"you had a population issue, how would you choose to deal with it? authoritarian yes, but i find it hard to condemn as morally wrong."

Orathaic, I have a feeling you would view the situation differently if you were an unborn baby having your brain sucked into a vacuum. The one child policy was a product of the global overpopulation hysteria of the '70s, which no one now takes seriously (for anyone that still does, I invite you to take a long drive with me through rural parts of Northern California, Texas, or Wyoming - where you can drive for an hour through fertile uncultivated land without seeing a soul). China had a production problem, not a population problem. And that production problem was caused entirely by an economic system which punished people for producing. India is doing just fine with a comparable population and (in the 80s at least) a freer economic system. China's problem was not overpopulation but underproduction, caused by a communist economic system. Now that the communist economic system has been 'fixed', there's a lot of pressure in China to seriously reform (i.e., revoke) the one-child policy.

Yes Orathaic that true, the graph is pretty cool, lets have a look see.
Dont worry Faeces there quite a few more lurking in the woodwork, Where is Diplofool when you need him?

really? i imagine that if i'm an unborn baby, i've got little to nothing to say about whether my brain gets sucked up by a vacuum - which is indeed different - but then i believe that first chimps deserve the rights you'd probably fight for single undifferentiated human cells...

India is 'doing fine' by what measure? i'm pretty sure this guys statistics are right, and i can easily see India having lower (adjusted) income per person and shorter life expectancy than China. http://www.gapminder.org/world/#$majorMode=chart$is;shi=t;ly=2003;lb=f;il=t;fs=11;al=30;stl=t;st=t;nsl=t;se=t$wst;tts=C$ts;sp=5.59290322580644;ti=2009$zpv;v=0$inc_x;mmid=XCOORDS;iid=phAwcNAVuyj1jiMAkmq1iMg;by=ind$inc_y;mmid=YCOORDS;iid=phAwcNAVuyj2tPLxKvvnNPA;by=ind$inc_s;uniValue=8.21;iid=phAwcNAVuyj0XOoBL_n5tAQ;by=ind$inc_c;uniValue=255;gid=CATID0;by=grp$map_x;scale=log;dataMin=295;dataMax=79210$map_y;scale=lin;dataMin=19;dataMax=86$map_s;sma=49;smi=2.65$cd;bd=0$inds=;example=75

As for the massive areas of california and texas, i'm certain there are massive areas of China which are uncultivated, there are huge rural areas (as you can see here: http://www.panasianbiz.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/china_population_density_map.jpg )

Guess what! People use the best land first, so generally this uncultivated land is not 'best' - i suppose it would be cultivated if there had been no one child policy in China, just because the greater demand for food would increase global food prices and more land would be being farmed.

That doesn't mean it was wrong - even if you might have avoided forced abortions of second children, you could find yourself in the position where a one child policy makes sense.

Ah Murray Rothbard, the same guy who thought up the idea of allying libertarians with the far-right (really, thought up the Tea Party movement about two decades before it formed). Rothbard (and Rockwell) were unapologetic racists and eulogized real revisionist historians like Harry Elmer Barnes.

I'm so glad China is demonized but thugs like Rothbard and Rockwell are your role models. Heck, Rothbard/Rockwell's views are identical to that of Fasces here.

"Yet it is under a Communist government that China has enacted it's one-child policy, complete with involuntary forced abortions for those who aren't members of state-sanctioned minority groups"

China's policy was not and is not one of forced abortion. They use financial incentives to encourage families to have only one child. Where cases of forced abortions have taken place, they have been punished.

"@putin: i guess that really tells us what kind of communist you are. Clearly if you were allowed have you way communism would be something different to what most historians remember..."

Western historians sure, but they never had a grasp on what happened to begin with.

"Yes Orathaic that true, the graph is pretty cool, lets have a look see.
Dont worry Faeces there quite a few more lurking in the woodwork, Where is Diplofool when you need him?"
did you intentionally spell me name wrong?

"I'm so glad China is demonized but thugs like Rothbard and Rockwell are your role models. Heck, Rothbard/Rockwell's views are identical to that of Fasces here."
I'm starting to like them.

@Tolstoy: YAY: The second right winger.
@putin33: I have huge respect for you because what your doing is exactly what I am doing. (just different end of the spectrum). That is come up with good arguments on a government system that has failed almost every time it has been used in the past.

"Rothbard/Rockwell's views are identical to that of Fasces here."

Puhleeze.... I challenge you to show me where Rothbard advocated forced sterilization of social/racial 'inferiors' (for starters).

"China's policy was not and is not one of forced abortion. They use financial incentives to encourage families to have only one child."

Financial punishments are the case where second children are concerned, but forced abortions are certainly the case for third pregnancies. If you doubt it, I could introduce you to many (MANY) Chinese refugees here in Southern California who left the land of their birth precisely to escape such oppressions.

"Puhleeze.... I challenge you to show me where Rothbard advocated forced sterilization of social/racial 'inferiors' (for starters)"

Sure, but on the other hand Fasces hasn't called for complete and total racial segregation either. So maybe they're even on that score.

"We are now probably a lot more than two nations, and we had better start giving serious thought to national separation. To those who think that the main problem is restricting the number and types of immigration, the best answer is that such a policy is decades too late. We are already far more than one nation within the borders of the U.S.A., let alone worry about the immigrants. To greet the very raising of such questions with the mindless cry of "racism' or "chauvinism' misses the entire point. We might not be able any longer to bring back the Old Republic across the entire land area of the 50 states. But we may be able to bring it back in a substantial part of that land area."

"People with serious inheritable disabilities should not be allowed to reproduce."
Wow some of these questions are a little hard line!

And on the other side,
"Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all."

My results are
Left/Right: -0.62; Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -1.44
and the updated link:
http://politicalcompass.org/crowdchart.php?showform=&Ora=-5.62,-5.74&Largeham=-6.25,-6.51&GF=-1.25,1.54&Fasces=3.75,-2.51&Fasces!=8.19,6.27&RayN=-1.25,-1.74&Dan-I-am=-3.38,-0.41&Podium=-5.88,-2.26&Sean=-6.88,-5.18&Dejan0707=-8.12,-3.28&Putin33=-9.75,0.10&Jack=-4.25,-6.21&newname=Tolstoy&newec=.88&newsoc=-5.23&figle=-0.62,-1.44

Can't say I'm very impressed with this one - certainly wouldn't consider myself left wing. I think the main issue was this quiz spoke mainly about theoretical situations, and ideals. Now, I would agree with many left-leaning ideals, but am also of the opinion most of them are unobtainable, and as such would probably not support them in real life.

http://politicalcompass.org/crowdchart.php?showform=&Ora=-5.62,-5.74&Largeham=-6.25,-6.51&GF=-1.25,1.54&Fasces=3.75,-2.51&Fasces!=8.19,6.27&RayN=-1.25,-1.74&Dan-I-am=-3.38,-0.41&Podium=-5.88,-2.26&Sean=-6.88,-5.18&Dejan0707=-8.12,-3.28&Putin33=-9.75,0.10&Jack=-4.25,-6.21&newname=Tolstoy&newec=.88&newsoc=-5.23&figle=-0.62,-1.44&Ghost=9.25,-3.85

A few things;
what's with the two Fasces/Fasces!?
@ Fasces re diplofool, I'm sure some of the older members can tell you more about him, his latest re-incarnation was as TheMasterWarrior. Think every bad stereotype about the US in one person.
Also, on the quiz, does supporting protectionism make one left wing?

http://politicalcompass.org/crowdchart.php?showform=&Ora=-5.62%2C-5.74&Largeham=-6.25%2C-6.51&GF=-1.25%2C1.54&Fasces=3.75%2C-2.51&Fasces!=8.19%2C6.27&RayN=-1.25%2C-1.74&Dan-I-am=-3.38%2C-0.41&Podium=-5.88%2C-2.26&Sean=-6.88%2C-5.18&Dejan0707=-8.12%2C-3.28&Putin33=-9.75%2C0.10&Jack=-4.25%2C-6.21&Figle=-0.62%2C-1.44&Ghost=9.25%2C-3.85&Tolstoy=.88%2C-5.23&newname=Hellenic+Riot&newec=-7.75&newsoc=2.21

I agree with that, fairly honest representation.

http://politicalcompass.org/crowdchart.php?showform=&Ora=-5.62%2C-5.74&Largeham=-6.25%2C-6.51&GF=-1.25%2C1.54&Fasces=3.75%2C-2.51&Fasces!=8.19%2C6.27&RayN=-1.25%2C-1.74&Dan-I-am=-3.38%2C-0.41&Podium=-5.88%2C-2.26&Sean=-6.88%2C-5.18&Dejan0707=-8.12%2C-3.28&Putin33=-9.75%2C0.10&Jack=-4.25%2C-6.21&Figle=-0.62%2C-1.44&Ghost=9.25%2C-3.85&Tolstoy=.88%2C-5.23&Hellenic+Riot=-7.75%2C2.21&newname=FatherSnitch&newec=-2.88&newsoc=-3.18

I'm a bit surprised not to be further in the bottom left corner but maybe that's because as a European living in Texas I just feel like a Communist!

http://politicalcompass.org/crowdchart.php?showform=&Ora=-5.62,-5.74&Largeham=-6.25,-6.51&GF=-1.25,1.54&Fasces=3.75,-2.51&Fasces!=8.19,6.27&RayN=-1.25,-1.74&Dan-I-am=-3.38,-0.41&Podium=-5.88,-2.26&Sean=-6.88,-5.18&Dejan0707=-8.12,-3.28&Putin33=-9.75,0.10&Jack=-4.25,-6.21&Figle=-0.62,-1.44&Ghost=9.25,-3.85&Tolstoy=.88,-5.23&Hellenic+Riot=-7.75,2.21&newname=FatherSnitch&newec=-2.88&newsoc=-3.18&TBroadley=-4.75,-3.85

I remember doing this back in Grade 8. It's pretty much the same now, I believe.

http://politicalcompass.org/crowdchart.php?showform=&Ora=-5.62,-5.74&Largeham=-6.25,-6.51&GF=-1.25,1.54&Fasces=3.75,-2.51&Fasces!=8.19,6.27&RayN=-1.25,-1.74&Dan-I-am=-3.38,-0.41&Podium=-5.88,-2.26&Sean=-6.88,-5.18&Dejan0707=-8.12,-3.28&Putin33=-9.75,0.10&Jack=-4.25,-6.21&Figle=-0.62,-1.44&Ghost=9.25,-3.85&Tolstoy=.88,-5.23&Hellenic+Riot=-7.75,2.21&newname=FatherSnitch&newec=-2.88&newsoc=-3.18&TBroadley=-4.75,-3.85&Katsarephat=-1.25,-5.44

I used to be a little more economically left-wing and a little less socially libertarian. Funny how people change sometimes.

I spy a lot of liberals

http://politicalcompass.org/crowdchart.php?showform=&Ora=-5.62%2C-5.74&Largeham=-6.25%2C-6.51&GF=-1.25%2C1.54&Fasces=3.75%2C-2.51&Fasces%21=8.19%2C6.27&RayN=-1.25%2C-1.74&Dan-I-am=-3.38%2C-0.41&Podium=-5.88%2C-2.26&Sean=-6.88%2C-5.18&Dejan0707=-8.12%2C-3.28&Putin33=-9.75%2C0.10&Jack=-4.25%2C-6.21&Figle=-0.62%2C-1.44&Ghost=9.25%2C-3.85&Tolstoy=.88%2C-5.23&Hellenic+Riot=-7.75%2C2.21&TBroadley=-4.75%2C-3.85&Katsarephat=-1.25%2C-5.44&Fathersnitch=-2.88%2C-3.18&newname=mrlentz&newec=1.25&newsoc=-5.44

I guess not that suprising number of libertarians on an internet site. Am surprised by the heavy left weighting.

@dan-i-am

In America today, being a moderate makes you a left-winger, given the radical conservativism of mass political discourse. Anyway, I'm not going to bother to retake this test, but I wound up in the low negative sixes on both axes.

"Also, on the quiz, does supporting protectionism make one left wing?"

yes, economically protectionism is more left wing than right 'neo-liberal' as far as i'm aware.

The freedom of the market is 'right' and any state influence (or government control over, say health care) is left wing (and hence communist)

This may not correspond to your 'normal' view of left-right dynamics, but that's part of the point, a simple left-right dynamics fails to describe accurately the information presented.

http://politicalcompass.org/images/axeswithnames.gif

you get to see that two authoritarian rulers may have different ideologies and economic policies (as hitler and stalin are very different)

FYI: i guess you could agree perfectly with someone on economics, and in one case deny women to right to an abortion while in the other case deny them the right to a second child (possibly forced abortions) and the social freedom scale would still place you in the authoritarian quadrant...

however this test is aimed at 'western' democracies, where the abortion question is phrased as 'pro-choice/pro-life' either freedom to do as you like, or an authority deciding what is best for you.

" I think the main issue was this quiz spoke mainly about theoretical situations, and ideals" - i think this was intentional, to avoid a specific practical example, where you are biased and to get at your underlying ideals...

As i've said elsewhere, i think ideally water should be free for all, but practically metering water could be a useful device to improve quality and cut demand/waste.

"Wow some of these questions are a little hard line!" - and yes, this is to distinguish between the extreme right/left and those moderates...

Another point about protectionism is that it shows an interventionalist attitude.
Also, I assume that's a US website? The political compass over there is noticably right of general views here.

http://politicalcompass.org/crowdchart.php?showform=&Scagga=-2.50
,0.72

I mean

http://politicalcompass.org/crowdchart.php?showform=&newname=scagga&newec=-2.5&newsoc=0.72

http://politicalcompass.org/crowdchart.php?showform=&Ora=-5.62%2C-5.74&Largeham=-6.25%2C-6.51&GF=-1.25%2C1.54&Fasces=3.75%2C-2.51&Fasces!=8.19%2C6.27&RayN=-1.25%2C-1.74&Dan-I-am=-3.38%2C-0.41&Podium=-5.88%2C-2.26&Sean=-6.88%2C-5.18&Dejan0707=-8.12%2C-3.28&Putin33=-9.75%2C0.10&Jack=-4.25%2C-6.21&Figle=-0.62%2C-1.44&Ghost=9.25%2C-3.85&Tolstoy=.88%2C-5.23&Hellenic+Riot=-7.75%2C2.21&TBroadley=-4.75%2C-3.85&Katsarephat=-1.25%2C-5.44&Fathersnitch=-2.88%2C-3.18&Mrlentz=1.25%2C-5.44&newname=Scagga&newec=-2.5&newsoc=0.72

You're supposed to add your score into the box at the bottom ;)

http://politicalcompass.org/printablegraph?ec=7.38&soc=-1.54

These can change on any given day and my interpretation of the questions. I consider myself a bit more libertarian than this shows.

http://politicalcompass.org/printablegraph?ec=-3.88&soc=-0.31

i've taken one similar on facebook haha, different questions and the same results.. i guess that's good. the only thing is i've gotten less 'authoritarian'

Seriously, guys, add yourself to:


http://politicalcompass.org/crowdchart.php?showform=&Ora=-5.62%2C-5.74&Largeham=-6.25%2C-6.51&GF=-1.25%2C1.54&Fasces=3.75%2C-2.51&Fasces!=8.19%2C6.27&RayN=-1.25%2C-1.74&Dan-I-am=-3.38%2C-0.41&Podium=-5.88%2C-2.26&Sean=-6.88%2C-5.18&Dejan0707=-8.12%2C-3.28&Putin33=-9.75%2C0.10&Jack=-4.25%2C-6.21&Figle=-0.62%2C-1.44&Ghost=9.25%2C-3.85&Tolstoy=.88%2C-5.23&Hellenic+Riot=-7.75%2C2.21&TBroadley=-4.75%2C-3.85&Katsarephat=-1.25%2C-5.44&Fathersnitch=-2.88%2C-3.18&Mrlentz=1.25%2C-5.44&newname=Scagga&newec=-2.5&newsoc=0.72

Okay

http://politicalcompass.org/crowdchart.php?showform=&Ora=-5.62%2C-5.74&Largeham=-6.25%2C-6.51&GF=-1.25%2C1.54&Fasces=3.75%2C-2.51&Fasces%21=8.19%2C6.27&RayN=-1.25%2C-1.74&Dan-I-am=-3.38%2C-0.41&Podium=-5.88%2C-2.26&Sean=-6.88%2C-5.18&Dejan0707=-8.12%2C-3.28&Putin33=-9.75%2C0.10&Jack=-4.25%2C-6.21&Figle=-0.62%2C-1.44&Ghost=9.25%2C-3.85&Tolstoy=.88%2C-5.23&Hellenic+Riot=-7.75%2C2.21&TBroadley=-4.75%2C-3.85&Katsarephat=-1.25%2C-5.44&Fathersnitch=-2.88%2C-3.18&Mrlentz=1.25%2C-5.44&Scagga=-2.5%2C0.72&newname=alamothe&newec=-1.5&newsoc=-5.38

Some bloody stupid questions in this...

"An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth."

I strongly disagree because if someone takes my eye, then the punishment should be rather more severe (hanging, for example). Someone else may strongly disagree because they believe in turning the other cheek. Yet both answers score the same...