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A place to discuss topics/games with other webDiplomacy players.
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tvrocks (388 D)
17 Nov 16 UTC
(+6)
I've come up with a great idea to revitalize the site and expand the fanbase.
It's called Webdip The Musical. It would be much more interesting than adding new maps or new features and might also allow people to rant about their political opinions in a way that's easier to ignore. I have contacted the mods and several have agreed to donate glitter.

Another potential idea is mafia the musical.
39 replies
Open
yassem (2533 D)
21 Nov 16 UTC
High-dimensional covarianve matrices.
Can anyone explain to me how come an HD covariance matrix estimated on the sample is unbiased, but its inverse is?
yassem (2533 D)
21 Nov 16 UTC
Or maybe recommend literature on the subject?
Hellenic Riot (1626 D(G))
21 Nov 16 UTC
(+3)
No
orathaic (1009 D(B))
21 Nov 16 UTC
Even if you could explain what all of thise words mean, i still think i could only second HR.

But i might ask, what is the difference between a high dimensional matrix and a tensor?
Valis2501 (2850 D(G))
21 Nov 16 UTC
CSteinhardt could. I don't know if he would.
yassem (2533 D)
21 Nov 16 UTC
I hope he'll stumble on this thread and decide he's bored enough to spare some time on it...
Lethologica (203 D)
21 Nov 16 UTC
It sounds like the question is incomplete, anyway. Are you asking why the inverse of a covariance matrix "isn't [unbiased]," or something else?
zultar (4180 DMod(P))
21 Nov 16 UTC
(+2)
Your question is rather incomplete, so it needs to be clarified substantially before anyone can help you (if there is anyone to help since this is rather a specific subfield of statistics and econometrics).

I do have some resources that may be helpful but they are rather dense and I suspect way above what you are asking for, but here ya go:

ftp://ftp.aefweb.net/WorkingPapers/w516.pdf

http://www-stat.wharton.upenn.edu/~tcai/paper/Covariance-Survey.pdf

https://arxiv.org/pdf/1105.4292.pdf
fiedler (1293 D)
22 Nov 16 UTC
(+1)
Measure of precision vs measure of dispersion. The more precise the more biased.
yassem (2533 D)
22 Nov 16 UTC
I think the question is rather complete. There exists a problem with evaluating high-dimensional covariance matrices. First of all, if the number of parameters is greater than the number of observations the matrix is singular (for reason I still am trying to understand, but at least for this I have material). There is however another problem - you sometimes need an inverse of the covariance matrix, for example in choosing optimal asset bundle. However, even though covariance matrix is not biased, its inverse is [biased], and the more dimensional the model, the bigger the bias. So, I would like to find some literature on the subject, because I would like to see the maths behind it.

@Zultar, thank you, this help a bit. The first paper is actually one I have to base my assignment on, the other ones look like they might help me, I'll get down to reading as soon as I get home.
orathaic (1009 D(B))
22 Nov 16 UTC
(+1)
So first, i'm learning here. A matrix is just a collection of numbers, higher dimensions is just more numbers. Covarianve is a relationship between numbers - so if a random selection of house prices going up is related to a random selection of incomes going ip, the covariances (between these two? Variables) would be positive. If the price of rice going up is relate to the price of meat sropping, then the covariance would be negative.

Thus a matrix could have the co-variances between house prices and income as the first element, the house prces and meat prices as the second, and the next row would be income and rice prices, followed by income and meat prives.

Right? (Fyi i believe that if you can't explain a thing, you don't understand it... And you haven't explained the problem very clearly but then you're only asking because you don't understand it)
yassem (2533 D)
22 Nov 16 UTC
You are quite right in most of what you wrote. But then it is a bit complicated. A covariance matrix is a matrix of covariances between all the variables in some multi-variate model, let's say the price of some 10 assets. Such matrix would be 10x10 matrix, with element in i-th row and j-th column being the covariange between i-th and j-th asset (Such matrix is symmetrical, because the covariance between i-th and j-th is the same as between j-th and i-th, and on the diagonal it has the variance of i-th asset).

So you have your assets, and you want to see if their prices are covariate. So you look at the prices for 100 days and count the covariance between each asset and put it all into a matrix. But that's not really good enough, because what you observed was just one, 100-day long realisation of a random process that generated the prices. So what you observed is just a sample, and you want to make some conclusions concerning the "population", so the real relations between the prices of the assets. The sample covariance matrix is an unbiased estimator, so whatever matrix you calculated on your sample you have no reason to believe it's actually smaller or larger then the true covariance. However, especially when you are dealing with a high-dimensional problem, so in this case you'd have relatively many assets to be evaluated with respect to number of observations, you run into some problems.

First of all, the covariance estimator has a HUGE variance, so even though you have no reason to believe that the true covariances are smaller or larger than what you calculated, you know that you are probably nowhere near the true covariance matrix.
Secondly, if number of assets is larger than the number of days you observed the pice the covariance matrix is singular, and you won't be able to calculate the inverse (the determinant of the matrix will be 0) - this is for reasons I have to find out yet.
But then if the number of assets is smaller, but still pretty large compared to the number of observations you end up with a highly biased inverse of the covariance matrix. If I understand correctly the numbers in the inverse tend to be larger than the true values.

I might have mixed up some stuff above though, I am just learning about it and I do find it pretty challenging to be honest.
yassem (2533 D)
22 Nov 16 UTC
And to be absolutely honest I haven't explained the problem because it is extremely specific, and I thought that whoever would be able to help me would have no problem understanding the question
yassem (2533 D)
22 Nov 16 UTC
Though I do realize that perhaps it might have been better to include some explanation.
orathaic (1009 D(B))
22 Nov 16 UTC
Much appreciation of the explaination. I think i understood that much better than any wikipedia article (or article from a typical journal/text book)

I'm now wondering about generating this for assets on the market in eve online... I think there are huge amounts of data available. Hmm, could be an interesting little project.
peterwiggin (15158 D)
22 Nov 16 UTC
I'm not sure I completely understand your question, but assuming you have a proper covariance function, shouldn't the covariance matrix be positive semi-definite and therefore non-singular, no matter the number of variables or the number of timepoints?
yassem (2533 D)
23 Nov 16 UTC
I honestly have such huge gaps in knowledge when it comes to matrices, but isn't it the case that the "semi-ness" in positive semi-definite is what gives the possibility for the matrix to be singular?

I honestly don't know how to explain this any better because I only now start to understand this, but it makes a bit of sense:
If you have the matrix Y of your data, that is p variables over n observation, its rank is at most min(p,n), so it does kind of make sense that when you calculate the covariance matrix its rank would be at most min(p,n). Nevertheless I still need to fully understand why. And since we have a situation where p>n, the covariance matrix is the size pxp, it has the rank of n which is smaller, it is not of full rank, it is singular.

But that isn't even the big problem that I have to solve - the bias of the inverse is what really puzzles me.
yassem (2533 D)
23 Nov 16 UTC
O yeeeaaaah, it makes sense once you consider the formula for the convariance matrix where you sum n times the difference between the vector of the i_th observation and the mean vector multiplied by the transpose of said difference. And if you add two matrices the rank of the sum is at most the sum of their ranks, so you end up with a matrix of rank at most n (because you sum n matrixes). Makes sense.

Still struggling with the bias though.
orathaic (1009 D(B))
24 Nov 16 UTC
I'm still struggling to understand how to work out the covariance of the ith and jth item.

X3n0n (216 D)
28 Nov 16 UTC
"First of all, if the number of parameters is greater than the number of observations the matrix is singular (for reason I still am trying to understand, but at least for this I have material). "

a singular matrix is a matrix that is not invertible (as in she has no twin by inversion therefore the name). a matrix is not invertible when she is not full rank. (it's a theorem). all of this only makes sense if we are talking about nxn-matrices. yet all covariance matrices are. such a matrix is not full rank if she does not contain at least n linearly independent column vectors. (another theorem)

now think about how your covariance matrix would be generated. and here it becomes hairy and your question incomplete. I can assume what you mean but it could be something completely different. Eg.: are the covariance matrices a categorical model or a continuous, gaussian or non-gaussian, errors or the actual variables, generated by some specific process or not...

@peter: the semi part is what actually makes this a problem.
X3n0n (216 D)
28 Nov 16 UTC
@yassem: there is no possibility to invert a non-fullrank matrix. hence no inverse. hence the way you phrased the problem really makes no sense.

Yet there is something else: you can fall back to a a so-called generalised inverse. there exist many different forms of it but they follow the general idea:

by construction we know that C is psd. => it's smallest eigenvalue l >= 0
by construction we know that C is not full rank => card{l =0} >= 1
by construction we know C = SDS^(-1) for some matrix S (eigenvalue decomposition), where D is diagonal and contains all eigenvalues of C
NOW we easily see that we can address the problem of eigenvalues by adding an identity matrix M multiplied a sufficiently large factor a to obtain the positive definite matrix C* = S(D+aM)S^(-1).
Now we can invert the matrix C* and use it for our statistical or other stuff.
But the introduction of the aM-term introduced a bias. This bias works differently on each dimension, depending on the absolute value of the eigenvalues.

As the inverse of the covariance matrix (in this case of the "regularised" C) is called the precision matrix is usually called precision matrix this term is here not the actual inverse of C (which does not exist) but of some biased C* and hence biased as well. I hope that helps to get your mind on the right spot. More I couldn't help without more information (and even this one was only under assumption of plausibility).
Lethologica (203 D)
28 Nov 16 UTC
Comments on covariance matrix singularity:
http://stats.stackexchange.com/questions/70899/what-correlation-makes-a-matrix-singular-and-what-are-implications-of-singularit


21 replies
President Eden (2750 D)
25 Nov 16 UTC
How do I fix the time desync for deadlines again?
I noticed a live game countdown (game failed to fire unfortunately) where I was a whole 30 seconds ahead of the game's phase deadlines. I remember there being a way to fix the desync but don't remember what it is. Anybody got me?
9 replies
Open
Jamiet99uk (898 D)
25 Nov 16 UTC
The Cards Against Humanity Holiday Hole
https://www.holidayhole.com/
4 replies
Open
Oztra (30 DX)
25 Nov 16 UTC
What exactly is a Mafia game?
Because I am doing one and don't really know what to do, so I figured you might be able to help me with things and stuff.
11 replies
Open
brainbomb (290 D)
24 Nov 16 UTC
(+2)
Happy Thanksgiving Webdip Community
I am thankful for this community. Cheers to everyone celebrating. If you arent celebrating, well... I dunno whats wrong with you.
14 replies
Open
brainbomb (290 D)
23 Nov 16 UTC
Computer scientists urge Clinton campaign to challenge election results
http://www.cnn.com/2016/11/22/politics/hillary-clinton-challenge-results/index.html
90 replies
Open
leon1122 (190 D)
23 Nov 16 UTC
Trump won 3 times as many Muslims as Romney
http://dailycaller.com/2016/11/22/cair-almost-three-times-more-muslims-voted-for-trump-than-for-romney/
19 replies
Open
Hauta (1618 D(S))
19 Nov 16 UTC
(+1)
"Fog of War" rules?
Any reason "Fog of War" rules don't exist as a New Game option? You know, where you can see only the territories that border your units. So on the first round, England sees only as far as North Sea, Norwegian, English Channel, Irish Sea but does not see anything in France...
11 replies
Open
Kakarroto (128 D)
23 Nov 16 UTC
Strange philosophical thought after a sleepless night.
Hey there, I had a strange thought crossing through my mind, after having an input from a series I'm watching right now. Let me explain a bit:
125 replies
Open
MajorMitchell (1874 D)
25 Nov 16 UTC
(+1)
Schoolies 2016
Hordes of schoolies are arriving in the little village by the sea where I live .. Am I overwhelmed by paroxysms of ecstatic joy ?
15 replies
Open
Doug7878 (1678 D(G))
25 Nov 16 UTC
England Needed. Gunboat. Spring '02. Good pot. 12 hour phases
0 replies
Open
Jamiet99uk (898 D)
24 Nov 16 UTC
Right-wing white nationalist guilty of murdering MP in terrorist attack
http://www.thenational.scot/news/14923549.Judge_hands_life_sentence_to_white_supremacist_terrorist_killer_of_Jo_Cox/
4 replies
Open
brainbomb (290 D)
24 Nov 16 UTC
(+2)
Even Stranger philosophical thought after sleepless night.
What if were all dead and webdip is Canto III of Dantes Inferno?
1 reply
Open
Condescension (10 D)
24 Nov 16 UTC
Private Game - 50 bet
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=185917
PM me for a password.
We're expecting a lot of activity from all players, please only play if you're committed to actually playing Diplomacy as a social game. One of my RL friends will be playing, we will try as much as possible not to find out one another's nations.
0 replies
Open
rosan663 (0 DX)
24 Nov 16 UTC
iTunes Password Backup Software
This post has been reverse silenced due to containing a virus filled link
3 replies
Open
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
23 Nov 16 UTC
(+1)
Trump breaks campaign promise to investigate Clinton
"Locking her up" was pretty central to Trump's campaign; two weeks after winning the election he's decided not to follow through. Are Trump supporters concerned about this? If not, why? And if he has already broken this promise (and others) then what faith do you have that he'll actually follow through on other promises?
56 replies
Open
Crazy Anglican (1067 D)
20 Nov 16 UTC
(+1)
Username smash up game
Take two or more usernames and smash 'em together.
121 replies
Open
VashtaNeurotic (2394 D)
18 Nov 16 UTC
(+10)
End the World! Petition.
Please +1 this post and/or reply if you want to see the World Map removed from the site.
17 replies
Open
Jamiet99uk (898 D)
20 Nov 16 UTC
Mike Pence goes to the theatre
Well Donald Trump and his team spent the election campaign proclaiming "safe spaces" was a liberal conspiracy aimed at shutting down debate...
56 replies
Open
BurntAlmond (100 D)
22 Nov 16 UTC
Players?
DSS, Anon, Classic. Come on down!

http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=185823
7 replies
Open
KingCyrus (511 D)
22 Nov 16 UTC
Best Tricks in the Book
Be it a favorite alliance, opening, or tactic, what are your favorite and most successful strategies for success in Diplomacy?
30 replies
Open
bo_sox48 (5202 DMod(G))
13 Nov 16 UTC
(+3)
NZ Quake
7.8 magnitude earthquake in New Zealand around midnight local time follows a number of powerful ones elsewhere in the world. No word of deaths or injuries yet.
12 replies
Open
Doug7878 (1678 D(G))
21 Nov 16 UTC
A STAR symbol in front of the GAME name?
What does the green STAR symbol to the left of the Game name signify?
16 replies
Open
bo_sox48 (5202 DMod(G))
20 Nov 16 UTC
Instant Runoff Voting
http://www.slate.com/articles/business/moneybox/2016/11/maine_just_passed_ranked_choice_voting_bravo.html?wpsrc=kwfacebookdt&kwp_0=270246&kwp_4=1034464&kwp_1=487923

Let's open this can of worms.
21 replies
Open
brainbomb (290 D)
20 Nov 16 UTC
I was at a bar last night in Omaha, Nebraska...
Where the waitstaff was encouraging two gentlemen at the bar that all Hillary supporters were no longer welcome there. I stayed anyway and said I support Hillary. Others left the bar immediately vowing not to return.
50 replies
Open
BurntAlmond (100 D)
21 Nov 16 UTC
Where are all the players?
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=185776

Come join a Classic game with anon players and DSS!
0 replies
Open
Tolstoy (1962 D)
15 Nov 16 UTC
The End of World As We Know It
To commemorate the pending demise of my favorite map, I have started what might be the last World Map game on this site. All are welcome:
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=185554
15 replies
Open
qwerbnot (0 DX)
20 Nov 16 UTC
Holidays
What are you doing these summer/winterforAmericans holidays?
4 replies
Open
LachStyle (240 D)
16 Nov 16 UTC
(+1)
Churchie Games
Please be advised that playing with friends are banned, as this might cause fun.
106 replies
Open
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