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TheGhostmaker (1545 D)
05 Jul 11 UTC
GFDT Final finished
Not sure if its my place to post this as just a player, but Trustme, Crazyter and bockman have drawn the GFDT final.
gameID=56094
Congrats to them.
6 replies
Open
President Eden (2750 D)
05 Jul 11 UTC
EOG: WTA Anon Gunboat-2
gameID=63100

Game's not technically over, but nothing can be done now, so here we go.
7 replies
Open
Mafialligator (239 D)
05 Jul 11 UTC
If I didn't know better I wouldn't believe this.
If I didn't know that QI has a reasonably good research team, I'd say they were wrong about this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8E7wgFcCefE
20 replies
Open
Thucydides (864 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
Want to look over my essay and give me criticism? If so thanks
The prompt is - is the decline of the West inevitable?
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Thucydides (864 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
The following is an essay I have written for an essay contest, the prompt is above. I welcome thoughts and criticism, especially because I feel that I've actually done a really bad job. Lol. Much appreciated, everyone who reads.

---
The Decline of the West and the Rise of Davos Man

A brief perusal of historical trends reveals one overarching theme – what goes up, must come down. Every rise is accompanied by a later fall. So since the West, as a whole, has risen to great heights in the past few centuries, must it also fall? Of course the answer is yes, unless an irrational exceptionalism is to be employed. But this type of “we are immune” exceptionalism usually only thrives at the peak of a group’s power. American exceptionalism, for instance, was par for the course in the mid 1990s, at the peak of American power after the end of the Cold War. These days such an attitude seems foolishly optimistic and passé in most circles.

Some might object that a decline of American power is not the same as the decline of the West. They would surely be right to say so. However, if “the West” is broadly defined as the countries of Europe plus the US, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand, then it is clear that the decline is not only inevitable, but has already begun. It is at present fashionable to be skeptical of the Western model of the liberal democracy and the free market system after the global financial crisis and unparalleled economic success of authoritarian China. But these events may have only served to open the eyes of the world to the reality: Western power has already peaked. The reasons are manifold, and are not the issue at hand. All that need be done is demonstrate that Western power is waning, and is not likely to rebound. And this task is relatively simple.

Financial instability, aging populations, uncompetitive workforces, maladapted, overextended, or irrelevant armed forces, and historical enmity with the non-Western world are all working against the West today. But perhaps more important than the decline of Western power in an absolute sense is the its decline in a relative sense, when compared to the rest of the world. The emerging markets of what was once called the Third World are fast making this nomenclature obsolete. The growth of China and India has captivated the world, and though cooler heads point out the areas where they still lag far behind the West, this misses the point. What is remarkable at a macro level about the rapid growth of non-Western economies is that for the first time since the rise of the West, people besides Westerners have been significantly empowered.

When the West had full control over the world, it mattered little what an Indian or Brazilian thought of the world order. Now, though, these countries and others like them are growing, are powerful, and are democracies. It now does matter what these kinds of people think. The West is still powerful and controls much, but it controls less and less as time passes.

The first clear evidence of this gradual decline came in the world wars of the twentieth century and the Great Depression. These calamities affected the whole world, but the West, as the controller of the world, paid the most dearly. Following this closely was a mass decolonization of former empires. Political independence for most of the world meant that the remaining modes of control the West used were less obvious and less direct. The West, in effect, went from controlling most of the world to merely influencing most of the world (mostly through economics).

But now even this influence is waning. There is surely still a great deal of influence exerted by Western multinational corporations, but these groups increasingly less represent “the West” than they represent the new masters of the world – the global elite.

This calls attention to the question that naturally follows when the question “is the decline of the West inevitable?” is answered in the affirmative: “Who will take its place?” Historically, the decline of one group led eventually to a new group taking the reins of power. My argument is that this will still occur, but in a new and unique way. Instead of the new dominant group being unified by geographical location and association with a region or group of states, the dominant group that will direct the world’s affairs is the new “global elite,” unified by status, not geography.

Hailing from no particular region of the globe, this elite will be composed of leaders from the West, from the emerging markets, and from every corner of the world. The prerequisite for entry into this group of decision-makers is being powerful. In this sense “the West” will continue to exert considerable influence on the direction of the world in that many of these powerful people will come from Western countries, but this distinction of “the West and the rest” will become ever more irrelevant.

This is because these global elites will have (and already do have) more in common with each other than they do with the ordinary people of their own countries, in what approaches an emergent “elite culture.” This phenomenon has not gone unnoticed by commentators; Samuel Huntington has gone as far as coining a term for this kind of person: “Davos Man.” Beyond cosmetic commonalities like dress, language and lifestyle, which are no doubt important, there are important similarities in the worldview of these people.

All are committed to the idea of the “global order,” and, to a large extent, free market capitalism, in the form of economic growth. There are and will always be cosmetic differences between these people, but at the end of the day they will continue to manage the entire world as a whole.

This is different from a multi-polar prediction for the world system, because the multi-polar model ignores the who and how of the world’s power structures. Though on a state-by-state level the multi-polar model will surely be most accurate, it would be an oversimplification not to acknowledge who it is that is actually running the world within the framework of the multi-polarity – the global elite.

This is not to say that there will no longer be competition between actors in the world just as there is now, and it is not to say that the old ideas of “the West” and so on will evaporate into thin air. These dividing lines will still exist, but will be in practice far less significant than the overarching concerns of globalization, growth, stability, and so on.

Therefore, to fully answer the question on the inevitability of the decline of the West, one must examine the rise of this global elite. The answer to the question is, then, yes, though the decline will be partial and give way to a new system unlike the balance of power of the past.

In some sense, the West helped to create this globalized world with its emerging elite, and the common outlook held by these powerful people has been in large part shaped by Western ways of thinking. In this sense the West will always be an important part of the global fabric, but that comes as no surprise. The impact of the British Empire is still felt today – indeed the Roman Empire’s legacy continues to be apparent in the modern world. This would not stop anyone from being confident that these powers have declined, just as the West will decline. In its place: a cosmopolitan class of the world’s rich and powerful, with a common culture of sorts, will direct the world’s affairs.
ezpickins (113 D)
05 Jul 11 UTC
Interesting, but you focus more on the Elite and less on the reason for decline
Thucydides (864 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
do you think i should focus on that? i didnt interpret that as part of the question
Thucydides (864 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
or i guess i took it for granted because in my opinion the decline of anything is inevitable. maybe you're right though what might you recommend instead?
ezpickins (113 D)
05 Jul 11 UTC
i think you should talk more about how every empire is bound to decline, what external factors precipitate every decline and other stuff. you can talk about what comes next, but not as much.
spyman (424 D(G))
05 Jul 11 UTC
How do you define the west's decline? Do simply you mean its power/wealth/knowledge etc *relative* to the East. Thus even if the West continues to increase the fact that rate of growth in the East is higher, means, by definition, that the west is declining.
Or do you mean that the West is declining (or is soon to decline) in *absolute* terms as it did towards the end of the Roman Empire and into the early Middle Ages.
obiwanobiwan (248 D)
05 Jul 11 UTC
I shall mosty certainly read that!

...

RIGHT after the Mets game! ;)
Mafialligator (239 D)
05 Jul 11 UTC
"brief perusal" is an oxymoron. Peruse, contrary to popular belief, actually means to read or examine carefully and thoroughly.

More generally the first sentence is problematic because I think it's an assertion you can't necessarily support, you can say that which goes up is likely to come down, but that is of course not a very bold statement.

"The West, in effect, went from controlling most of the world to merely influencing most of the world (mostly through economics)." the word most, or some form thereof appears to many times in this sentence. I'd recommend saying primarily through economics and that doesn't need to be a parenthetical aside. Commas are enough to separate it from the main body of the sentence.

I hope these don't seem overly nitpicky. Grammar and stuff is important in essays too.
Mafialligator (239 D)
05 Jul 11 UTC
Wow. I make a post correcting your grammar and it's full of grammar mistakes. Ugh. I'm an idiot.
ezpickins (113 D)
05 Jul 11 UTC
but the subject is the most important part...
☺ (1304 D)
05 Jul 11 UTC
"A brief perusal of historical trends reveals one overarching theme – what goes up, must come down"

I really dislike this point and feel like it can be pretty easily refuted. It really turns me off your essay to open with it. We're living in such novel times. Human knowledge and ability is growing exponentially, and it's easily argued that we're approaching the singularity. I think it's a laughably blatant fallacy to generalize from history to the present so directly like that. We're living in a new age. But your professor (I'm assuming a humanities professor will read this...) probably isn't the type to believe in the singularity, so go ahead.

---------

"Of course the answer is yes, unless an irrational exceptionalism is to be employed"

Then you proceed to insult me. :-P Not exactly making me like your paper here. :-)

----------

"It is at present fashionable to be skeptical of the Western model of the liberal democracy and the free market system after the global financial crisis and unparalleled economic success of authoritarian China"

I feel like this is incredibly fallacious: For one, many, *many* people (myself among them) argue that this was caused by the *government*, not markets. It's largely a tangent, but there exists quite a good argument that the crisis would not have happened without intervention and incentivation from the Federal Reserve. Furthermore, China's success has come by adopting *more* free market reforms - so much so that it could easily be argued that China's market is freer than the United States. Of course, again, I'm probably not your intended audience, and if your professor is a liberal academic, he's likely to lap up exactly what you're saying. :-)

--------------

"The West, in effect, went from controlling most of the world to merely influencing most of the world (mostly through economics)."

I'd change the second "most of the world" to a simple "it". That's the third time you've used "most of the world" in two sentences.

--------

"This phenomenon has not gone unnoticed by commentators; Samuel Huntington has gone as far as coining a term for this kind of person: “Davos Man.”"

I don't think that adds much to the paragraph, but this is kind of a minor point.

------------

"All are committed to the idea of the “global order,” and, to a large extent, free market capitalism, in the form of economic growth."

I don't disagree with this (or this part of the paper) at all, but it seems to contradict your earlier point you were making about liberal democracy and free markets being untenable.

---------

I liked the second half much more than the first, I think largely because of our political differences. If your professor agrees with you, I don't think you'll have a problem. I agree completely that the west will collapse. (And it just seems wrong to have an essay about it's collapse without a discussion of the economics behind the national debt and the rampant inflation we'll have.) But my approach would be more along the lines of what is largely attributed to have been said by Lord Alexander Tytler, but whose author is really unknown, "A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship."
☺ (1304 D)
05 Jul 11 UTC
"Interesting, but you focus more on the Elite and less on the reason for decline "

That was kind of my observation as well, but I thought you tied the two sufficiently together at the end.
orathaic (1009 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
"I feel like this is incredibly fallacious: For one, many, *many* people (myself among them) argue that this was caused by the *government*, not markets."

just on this point, who controls the governments? who makes the parties make their economic decisions? do they listen to advice from their economists, do the advisers have a personal stake in things? Or does a democracy simply listen to the will of the people (leaving it up to the economists to communicate the needs of the economy in plain language to the people...)

i guess you can see where i'm going with this. But you are basically saying the economists got it wrong, and that you have been convinced by another economist (or indeed that you are an economist yourself) That infact economists/'advisers' have convinced a 'great many' people of this position does not make it correct.

I'm not saying the government was blameless, i'm saying that influential people advised the people and the government and they happen to disagree with each other...

this may be the 'new elite' fighting with each other over government policy... of course i'm just taking this from a hypothetical stand point... a lot of things are 'possible' without being necessarily.

still i question most narratives which simplify the 'economic collapse'
Thucydides (864 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
I appreciate the stylistic pointers too so no worries about that all criticism is welcome.

And yes spyman decline can mean both absolute and relative, i address that and think it would be some combination, probably mostly relative.

@ smiley - every age sees itself as unique, also, there is considerable evidence that the west is already declining. do you think that i should spend more time proving that the west is declining?

but i agree perhaps the wording could be changed to be a bit more accommodating :)

re: the "China model" i'm not at all saying that this is true... i'm just pointing out that there are a quite a lot of people now promulgating that view. you don't necessarily have to be one of them. thus i wasn't making a point about democracy and free markets not working, i was just saying that people today sometimes say that.

how do you think i could clarify that?

the sentence on davos man is basically to give credit where credit is due since huntington seems to have arrived at my basic conclusion several years ago.

so are you also saying, smiley, that i should spend more time on the reasons for the west's decline and the evidence that it is declining?
Thucydides (864 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
also can we pretty plox keep the actual debate of this question... to other threads? i'm happy to discuss it lol... just... you know. OP and all.
orathaic (1009 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
As for the inevitable fall of the west.

In many ways the economic prosperity of the other nations of the world does indeed mean a loss of relative power by the west. Just as the 'western' powers lost the ability to control votes in the UN general assembly when decolonization lead to ~100 new nations each with an equal vote/say - this was balanced by the US's ability to effectively veto any decision by threatening to cut funding...

However other trends have become more obvious, the EU has demonstrated the nation states can better benefit from co-operation than competition. This has lead to attempts to emulate it in different regional organisations. The adoption of 'western' economic strategies can hardly be seen as a decline, the cultural values of 'the west' have spread to all corners of the globe, and their success across the world has lead to this 'relative decline'.

Perhaps another economic strategy will enable greater prosperity, and whichever country adopts it first will gain a distinct advantage. (and China's authoritarian/political control within a largely free market, might well be an example) However the world will continue as before, and adopt new strategies as they are demonstrated to be successful...

there is no single trend which will describe precisely or accurately the rise of the BLANK an the decline of western democracies. The Arab spring is an example that amply demonstrates the inherent instability of any system which suppresses democracy. 'Western' ideals of democracy and freedom will continue to spread, and whatever form the new global order takes the impact of 'western' power will not be forgotten.
orathaic (1009 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
not debating jsut trying to get my view point across, it is more neutral than any newspaper headline you might read about 'the decline of the west'
orathaic (1009 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
also: http://hermitology.com/post/7229786297/not-so-random-start-america-fuck-yeah
Thucydides (864 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
Re: giving reasons for the decline.

I really don't think the onus is actually on me to speculate about why the West is declining, I think I do need to prove that it actually is though. Do you disagree?

Re: orathaic's point on western influence, I agree western influence on the world system and culture will be enduring, i mention that in the last paragraph. but do think it wont be long before it would become incorrect to maintain that the west rules the world - this statement is less true every day. in my paper i sought to answer the question - who will rule the world instead? and my idea is: the global elite.
orathaic (1009 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
who will rule the world instead is an interesting question, but i don't think the nation states are going to fail to oppose this rising power.
☺ (1304 D)
05 Jul 11 UTC
"every age sees itself as unique, also, there is considerable evidence that the west is already declining. do you think that i should spend more time proving that the west is declining?"

I don't disagree the west is declining - I absolutely think it is. But I think it is for different reasons, and I don't think you've adequately established that it's declining for the reasons you've said.

"so are you also saying, smiley, that i should spend more time on the reasons for the west's decline and the evidence that it is declining? "

I think so, yes. That seems to be the prompt. The evidence that it is, not the reasons. My thesis would not be that it's inevitable, but that it is already happening. (I still think it can be reversed through drastic measures though. Ron Paul 2012!)

"re: the "China model" i'm not at all saying that this is true... i'm just pointing out that there are a quite a lot of people now promulgating that view. you don't necessarily have to be one of them. thus i wasn't making a point about democracy and free markets not working, i was just saying that people today sometimes say that.

how do you think i could clarify that?"

I think you should change "it is fashionable" to "it is commonly argued that". The latter provides far less opinion. "Fashionable", in my opinion, associates a positive connotation and agreement.

But beyond that, I'm confused why you would mention this if you didn't agree with it. In the context of the paragraph it seems to be offered for the truth of the matter asserted, supporting the claim that the west is in decline.
☺ (1304 D)
05 Jul 11 UTC
Haha. I just found this. Haven't read it yet, but I thought I'd post it:

http://lesswrong.com/lw/h3/superstimuli_and_the_collapse_of_western/
spyman (424 D(G))
05 Jul 11 UTC
"And yes spyman decline can mean both absolute and relative, i address that and think it would be some combination, probably mostly relative."

Relatively, yes the West is declining compared with the East.
Absolutely - I would say that just about everywhere is rising and that this is due to ever increasing technological growth.
If we compared today's western civilization with the Roman Empire, technology was declining during late antiquity. That is definitely not happening today and nor does it appear likely in the foreseeable future.
Thus rather than speaking of decline I think future historians will look back at this period as one of extraordinary growth and not decline.
Thucydides (864 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
I actually think fashionable connotes the fickleness and fad nature of this new China-gazing... I was implying without saying that it jumps the gun a bit.

However I really don't think it would be wise or within the prompt to attempt to offer an explanation for the reasons of the west's decline. I agree that I should probably offer more evidence that it is declining and will continue to, but I feel no compulsion to explain why - that's another quesiton. Do you disagree?

Which is why I will mostly skip all the speculation about - was it overspending, is it cultural, is it capitalism, democracy... etc

Maybe if I change the order, to this:

"Some might object that a decline of American power is not the same as the decline of the West. They would surely be right to say so. However, if “the West” is broadly defined as the countries of Europe plus the US, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand, then it is clear that the decline is not only inevitable, but has already begun. There is a growing realization in the West: Western power has already peaked. Indeed, it is at present fashionable to be skeptical of the Western model of the liberal democracy and the free market system after the global financial crisis and unparalleled economic success of authoritarian China. However, the reasons for the West's decline are surely manifold, and are not the issue at hand. All that need be done is demonstrate that Western power is waning, and is not likely to rebound. And this task is relatively simple."

seem better?
Thucydides (864 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
i also agree spyman that the *world* is growing, this is my point about a transcendent global elite instead of a particular region holding dominance. but the west sure is declining in that it does not exert the influence it once did, and will exert even less in the future.
Tettleton's Chew (0 DX)
05 Jul 11 UTC

Democracy has fallen? Democracy began in Athens 2,500 years ago and has disappeared? The core political value of the West has fallen? Rising standards of leaving have fallen in the west? Someone is going to argue that the standard of living in the west has fallen? Women's freedom in the West has risen and fallen? Free speech has fallen in the West? Can someone name a time when the common man enjoyed more freedom.

Democracy, freedom of speech, women's rights, and rising standards of living.
The four core principles of western civilization on are on the march and spreading to the rest of the world and someone's essay contains a thesis that the the fall of the West is inevitable.
Balderdash.
The core principles of Western Civilization are stronger than ever before.
The people of the world riot to have access to the core principles of the west.
The Arab spring wants a democratic voice in government.
Individuals want freedom of speech.
Women want an end to patriarchy.
Everyone wants to improve their standard of living.
The West is thriving as never before, and the rest of the world clamors for the gifts of Western civilization.
Democracy, rising standards of living, free speech, and women's rights.
Thucydides (864 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
Standards of living in Western countries are going down in large part.

I am not saying the world is going to erupt into chaos - but the West will never again be as hegemonic as it once was and will only continue to be less so for the foreseeable future.
"Democracy has fallen? Democracy began in Athens 2,500 years ago and has disappeared? "

Yes and surely it has had an uninterrupted reign since.

surely your expertise in history suggests that no other eras of progress have been abruptly interrupted by decline.
and if you want my criticism, this reeks of a poly sci brand of determinism, but I guess you can only do as well as your question
Tettleton's Chew (0 DX)
05 Jul 11 UTC
I completely disagree Thucydides.
The West is a set of ideas not a set of nations who enjoy hegemony.
The Golden Age of Athens ended, but the philosophical reasoning of Socrates lived on, Hippocrates theory of medicine survived, the biting satire of Athenian playwrights is still with us, as well as the idea of democracy.

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68 replies
☺ (1304 D)
06 Jul 11 UTC
☻☺☻☻ EOG
39 replies
Open
Geofram (130 D(B))
06 Jul 11 UTC
Alternative Tip for the Mute Feature
Some of you may have already thought of this, but reading the chat history just got a whole lot easier. Particularly in public press, muting everyone but the person you want to read makes life a lot easier.
3 replies
Open
Riphen (198 D)
06 Jul 11 UTC
Can anything be done against someone?
Who seems to play a lot of games with Friends. I believe they are different people but always seem to work together. Not going to post the people, I just want to know if there can be anything done. If people just work together in every game then that screws over everyone else.
1 reply
Open
trip (696 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
I like french fried taters...
...mmm hmm.
39 replies
Open
President Eden (2750 D)
05 Jul 11 UTC
Orders not loading
gameID=63129
Live game, dunno if anyone can do anything about it...
6 replies
Open
Thucydides (864 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
Whoaaa The Economist writing about the Harry Ransom Center.
I live across the street, wish I could have seen Prospero. Lol.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/prospero/2011/06/harry-ransom-center?fsrc=scn/tw/te/bl/collectingwithavengeance
2 replies
Open
Draugnar (0 DX)
05 Jul 11 UTC
In honor of my country's birthday...
I challenge all US citizens to give just 1 hour's gross pay to the site. I did a bit more, but I have the means. Got a job, join me and make KestasI day!
7 replies
Open
Patriot (0 DX)
05 Jul 11 UTC
What is the speaker all about ?
What is the Speaker about ?
6 replies
Open
dexter morgan (225 D(S))
03 Jul 11 UTC
Schrödinger's Rapist
How to flirt with women in a culture of male privilege and female vulnerability and still be a decent human being
or A guy’s guide to approaching strange women without being maced
50 replies
Open
Maniac (189 D(B))
05 Jul 11 UTC
Hurry, Hurry, Hurry - 2 more places available
0 replies
Open
President Eden (2750 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
Putting out an APB for resident Diplomacy badasses / July GR Challenge
I hope July GRs don't bite me in the ass for this, but I doubt they will so I'll go ahead and make the announcement with some time to spare.
119 replies
Open
zultar (4180 DMod(P))
05 Jul 11 UTC
Live Gunboat-106 EOG
By Germany. My first EOG. Be gentle.
14 replies
Open
obiwanobiwan (248 D)
04 Jul 11 UTC
Happy Barbeque, Baseball, and Beer Day (Oh, and It's Also Independence Day)
Well, technically, I still have 2 hours and 4 minutes before I'm "independent," so I guess I'm British for the next two hours--well, I wanted tea anyway, alright--so, yeah...but I'm already hearing fireworks, and it's time on the East Coast, so why not...

Happy Independence Day Everyone! A (Apologies to everyone across the Pond...) :p
17 replies
Open
The Czech (40297 D(S))
05 Jul 11 UTC
EOGS gameID=63073
Post em if you got em.
5 replies
Open
President Eden (2750 D)
04 Jul 11 UTC
Is it just me, or are there a lot of 500 errors running around lately?
See topic title -- is someone else on Dreamhost hogging all the resources or something? Am I crazy? (Strike that -- I am -- am I just seeing things?)
17 replies
Open
Thucydides (864 D(B))
04 Jul 11 UTC
Austro-Hungaryis finally eliminated IRL
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-14019319

Took, what, 221 turns?
2 replies
Open
JaborX2 (108 D)
04 Jul 11 UTC
noobs on default map. :D
http://www.webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=63054
0 replies
Open
TheGhostmaker (1545 D)
04 Jul 11 UTC
National History Museum, London, Land's End to John O'Groats Cycle
This September I and two friends will be cycling from Land's End (the extreme South Westerly point of mainland UK) to John O' Groats (the extreme North Easterly point) in an attempt to raise money for this charity. We have just started to try to get people to donate.
2 replies
Open
Ursa (1617 D)
04 Jul 11 UTC
Diplomacy World #114 now available!
See inside for more details and links.
3 replies
Open
fulhamish (4134 D)
04 Jul 11 UTC
Age of Greed: The Triumph of Finance and the Decline of America, 1970 to the Present
I haven't yet read the eponymous book, however, there is an excellent review of it in this month's New York Review of Books. A very coherent argument is put that it is indeed greedy bankers (sensu lato) who have chiefly got the world in this financial mess and much else besides. Moreover, those who blame various foreigners and their companies for the mess America is in are barking up the wrong tree.
4 replies
Open
☺ (1304 D)
04 Jul 11 UTC
ever heard of plato, arstle, scrts? morons. EOG
gameID=62965

Inside
14 replies
Open
mr_brown (302 D(B))
03 Jul 11 UTC
Question regarding to winning
Do you win instantly when your troops touchdown on that 18th center or do you need to hold it until after the fall turn?

In the one game that I've won so far, I gained the 18th on the fall turn, yet this one guy who lost his last center was not eliminated, but survived with 0 SC, 1 unit.
17 replies
Open
Mr Smith (402 D)
04 Jul 11 UTC
Fleets swapping coasts
Does anyone know if the following moves will work given they utilise different coasts or will the units simply not move as Spain is treated as one location?

F MAO - Spa (NC); F Spa (SC) - MAO
15 replies
Open
☺ (1304 D)
04 Jul 11 UTC
This game is called "Diplomacy" for a reason! EOG
gameID=62973

Inside
35 replies
Open
President Eden (2750 D)
04 Jul 11 UTC
This game is called "Diplomacy" for a reason! EOGs
I'm assuming that y'all are going to draw after the Enclave's last stand in Edinburgh got (gets) snuffed out, so I'm getting this ready.
8 replies
Open
obiwanobiwan (248 D)
02 Jul 11 UTC
What's This New "Mute Player" Option?
What...we can have voice chat now or something? :p

(Or maybe it's the Obi-Silencer?) ;)
5 replies
Open
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