong. But you have also written that Islam has spread only because of conquest, which is demonstrably wrong. So here is a brief overview of what I've learned about the spread of Islam and the role of Arabs:

The Umayyads were Arab supremacists, yes. But it's important to understand what this means. The Arabic society before Islam was a clan-based nomadic society with a small clique of wealthy settled people engaging in trade. As the Arabs expanded, they started to embrace the culture of the conquered peoples, as often happens in history. Many Arabs started settling, which created a split in Arab identity. On the one hand, the settled Arabs in the Fertile Crescent, and the other the traditional nomad warriors who wanted to continue waging war. The other factions in Umayyad society were the malawi, non-Arab converts to Islam, and non-Muslims. The Umayyads wanted the Arabs to be a ruling class, and considered themselves more worthy, claiming that they had inherent authority since Islam was revealed to the Arabs. The Malawi, especially Persians, cited other parts of the Qur'an and hadith that called for a worldwide umma.

The Qur'an and hadith have contrary things to say about this. On the one hand, as you correctly point out, they celebrate Arabs and contain explicit racism. It's also important to note that the Arab that is being celebrated is the traditional one, the bedouin, the warrior poet. It's pretty damn far from what Arab identity evolved into, but I'll get to that. On the other hand, there are calls for a universal umma. Both points of views have been argued with Islam as a basic premise.

The Arab chauvinism was a major part in the fall of the Umayyads. The Abbasids managed to obtain the help of malawis, which was one of the deciding factors. The society and identity that developed under the Abbasids was completely different from the Umayyads. You say that Persians had been arabised - actually, the Arabs were increasingly persified. There was no cosmopolitan culture native to the Arabs. The culture and identity the Arabs in the Fertile Crescent built was mostly based on Hellenic and Persian thought. Greek and Persian works on philosophy, religion, administration etc. were the staples, and the clerks of the Abbasid administration continued to be Greeks and Persians for a long time. This is when Islam moved away from an Arabic religion to a world religion. The core texts are still in Arabic and are not meant to be translated, and a fundamentalist would argue that Arabic is the language of God. But the Islamic society was developed in a syncretic environment based on Persian and Greek civilisation.

The spread of Islam was slow in the conquered regions. It was discouraged by the Umayyads, encouraged by the Abbasids, but mass force conversions were rare. They did occur, as I'm sure you're ready to point out, but the fact remains that it took hundreds of years before a majority in the regions became Muslim. Syria still has approximately 10% Christians today. It's impossible to know why people converted. The most likely scenario is that people were pressured into it by the economic advantages of being a Muslim, but in a time when religion was the very BASIS of identity, to choose eternal damnation to get rid of the jizya would have been quite a leap. The mainstream consesus in the field is that it was most likely a combination of economic pressure, a general drift towards the views of the elite and some inherent attractiveness in Islam, primarily sufism for the general population. If you think that it is forced conversion when the pressure of being disadvantaged leads to conversion, then yes, you have a point, and I'll agree with that.

Another reason to convert to Islam was the vast trade network the Muslims had built, stretching from Africa to the Middle East to India and even to Indonesia and China, and the overland silk road as you know. Conversion meant access to this network, which was highly lucrative. This is probably a much larger reason than a military one for conversions in East Africa, Indonesia, etc. Still, there is pressure, but not military pressure.

The Abbasids slowly crumbled. They relied on slave armies and paying local notables with hereditary land for tax-farming, just to give a brief overview of a long and complex decline. The end result was an Arab figurehead while the true powers in the region were Persians and Turks. When it comes to the Turkish tribes, it's important to note that the Central Asian regions were not exactly modern nation states. The people who lived in Transoxiana and further north and east on the steppes were highly mobile and diverse steppe nomads. It was impossible for empires to govern these regions, and they were characterised by constant minor skirmishes and larger excursions between settled peoples and nomads. While the settlers were primarily Muslims, the nomads were a continuum of different Turkish and non-Turkish tribes, with a plethora of religions. As centralisation and cohesion declined in the Persian dynasties who had the real power east of Baghdad, they were overwhelmed by nomads. As often happens in history, large movements of nomads will rain down on weak regions, originally for pasture and looting, but if they stay, they often embrace the culture and religion of the settled people. By the time Turks became dominant around the Caspian Sea, de facto power had been with the Persians so long that the Islamic culture they adopted was completely Persian in nature, except for the Qur'an of course. This Turko-Persian mix was the dominant Middle Eastern elite culture from the 12th to the 20th century. If one examines Ottoman Turkish for example, half of it is Persian. This is also about the time where non-bedouin Arab identity crumbles outside of Africa and the western Levant. It had been completely absorbed into a general Islamic culture. Arabic identity as a political force wouldn't really resurface until the rise of the Wahhabis on one hand, and the secular, intellectual pan-Arabism on the other. During about 800 years, high Islamic culture was Turko-Persian. Islam as a society and a thought system had completely broken away from its Arabic bedouin past.

I think that the main reason why Arabic exceptionalism has resurfaced in radical Islam is due to the Wahhabis, and more importantly, the oil money of the Saudis. The Saudis, who are madhat fucking bonkers are also rich as fuck and backed by the new imperialists, great wonderful United States of Fuck the World, Give Us Oil. Since they have so much money to burn, they fund a ton of mosques and Islamic centers for learning all over the world, filling them with radical wahhabi influences and anti-semitism, to the point where this becomes associated with Islam, despite the fact that Islam is a widespread, dynamic religion that comes in tons of different forms in different regions of the world.

But now, the sufis. You should read about them. These mystics, different in every country, played a major part in the spread of Islam. Their Islam was and is a highly syncretic, mystical, at times esoteric, at times populist version. Sufism was heavily influenced by Persian and Indian thought, as well as neo-Platonism and other Hellenic mysticism. They were constantly wandering, active missionaries, providing general guidance as wise men (and even some women), writing poetry, proclaming saints for the locals to venerate and much more. Most importantly, they were always ready to incorporate the views of locals wherever they went. They were, and are, quite different from the fundamentalist rulers who based their rule on might and brutal enforcement. They were highly active in India, North Africa, West Africa and also in Central Asia and Southeast Asia. Whether they converted more or less people than armies, forced conversions and economic pressure did is impossible to guess, but it is generally accepted that they were a large part in the worldwide spread of Islam.


92 replies
ava2790 (232 D(S))
01 Jun 12 UTC
Daily 'Daily Reading' Reading
I don't stop by very often anymore, but I'm interested in recruiting someone to summarize all the 'daily reading of X' threads over here so that whenever I'm around, I'll feel like I haven't missed out on anything.
2 replies
Open
Onar (131 D)
31 May 12 UTC
Most popular game names
Just curious about what people name their games, and what seems to be most popular. Has anyone ever looked into this?
4 replies
Open
Yonni (136 D(S))
31 May 12 UTC
Need sub for a good position Germany
Germany has CD'd in a strong position during a FP triathlon game. Looking for a sub, anyone is welcome.
gameID=86428
7 replies
Open
Sandgoose (0 DX)
30 May 12 UTC
A thread for the Gross...
Let me start off with mine...
http://thedirty.com/2012/05/naked-man-eats-another-mans-face/

Tasty....
4 replies
Open
Riphen (198 D)
31 May 12 UTC
Gunboat means Never having to say You're Sorry- 19
New game 150 D WTA anon Gunboat


16 replies
Open
AlexNesta (239 D)
31 May 12 UTC
O Summer Gunboat, Where Art Thou?
Not to brag or anything, but I just won game 1-E! See, Lando, I didn't let you down... Unfortunately, I think this tournament is dead and buried... Did anyone here from Geofram lately?
1 reply
Open
czarm (100 D)
31 May 12 UTC
ameID=90318
1 player needed
0 replies
Open
Zmaj (215 D(B))
31 May 12 UTC
EoG: The Austrian Ultimatum
This game will be remembered for one thing...
10 replies
Open
Troodonte (3379 D)
31 May 12 UTC
Gunboat Means Never Having to Say You're Sorry-17
gameID=87630 - Game ruined by DILK who went CD...that's why I draw.
Thanks for those who commited to the game
I'm available to play another one with non resigners...
42 replies
Open
Draugnar (0 DX)
31 May 12 UTC
Conan! What is best in life?
To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women whjile you smoke their Cubans.

I just got given a real Cohiba Cuban - a buddy of mine has access to the real deal through a pilot friend of his. I gave him a starter pipe for his birthday (he has never smoked a pipe before) and he returned the favor with the Cohiba. Sweet!
3 replies
Open
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
31 May 12 UTC
Dollar Shave Club Update
As promised, here is my update on Dollar Shave Club. If you're interested, please sign up using this link:
https://www.dollarshaveclub.com/ref/24hn/9pch2t

26 replies
Open
mapleleaf (0 DX)
29 May 12 UTC
new game - no riff raff
gameID=90132
WTA anon gunboat, 350 buy-in, 2 day phases, starts this weekend.
you all suck.
2 replies
Open
carson87 (102 D)
31 May 12 UTC
need 11 more players for
a 25 buy in World Game.
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=89719
0 replies
Open
Zmaj (215 D(B))
30 May 12 UTC
EoG: Morons will be shot
gameID=90222

Well, here's the EoG of a power that had too much time on his hands...
10 replies
Open
Page 919 of 1419
FirstPreviousNextLast
Back to top