Krells has it right. I loves me my Batman, but Ironman can pick up a freaking car and throw it. Bats needs a car. Ironman stands alone. Even if Batman is in the batwing, Ironman can outmaneuver and take him. Think about Batman having *everything* in his arsenal: cars, boats, planes, all built into a wearable suit.

Yes but Iron man does not know who Batman is wheres Batman knows exactly where Iron man lives. Secrecy is Batmans weapon. If he catches Iron man with out his suit iron man is toast. If Iron man catches Batman with his suit Batamn is toast.

I think the better question is Kryptonian or Asgardian? Kal-el or Thor?

I never got why noone ever put a GPS transponder on that junkmobile...
And yes, Iron Man would probably be laughing... up to the point where that big ass EMP grenade explodes and turns that suits of his into so much junk.

I call bullshit on Iron Man not being able to figure out who Batman is. He's got a freaking AI computer that helped him bring into existence a new molecule to power his suit. I think he can find a playboy millionaire who like to flit around town in a cape!

I hate both Superman and Thor. Both of them are essentially gods...and as such, they do a pretty fucking piss-poor job of keeping the peace.

If Thor can get hold of some kryptonite Kal-el is dead if not Thor is dead.

Well, Supes does have his limits (get him on Asgard and he would be toast, different sun and all).

Hawkeye versus Green Arrow? Arrow has money, but Hawkeye has the backing of S.H.I.E.L.D.

Not that hard to harden against EMP...

Speaking of which: http://www.amazon.com/One-Second-After-William-Forstchen/dp/0765356864

Great book -- EMP attack wipes out electronics and electrical system of US (which would include back-up generators)...would essentially plunge the US a couple hundred years into the past....our food distribution system is predicated on an intricate transportation system....which would break down (no modern vehicles run after EMP). Chilling book....quite realistic, and quite possible. Predicated upon an intelligence report given to Congress about the possibility of a single air-burst nuke as an EMP attack...which, naturally, Congress has ignored....Good read!

Guess everyone would be in trouble except for the Amish.

@krellin: If you don't know this: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2070791/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1 check it out. Not an EMP but Nanobots switching off the power, but still fun.

Shhhh....no spoilers! I'm waiting for a couple seasons of it to show up on Netflix before I start watching!!!

Green Lantern vs. Aquaman. Go!

I thought the latest military chip designs were EMP-ready. I know a faraday cage can protect systems from an EMP blast and many generators have them built around them now. Of course, a faraday cage also prevents cell phones from working inside of it...

@Ezra / partysane - in the premise of this book, thinking about our food supply:
millions of heads of cattle....out west....
Corn, wheat...in the midwest...

But what about the millions and millions of people on the east coast, for example? Without transportation to distribute the food, you could potentially be looking at millions and millions of people startvign to death as local food supplies quickly run out. Add to that the number of people living on medicine (diabetics, heart patients, etc) who's medicine would spoil/run out quickly (because we live in an as-needed society).
It's really a terrifying book....and Congress has the study -- *1* air bust nuke over Kansas could devastate the continental US power supply system.

California and Florida have crops. They'd just have to switch what they ate to locally available foods. No where in the US save maybe the desert regions of Nevada and Arizona do they *not* have some kind of food supply they grow (or fish or hunt) locally.

The bigger concern would be clean fresh water.

Can someone please explain how a nuke over Kansas would affect diesel generators along the East Coast. It's pure nonsense

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-altitude_nuclear_explosion

High altitude explosions have a great range for the gamma and EMP effect.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:EMP_mechanism.GIF

Line of sight directed energy. I thought you were a scientist, Abge....

I'm an engineer. An electrical engineer, in fact, and I'm telling you that a nuke in Kansas would not take out diseal generators along the east coast.

Commission to Assess the Threat to the United States from Electromagnetic Pulse (EMP) Attack.
http://www.empcommission.org/

Yeah...just nonsense...

and you are right, a diesel generator without electronics wouldn't be taken out. the main power grid in the US would be. Most people don't have generators. Lots of modern generators have electronics built into them.

To deny that the effects of an EMP attack would be devastating because of a few diesel generators here and there is ...whatever...You're right, everyone else is wrong. I understand. Your diesel generator on the east coast will keep your empty fridge cold, because the semi's with the food coming from out west won't make it to you.

Well, the physicists and the US governments high altitude test would seem to disagree with you, abge. The most coastal areas might have generator power according to the map in the second link, but anything not within a hundred miles of the actual coast would probably be knocked out.

But even so, Instead of Kansas, the set one off over Wyoming and another off over Tennessee and you have the effect of taking out all of the 48 contiguous as well as Cuba and parts of Canada and Mexico

Do you guys even look at the damn links you post. Look at your own figures and you'll see the East Coast isn't hit by gamma rays from Kansas.

I would be really concerned with clean water and with the backup of the water in the hydroelectric dams.

My statement was so resoundingly simple it's unfathomable you could have misconstrued it.

Diesel generators
East coast
Unaffected
Nuke
Kansas

I made no claims about the devastating effects beyond what is posted above.

So the non-electronic diesel generators would still work. But to clarify you did say *over* Kansas. So...

Diesel generators
East coast
Unaffected
Nuke
Over/above
Kansas

Yeah, over Kansas.

It would suck, for sure. My point was just that there would certainly be electricity, it would just be in isolated regions. The premise that electricity is just something you switch off and can never get back is silly.

Also, as I pointed out earlier, generators can be protected reasonably well (even those with electronics) using a faraday cage around them.

Nobody said it would switch off and never come back on. The damage over the grid wouldn't be little onsie-twosie parts broken like in a typcial regional power outage. It would be widely distributed component failures that woudl cause massive cascading failures.

Perhaps you are too young to remember in 2003 when a rather simple failure caused a massive, prolonged power outage in northeastern US. So imagine is the *entire* electrical grid had component failures are random locations. Add on to that the fact that the communications systems would completely go down, and getting power back up and running wouldn't be as simple as you think.

Obviously people would have generators, old cars would still work etc. And after a week, when people started to riot and civil disorder stepped up, you'd might lose your generator or your life depending on your ability to defend yourself.

But again...diesel generator. May or May NOT work, depending on what electronics are built into the device to run it. Modern diesel automobiles run off an electronic ECU (engine control unit). I'm not certain what you think is so special about "diesel". Old gasoline generators will also run, if they are not controlled by electronics.

My parents have a generator wired into their home...and it's has a very fancy electronic control panel...and wouldn't work after those electronics got fried.

I'm certain you are a very smart Electrical engineer, abge - in fact, I know you are - but you are also somewhat naive at times. Sorry, not all diesel generators would work. And when you fuel supply runs out, they certainly won't work. and when civil disorder is the rule of the day, because the grocery stores are empty, and because people just generally suck and segments of society have a nasty habit to riot and steal and commit acts of violence when they think they can get away with it -- it could be an extremely devastating scenario, regardless of whether or not your diesel generator may or may not work.

Krellin, you're arguing with yourself, not with me.

I dont think it would last much more then a month provided you had a back up plan which I would guess the American government would and if they dont then its probably not really a threat. If it did happen all you would need to do is fix some factories and start pumping out replacments for key equipment such as Farm equipment, Generators, Vehicles transportation Etc. Provided that people behaved it would not be long before food could be distributed. America could even import many parts. Obviously it would take years to replace everything but a month or 2 tops to replace key equipment. And even in a month it would be horrible the loss of life. But like I said the chances of somthing like that happening are slim. First you would have to have some one crazy enough who would try such a endeavor. Second not only would they have to be crazy enough but they would have to have the training and resources to build it but not just build it hide it from our agencies (who seem to know everything) then they would need to have the ability to some how launch it over the states getting it past our military. Obviously there are people crazy enough but very unlikly that they have the brains or resouces to do it. Larger powers are to smart to use it and smaller ones that tried it would more Likly then not blow up before they had it off the ground (If they were lucky enough to get that far) Dont get me wrong im not saying dont ever be prepared or anything like that on the contrary hope for the best plan for the worst. Its a good idea in my oppion to store food and supplies. Im just saying its probably never going to happen. But if it did id sure hate to not have a plan.

Okay clearly you are all confused. How the hell will Batman, Iron Man, Green Lantern, Aquaman, Green Arrow, Hawkeye, Superman, and Thor all fail to stop a nuke from exploding over Kansas?

The fight between Green Lantern and Aquaman would be over so fast the Lantern would have more then enough time to stop it.

For the other ones, Iron man unless batman is able to EMP him, Green Arrow, and Superman (unlimited energy equal to a sun trumps a fancy hammer made in a sun)

I think you are underestimating the resiliency and ingenuity of people. Sure, there will be massive blackouts and riots, but a generator that won't start because of the fancy electronic front panel will just have the fancy front panel ripped out and some wires stuck in by any electrician. Burnt out starter coils and electric motors can be re-wound and replaced. Yeah, it'll be bad for while, but it'll get better than a zombie Armageddon pretty quick.

Anyone.else ever opens a thread because it looks fun and then end up unable to finish reading it because it's so boring?