This argument is in response to an atheist criticism.(Who created God if what you believe is true) I believe that God created the universe, so in this argument God creating the universe is a given.

So, you're saying there is absolutely no justification and yet you believe it.

Abgemacht, that pretty much summarizes CM's opinions on most topics.

"So, you're saying there is absolutely no justification and yet you believe it."


And that's cool!!

Just be honest, yo. God is made up, and might be true, but there is no reasoning behind it.

Irrationality is fun!! Embrace it!! :) Tell the truuuuuth.

I know. And until he either justifies his opinions or stops posting, I'm going to keep bringing it up.

All I'm going to say is that there is no justification that there is a God, but there is no justification that there is NOT a God. So, you believe in something that is not justified yourself.

Personally I don't believe in God, but I don't actively disbelieve in God either. As a general rule I don't seek to prove universal negatives.

@killer

1) I am making no claims about God. You have no idea what I believe and therefore have no idea if my beliefs are justified.

2) CM is making claims and therefore he should have to back them up. That's the way it works with everything else in the world. Why should this be different?

I believe I can't be sure of anything except this statement I am currently stating. But that's just me.

@abgemacht (post at the top of this page): Where the hell do you get that from? You were taking my argument out of context. The person wanted to know, in my belief system of God creating the universe, who created God? God creating the universe is part of my belief system, so in that particular argument, that is a given. What part of that is hard to understand?

@CM

Are you being purposefully dense? When I asked for justification that God came before the universe, did you really think I meant, "Assuming God created the universe, did he really come before it?" Really? Come on! I wanted to know what justification you had for believe that God created the Universe.

You originally asked for justification, it was because I had replied with that argument to a guy that was basically saying, "assuming God created the universe". Are YOU being purposefully dense?

@Abge: This is the argument of mine you're talking about right? "Time began with the universe. God existed before the universe began. That means that if God was created, he would had to have been created when there was no time, which is impossible, as there need to be cause and effect for creation to happen. So God could not have been created. God was simply the first thing to exist."
That is my argument in response to the atheist challenge: If God created the universe, who created God?
That challenge assumes God created the universe, and that is why in my argument I assume that. Do you understand now?