What age can you be conscripted then? I tought 18 and you can also drink from 18.

But if you get conscripted in the US you can then drink on military bases.

Is the age at which you're legally in military service (I might not use the right words in this case, please say if that's the case) 17 in the US too, while alcohol can be bought from 18? That's the case in the Netherlands. I'm actually not even 17 yet and I got a letter saying I'm in inactive service (if that's right).

I ask because you make it sound like the privileges and responsibilities come at the same time in the US but that seems contradicting so I'm confused.

That was to Draugnar although I don't care who answers.

Actually, they changed that, jmo. The drinking age in the service is the se as the drinking age in the state the army base is located in with a few exceptions.

http://usmilitary.about.com/od/justicelawlegislation/a/drinkingage.htm

And, no, you have to be 18 to be active duty or, theoretically, if the draft returned. You can enlist under a deferment at 17, but must be 18 before you go to boot and cam back out at any time I believe before you turn 18 as the courts don't recognize contracts entered into at 18 as legal and binding.

And the drinking age is generally 21 here.

It's amazing how much people think they know about the US. 21 is the drinking age. 18 is the earliest you can go to boot camp and is the same as the voting age.

I see. Well, I looked up the draft thing and it's the same here, except it's all males between 17 and 35 (and you would serve up to 45).

"It's amazing how much people think they know about the US. 21 is the drinking age."

Not me, if you were talking to me. I actually thought it was 21 which just added to the confusion. Now I look again though, I completely understand your first reply.

So anyway, I could be conscripted in theory but I can't vote. Would you agree that's unfair?

Depending on what would be the cause, there's a decent chance I would immediately desert I suppose. Can't force me to fight.

Want world peace? Solution is simple: mass desertion.

I was talking about the Netherlands since the OP was refering to that ;)
The drinking age is 18 here. (since this year it was 16 before that).

You wont be drafted in the netherlands ;)
And no, deserting is a crime. However in the past when you could be drafted you could say no based on moral believes. But I`m pretty sure desertion is a crime.

Ah, steephie had asked about the US ages. Sorry for the confusion on my part.

And yes, conscription when you can't even cote for your representation should be a human rights violation along the lines of slavery. Of course, you could just refuse to carry you rifle and refuse to train. Be a disgruntled and unwilling soldier inciting others to rebel and they'll kick you out for sure.

Steephie - don't register if you don't want to be dragged in.

Hey Bo, do you have a driver's license? Are you registered to vote? Then you are registered for selective service. All states send you info to the SS when you get or renew a license or register to vote if you are between 18 and 25. You might be OK on the license if you got it before you turned 18, but you get your info sent when you registered to vote.

Yeah, they have my info. I have a SSN, so they have it whenever they want. I am quite aware.

For some reason Social Security doesn't share... Something to do with not having your explicit permission as you were a juvenile (baby I presume), but the license bureaus as well as the paperwork for registering all have the information in the fine print.

Then they know I exist - whatever. I see no relevance.

Then you're registered, bo_sox, that's the point.

I just got a letter saying that I needed to be notified by law that I could in theory be conscripted. Weird part is that I'm 17 in about half a year, but the letter says I'm in inactive service now.

So I can't choose to not register. I'm not even supposed to react to the letter. They simply informed me.

@Krediax: "You wont be drafted in the netherlands ;)
And no, deserting is a crime. However in the past when you could be drafted you could say no based on moral believes. But I`m pretty sure desertion is a crime."

But if you have to join, not joining is desertion, right? You're enlisted and you refuse to do your job, right?

Seriously though, if I would get called to arms today, because the UN declares war on Russia or whatever, I either do nothing if possible or leave the country. If I can't do either of those things I'll find some hiding place.
That's because I don't know who I'd rather shoot in that case: the Russians or my fellow countrymen.
And I thought of studying abroad anyway.

All hypothetical of course, but the moment a draft starts I don't want to be associated with my country. I owe it less than it owes me. Conscripting me goes too far. Then I'd rather die fighting against than for my country.

Desertion might officially be a crime, but at that point I think it's a good thing to stand up against the crime of conscription.

Thankfully, that's still all hypothetical.

Conscription age in the Netherlands is 16, steephie so the letter arrived on time. But there is no compulsory attendance, the Dutch army is fully professional. Nobody expects you to show up anywhere no matter the situation. The 17 years thing you found is probably the age from which you can join voluntary service.

So stop throwing a tantrum at a hypothetical strawman. Just because webDip is full of those doesn't mean we need more ;)

The thought occurs that if the Netherlands ever reached the stage that conscripting the likes of steephie seemed a good idea, they have already lost.

I do actually have some sympathy for the sentiment, though. I was sent a jury duty letter that said unless I had a damned good reason not to go I must do so or get a massive fine. Now I'm the sort of person who'd enjoy jury service, but the threat to force me to go grated somewhat.

So much so that when they gave us all a customer satisfaction form at the end of it my response was "I am not your fucking customer. I am here because if not you would steal my fucking money and fuck up my life, you bastards".

What really strikes me as odd with the new alcohol law in The Netherlands is that you're not allowed to buy it anymore when you're under 18, but you're still allowed to sell it when you're under 18. That is just....weird.

@ulytau: "Conscription age in the Netherlands is 16, steephie so the letter arrived on time. But there is no compulsory attendance, the Dutch army is fully professional. Nobody expects you to show up anywhere no matter the situation. The 17 years thing you found is probably the age from which you can join voluntary service.

So stop throwing a tantrum at a hypothetical strawman. Just because webDip is full of those doesn't mean we need more ;)"

I translate the important part of the letter I received for you in special:

"With this letter I inform you that you are registered for military service. However, you don't have to enter service, because the Netherlands (not plural in Dutch) doesn't have an active military service anymore. Since 1997 the Netherlands has a professional army and no one is called into service.
So you don't have to react to this letter.

Why do you receive this letter?
According to [a law] everyone who gets registered for military service needs to receive a personal letter about this. [registration number crap]. Because you don't have to enter military service, you will not be inspected.

Why are you registered?
Every Dutch man between 17 and 35 is registered for military service. Only in very exceptional situations the government and parliament could decide to call (hard to translate that correctly) conscripts again for military service.
This would be to the maximum age of 45.

THE MINISTER OF DEFENCE"

Some words don't have exact English counterparts so that may get confusing but I wanted to translate every word so you can't blame me for misunderstanding.

So stop throwing a tantrum at a hypothetical strawman. Just because webDip is full of those doesn't mean we need more ;)

@Octavious: "The thought occurs that if the Netherlands ever reached the stage that conscripting the likes of steephie seemed a good idea, they have already lost."

That counts pretty much equally for every country I can think of. Still, I can think of different situations where it would be an arguably reasonable option.

For example, a lot of our professionals quit and the UN insists we send troops to some operation.

Thanks for the sympathy though :)

steephie, I agree getting the conscription letter when you're not yet allowed to vote is ridiculous.
You're comparatively lucky though, in Finland we have big bad Russia next door, so they require us to actually show up and either train or go to civil service. Apparently Russia's not scary enough to require conscript women though.

@Hunebed: "What really strikes me as odd with the new alcohol law in The Netherlands is that you're not allowed to buy it anymore when you're under 18, but you're still allowed to sell it when you're under 18. That is just....weird."

That might be true, although I don't know, but you're not allowed to carry alcohol in places that can be publicly accessed, so realistically you need people above 18 when selling alcohol legally, and not just people above 18 to buy it.

I see your point though, since most people would have to buy alcohol before selling it. I see no harm though, and perhaps someone below 18 inherits alcohol and wants to sell it in his house or something, with which I see no problem.

@Gtlblx:

True...
I wouldn't mind getting trained though, that could be quite useful. It's when you get called to war when the trouble starts...

Do the people in civil service have to join the army when war breaks out? I don't know the details there.

You received the letter because the conscription law (Kaderwet Dienstplicht) explicitly states that the letter is supposed to be send on the 1st February to every Dutch man who will reach 17 that year - by your admission, that applies to you.

I think the more relevant question is : The Dutch have an army?
I suspect if anyone invaded the Dutch, the war would be over before it even made the 24 hour news networks.
I wouldnt worry about it Steephie...

"I think the more relevant question is : The Dutch have an army?
I suspect if anyone invaded the Dutch, the war would be over before it even made the 24 hour news networks.
I wouldnt worry about it Steephie..."

I suspect if anyone considered invading the Dutch, they'd quickly change their mind.

Therefore, we don't need an army that beats other armies. We need an army that supplements the UN among many other armies.