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Sandgoose (0 DX)
05 Jun 12 UTC
Points to blow
Okay, so I have more points than I'd like to have right now and I'd like to blow them. So, I can go up to 1000, and would be willing to challenge you...the 1000 is final. WTA/ANON/Full -or- Public Press. Message me baby, sandgoose is waiting.........for YOU.... ;D. Come on big boy.
22 replies
Open
1brucben (60 D)
03 Jun 12 UTC
This is DIPLOMACY. Gunboat needs to be BANNED
Gunboat involves no diplomacy at all. We need to ban it or else the game of diplomacy shall be ruined.
35 replies
Open
2ndWhiteLine (2611 D(B))
06 Jun 12 UTC
D-Day
See below.
2ndWhiteLine (2611 D(B))
06 Jun 12 UTC
Soldiers, Sailors and Airmen of the Allied Expeditionary Force!

You are about to embark upon the Great Crusade, toward which we have striven these many months. The eyes of the world are upon you. The hopes and prayers of liberty loving people everywhere march with you. In company with our brave Allies and brothers-in-arms on other Fronts, you will bring about the destruction of the German war machine, the elimination of Nazi tyranny over the oppressed peoples of Europe, and security for ourselves in a free world.
Your task will not be an easy one. Your enemy is well trained, well equipped and battle-hardened. He will fight savagely.

But this is the year 1944! Much has happened since the Nazi triumphs of 1940-1941. The United Nations have inflicted upon the Germans great defeats, in open battle, man-to-man. Our air offensive has seriously reduced their strength in the air and their capacity to wage overwhelming superiority in weapons and munitions of war, and placed at our disposal great reserves of trained fighting men. The tide has turned! The free men of the world are marching together to Victory! I have full confidence in your courage, devotion to duty and skill in battle. We will accept nothing less than full Victory!

Good Luck! And let us beseech the blessing of Almighty God upon this great and noble undertaking.

Signed….Dwight D. Eisenhower
Poozer (962 D)
06 Jun 12 UTC
So what you're saying is that England should invade France before attacking Germany?
bo_sox48 (5202 DMod(G))
06 Jun 12 UTC
And not a single one lost that day was in vain.
dipplayer2004 (1310 D)
06 Jun 12 UTC
Amen
^what he said
Gunfighter06 (224 D)
06 Jun 12 UTC
Heroes, all of them. Thanks for the reminder.
loowkey (132 D)
06 Jun 12 UTC
I shall always remember
Thanks for the reminder. They are all heroes now and forever
Reading that *still* puts the hairs up on the back of my neck.
Thank you 2ndWL
krellin (80 DX)
07 Jun 12 UTC
My 13 year old walked through the Holocaust Museum in Michigan...witnessed the history of Nazi Germany's horror against a people...pictures....movies....the horrifying atrocities of man again man...I hope she never forgets the sadness she felt in there.

Because, sadly, such horrible men still exist...in Iran, for example....in the PLO (call them what you will) who wish to see a race die....
bo_sox48 (5202 DMod(G))
07 Jun 12 UTC
Exactly right, krellin.
Bruschev Tito (100 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
All respect to the western Allies but bragration had more of an impact
Gunfighter06 (224 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
http://www.google.com/imgres?hl=en&biw=1024&bih=677&gbv=2&tbm=isch&tbnid=oyC_iTOQmY23tM:&imgrefurl=http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:WWII,_Europe,_France,_%2522Into_the_Jaws_of_Death_-_U.S._Troops_wading_through_water_and_Nazi_gunfire%2522_-_NARA_-_195515.jpg&docid=yJ7QFBfEvuawqM&imgurl=http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/56/WWII,_Europe,_France,_%252522Into_the_Jaws_of_Death_-_U.S._Troops_wading_through_water_and_Nazi_gunfire%252522_-_NARA_-_195515.jpg&w=3000&h=2421&ei=ZhTQT_2HK4KS2QWo_oTIDA&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=115&vpy=152&dur=175&hovh=202&hovw=250&tx=145&ty=113&sig=109665740722097340787&page=1&tbnh=147&tbnw=199&start=0&ndsp=12&ved=1t:429,r:0,s:0,i:74
dipplayer2004 (1310 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
I have to concur with Bruschev. It was the Soviets who payed the blood price to defeat Nazi Germany. Though they never could have done it without American trucks, rations, planes, food, etc.
Nonetheless it is appropriate today to remember the most incredible amphibious assault in history--and a campaign that involved intricate planning, huge logistical challenges, and bold execution.
Putin33 (111 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
Shhh, don't remind them that they owe their sorry existence to the Soviets.
NigeeBaby (100 D(G))
07 Jun 12 UTC
The 2nd World War started in 1939, I bet until late 1941 the Holcaust was mightily upsetting for our American cousins, if it hadn't have been for Pearl Harbour how many more people would have been annihilated whilst the Yanks listened in on their radios
ghug (5068 D(B))
07 Jun 12 UTC
Putin, that's not fair. The Soviets owe their sorry asses to the allies just as much.
largeham (149 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
Yes, the Soviets faced over 70% of Wehrmacht/SS troops and the Nazis suffered around 75% of their casualties on the Eastern front.

However after March 43 the Luftwaffe suffered more fighter losses over Western Europe than in the USSR, in July 43 335 fighters fell over Germany compared to 201 in the USSR. Between November 1942 and May 43, Germany lost 2422 aircraft over the Med, 40.5% of the entire Luftwaffe. The surge in May 43 resulted in the loss of 177 Ju-52s and 6 Me-323 (both planes were extremely rare). The allies shipped to the USSR 34 million uniforms, 14.5 million pairs of boots, 4.2 million tons of food and 11800 railroad cars. By the end of the war, almost two thirds of all the trucks in the Red Army were foreign made, without those trucks the breakthroughs in in 1944 would have failed miserably. That said, combat vehicles got a bad rap, the Matilda and Valentine tanks couldn't fit a large enough gun and the tracks on the Shermans were too thin for the snow (though many were used in Manchuria). Also, Hitler pulled out the II SS Panzer Corps right in the middle of Kursk so he could send it to Italy (he also did similar things through out the war, though most troops were also sent to France needed to be refitted and would have been a waste in the USSR anyway).

IMO, neither side could have done it without the other.
Gunfighter06 (224 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
Not to mention that the Western allies (mostly America, with some help from Australia) took down Japan without any notable Soviet assistance, except a little towards the end in Korea and Manchuria.

But let's not hijack this.

The bigger problem is that most people, especially kids, couldn't point to Normandy or Iwo Jima or anywhere else where many American men gave it all for freedom.
Putin33 (111 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
What do you mean 'a little'. The Soviet invasion of Manchuria ended the war in Asia. Manchuria had Japan's best soldiers. Japan surrendered because of the Soviet invasion. I'd say that's a lot of help.

America did little more than dither around in North Africa and Italy while bombing civilian cities in Germany.

The trucks that were sent had to be assembled in Soviet factories. Soviet production won the war.
Putin33 (111 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
Germany was already being pushed back for any of the vaunted lend lease arrived. 80% of the casualties. No other argument is needed. I notice nobody here bothered to honor May 9. Hell, it's not even a holiday among the 'western allies'.
Tolstoy (1962 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
"Manchuria had Japan's best soldiers."

Actually, Manchuria had been stripped of many of its first rate divisions for use in the Pacific and China. The Kwantung Army had been low on the supply priority list for three and a half years, and was at only half the strength in 1945 it was in 1940.
Putin33 (111 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
"The Soviets owe their sorry asses to the allies just as much."

Single biggest lie ever told.
No actually I think this one takes the cake

"Shhh, don't remind them that they owe their sorry existence to the Soviets."
Putin33 (111 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
1 million troops were taken from Japan due to the invasion of Manchuria. This after the Soviets had already done all the heavy lifting vs Germany.

"No actually I think this one takes the cake"

I forgot, the Wehrmact all committed suicide because of American "intervention" in 1942. Stalingrad never happened. The 10 massive Soviet counteroffensives never happened. The steamrolling of the Kwangtung army never happened. The war was won with aerial bombings of civilians and in the deserts of Libya and Egypt.
largeham (149 D)
08 Jun 12 UTC
Lol, no one ever said the Red Army was useless, they took the brunt of the Wehrmacht and destroyed it in the end. But would have the offensives of Bagration, Romania, Hungray and so on happened without American trucks to resupply them. The Soviets managed to mass fucktons of artillery before Berlin (John Erickson says that Hitler's delusions were pretty sane, it was extremely difficult for the Soviets to achieve the gun density they managed, but they did it anyway), how the hell would they have been supplied?
"I forgot, the Wehrmact all committed suicide because of American "intervention" in 1942. Stalingrad never happened. The 10 massive Soviet counteroffensives never happened. The steamrolling of the Kwangtung army never happened. The war was won with aerial bombings of civilians and in the deserts of Libya and Egypt."

Wait, so what you're saying is that we must pick between "The Soviets did nothing in WWII" or "America owes its sorry existence to the Soviets"?

Bullshit. Of course the Soviets did a hell of a lot in WWII, and were irreplaceable in the defeat of Nazi Germany. That doesn't mean that without them America wouldn't have survived WWII. Germany never had the ability to project naval force into the Atlantic in an existentially-threatening way, and America beat Japan at sea, which was all that would be needed to survive. The Axis would certainly have conquered Europe if the Soviets had rolled over, sure, but America doesn't "owe its sorry existence to the Soviets."
Neither side could have done it without the other. By arguing that one or the other was useless we are disrespecting those who lost their lives on these "useless" campaigns. The Soviets would've had a rougher time without the Luftwaffe suffering high casualties by the western allies' air force. They also would've had a rougher time once their supply lines extended without the American-made (Soviet assembled) trucks. It would've been similar, though not quite as bad, as the Chinese supply situation during the Korean War (which was the only reason they didn't overrun the peninsula).

At the same time though, the western allies would've been decimated at Normandy had the Soviets not chewed up and spit out most of the Wehrmacht. Both sides needed the other to win it. Had Britain fallen in 1940, I sincerely doubt Moscow would have survived 1941 (not the USSR, but literally the city of Moscow).

The invasion of Manchuria was mostly symbolic though. Japan had virtually no navy or air force to defend themselves or resupply their troops in China. The outcome of the war was a forgone conclusion by then.
Gunfighter06 (224 D)
08 Jun 12 UTC
@ Putin33

The atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki ended the war in Asia, not the Soviet invasion of Manchuria.

But goldfinger is right. Comparing Soviet and Western decisiveness in WWII is not productive and only belittles the sacrifices made by the servicemen on both sides.

Like I said, the bigger problem is that hardly anyone remembers or cares about places like Normandy, Bastonge, Bataan, Wake Island, Iwo Jima, or Okinawa.
Gunfighter06 (224 D)
08 Jun 12 UTC
@ Putin33 cont.

Being that yesterday (or two days ago, depending on your location) was the anniversary of D-Day, it seems a bit more appropriate to honor the sacrifices made on that day.
Putin33 (111 D)
08 Jun 12 UTC
The idea that the west contributing 4% of Soviet military production through lend lease was vital for the war is a joke. The war was won before a single lend lease delivery was made. It was only a matter of how swift Germany would fall. You're right in that America and Britain could have gotten along just fine with a Nazified Europe. Which is why they dithered for several years before they even bothered opening a proper western front.

"Japan had virtually no navy or air force to defend themselves or resupply their troops in China. The outcome of the war was a forgone conclusion by then."

They still were superior to anything the Chinese had, and could have held onto Manchuria. It wasn't as if the Americans were going to liberate it. The Soviet's invasion was the proximate cause of Japan's surrender, the bombings played little to no role. Japan was being bombed all the time, they weren't scared of a couple of atom bombs. Look at the Security Council meetings. They held them immediately after the surprise Soviet attack, they didn't hold a meeting after any bombings. They were holding out hope that the Soviets would lobby for some concessions from the Americans on their behalf. The Soviet invasion ended that hope, which is why the war ended when it did.
King Atom (100 D)
08 Jun 12 UTC
I am trying to set a better standard for myself upon returning to this site, however, I cannot be completely and utterly offended by Putin's overly biased comments.

"The idea that the west contributing 4% of Soviet military production through lend lease was vital for the war is a joke."

You forget that just because Russia lost their millions of men fighting the Germans from Africa to the Baltics, does not mean that they were the only factor contributing to the defeat of Nazi Germany. There were numerous attacks in Eastern Europe that slaughtered the Russian forces, but there was plenty of fighting going on in the west. Sure, maybe America would have abandoned Europe altogether, had Germany and Japan not declared war on them, but that is hardly justification to negate the loss of the millions of Americans who died fighting the Axis Alliance.

Do you forget France? Though they may not have fought hard, their defenses along the Maginot line and their reaction to attack Germany after the seizure of Poland should not go unnoticed. They had an impact, they fought, and they lost.

And then there was England, who, united under Churchill fought the Germans harder than anyone expected them to. Through the months of constant bombardment and air raids, they pulled through and stopped (or at least slowed) Germany from uniting all of Europe under a Fascist regime. They fought on Normandy, they fought for France. They fought in London, they fought in Egypt and Arabia. You cannot say that they did nothing to stop Germany. They lost almost all of their remaining colonies after that attack, and they were majorly set back, practically losing their title as the most powerful nation in the world up until that point.

And then there was Australia...alright, we can forget that they did anything, but they at least tried.

And to whom does the greatest credit go? To America...
That is the mere fact of the matter, when people recognize the victories in the Pacific, on D-day, and for utterly defeating Germany and re-establishing world peace, people think of America. The war would not have been won in Germany, had the Americans not gathered the Allies together and launched a full scale attack on the beaches of France. The war would not have been won against Japan, had they not dropped two freaking nuclear warheads on Japanese soil. What on earth are you saying that those had no impact? Millions dying in the taking of Pacific Islands isn't good enough for you? America stopped Japan and sent them back to their little island. Russia didn't have that hard of a fight, Japan didn't have that great manpower. The only reason Russia had it hard in the Pacific was because of a lack of sustainable resources to fund the war.

In the end, Russia did a lot of good things fending off the Germans, but they simply had it far too hard on themselves for not providing the necessary funding to fight the Axis. I can't get out everything I want to say, because I have difficulty explaining things without being able to look at my subject, but I hope you're understanding that Russia merely provided the cannon fodder to slow Germany down until the Allies were able to intervene. It should have happened a bit sooner, but what are you going to do about it?
dis gon b gud

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-eO8o9_rI154/Tw4x1NQg0EI/AAAAAAAAAnk/QeUJsEsqgMg/s1600/gus-psyche-popcorn.gif
@KA - you're giving America and the west a little too much credit there. I cringe to await Putin's reaction. Also, your death toll is a bit high for western deaths. America lost a couple hundred thousand, while it was Russia that lost millions upon millions

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties

krellin-you forgot Tel Aviv.
Without the Sovs, the Empire and America don't defeat the Nazis. Period. Without the Empire and America, the Soviets don't defeat the Nazis. Period. It shames no one to point out the valuable contributions of their allies in scrubbing the blot that was Nazism.
largeham (149 D)
08 Jun 12 UTC
"but I hope you're understanding that Russia merely provided the cannon fodder to slow Germany down until the Allies were able to intervene."
Are you fucking retarded?

"Millions dying in the taking of Pacific Islands isn't good enough for you?"
Yes, you are.
redhouse1938 (429 D)
08 Jun 12 UTC
Respect to all people who died in WWII to liberate Europe, of course the Soviets made the largest sacrifice in the war, but any life wasted on the altar of Nazi Germany's obscene ideology is one too many.

That being said, I hereby declare this the most insane comment on political history I have ever heard:

"Japan was being bombed all the time, they weren't scared of a couple of atom bombs. Look at the Security Council meetings. They held them immediately after the surprise Soviet attack, they didn't hold a meeting after any bombings."

Okay. From now on "threat" is a quantifiable property in warfare and is proportional to the number of "security council meetings" the nation under siege holds after a major event.

If somebody throws a nuclear weapon at you in an era where none existed, you don't call security council meetings. You panic and accept unconditional surrender. OW WHAT A COINCIDENCE THAT'S WHAT THEY ACTUALLY DID.
NigeeBaby (100 D(G))
08 Jun 12 UTC
Lest we ever forget
King Atom (100 D)
08 Jun 12 UTC
Sigh...I tried not to care anymore, but this is a little ridiculous. I was referencing millions of deaths, because millions of people did in fact die in the Pacific war. Yes, most of those were Japanese deaths, but it took them dying in the war in the Pacific to get America to even care about Germany. Had Japan not attack us and gone so far with it, we might not have ever done anything about the Nazis.

Anyway, it is pointless for anyone to argue any further seeing that all points have been made. This thread was not made, I do believe, to serve as a proponent for the senseless fighting that occurs on this site. Return to its original intent and Honor the dead, those who died to make the world what it is today. Think about how differently things would be had they not made that sacrifice, and stop worrying about who contributed the most. Something this serious should not involve anyone's opinions no matter how justified nor how stupid they may be.


40 replies
SantaClausowitz (360 D)
06 Jun 12 UTC
Why do men still have to pay?
Question about today's society
141 replies
Open
Disraeli (427 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
rule question
If all players vote both "draw" and "cancel", does the game draw or cancel?
14 replies
Open
rokakoma (19138 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
EoG - Bad Players Welcome
6 replies
Open
Zmaj (215 D(B))
06 Jun 12 UTC
Atheists and death
See below.
59 replies
Open
NigeeBaby (100 D(G))
08 Jun 12 UTC
I don't believe this ...... I think it's just Rumours !!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-18363214
3 replies
Open
smcbride1983 (517 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
Getting people to talk
I usually get the ball rolling and open up communication with everyone before spring of the first year is over. However, recently I took over for someone and I can't get any dialogue going with the other folks. Any suggestions?
12 replies
Open
NigeeBaby (100 D(G))
07 Jun 12 UTC
A perfect candidate for Site Moderator
......witty, charming, intellectual, tough, fair, honest, resilient, you know who !!
23 replies
Open
Stressedlines (1559 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
EoG GB 55
gameID=91011

thoughts?
10 replies
Open
The Czech (40398 D(S))
08 Jun 12 UTC
Need a sitter for a live game.
Wife needs me to help her with something. Will be AFK for an hour or so. Other wise a good position gets lost and screws the game for everyone. Please help.
gameID=91026
PM me and I'll tell you which country I am.
0 replies
Open
Stressedlines (1559 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
can someoen tam,e over this poistion in a gunboat?
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=91011#gamePanel
6 replies
Open
jabberjawsjr (100 D)
30 May 12 UTC
Favorite Italy Openings
What are your favorite Italy openings?
20 replies
Open
SantaClausowitz (360 D)
29 May 12 UTC
Daily Christian Slaughter Thread
Perhaps I'm just glib. I guess I understand that Jesus might want to test his flock by making them martyrs every once in a while, but why would he allow them to massacre innocents in his name? This thread will explore this question, semi daily.
145 replies
Open
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
06 Jun 12 UTC
Buying a Truck
So, I'm thinking of buying a truck with my parents to help them with yard work. It will mostly be for picking up mulch and trees, bringing the lawnmowers for maintenance, and I'd like to use it to plow their driveway. I'm thinking a Ford Ranger from '95-'00. Thoughts?
51 replies
Open
NKcell (0 DX)
07 Jun 12 UTC
Pausing a game
Hey, the game I'm in ( gameID=87777 ) has an austria leaving until sunday...everyone hit pause except turkey, who has one SC left and is taking advantage of the situation. Any way we can force pause this game?
22 replies
Open
dave bishop (4694 D)
05 Jun 12 UTC
Diplomacy App?
See below.
26 replies
Open
SpeakerToAliens (147 D(S))
07 Jun 12 UTC
What's the record for unclaimed neutral SCs?
In 2 different games:-
Greece still neutral in autumn 03.
Tunis still neutral in spring 05.
9 replies
Open
obiwanobiwan (248 D)
06 Jun 12 UTC
Ray Bradbury Dies
http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/science-fiction-author-ray-bradbury-dies-144137431.html
27 replies
Open
Crazy Anglican (1067 D)
06 Jun 12 UTC
Vote only : Please like the first quote in this thread if...
You believe in some sort of God or higher power. You do not have to attend church or consider yourself part of any particular religion.
22 replies
Open
Stressedlines (1559 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
LIve WTA GB 26
gameID=90953 Actually an interesting game, with only one CD late by Germany.

Otherwise, well played, and I was not sure things would ever unlock in the south.
2 replies
Open
Ethanol (1780 D)
05 Jun 12 UTC
Looking for sitter
Hi there.
I've to go on a buisness trip next 1.5 week were i will not be able to access to the internet and check Diplomacy.
Would there be a possibility to find someone take care on my few games.
8 replies
Open
Dernwine (370 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
Game Babysitter needed
I'm going away with unreliable internet access for a few weeks and need someone to baby sit my account for me if possible...
1 reply
Open
Thucydides (864 D(B))
06 Jun 12 UTC
Strong Persia position open
The other players need a replacement as the last guy was MIA for a while, anyone want to help them out? They've been very patient. gameID=89404
3 replies
Open
NigeeBaby (100 D(G))
07 Jun 12 UTC
gameID=90882 EOG - Play Hard & Ready Up You Spas
Any chance of an EOG here from Germany & England .& Italy......
0 replies
Open
dubmdell (556 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
If a mod could check the email regarding a pause
Within the next three hours. Thanks.
0 replies
Open
DiploMerlin (245 D)
07 Jun 12 UTC
Cutting off support from countries with two coasts
Does a single attack from a fleet on a two coast country cut off support from either coast?
3 replies
Open
Mujus (1495 D(B))
07 Jun 12 UTC
Debate on Debate Threads
This is a new thread where people can debate how the debate threads should be run. Whenever anyone feels like going meta, here's the venue. :-0
5 replies
Open
dubmdell (556 D)
06 Jun 12 UTC
Could a mod check the email?
A matter of small importance, if you could take a moment. Thank you.
2 replies
Open
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