Apparently part of my #2 was cut off:

The Reform, Canadian Action and Conservative Party all merged together to prevent a vote split in future elections. So why didn't the NPD and Liberals Merge? Many members of the NDP called for this merge and were denied by the Liberals. And here is why:
http://politicalcompass.org/canada2011

The fact is most Liberals associate more with the Right of Center conservative party then far left NDP party. Everyone keeps calling this a vote split between the two left wing parties apposing the conservatives. But in reality its not 2 left wing parties, its one left win one, one center one and one right wing party. The vote split is between to parties that don't associate with each other.

However if the NDP ever won because of a vote split between the Conservatives and Liberals I doubt anyone would be complaining and saying the only reason why they won was because of the vote split (I would be complaining cause it would prove how stupid voters are)

@Fasces: They did win! That's why they're in power. But a majority of Canadians wanted a government that is left of center. And why would the NDP call for a merger if the Liberals were a right-wing party?

Also, I bet that the polls spoke of a coalition including the Bloc Quebecois. Now that the BQ are no longer a force in national politics, perhaps voters will be more receptive to the suggestion of a coalition.

I think those polls were of a coalition of just NDP/Grits. For some reason coalition is a nasty word in Canada when, in reality, it is a necessary part of the electoral system.

A quick Google search hasn't turned up Fasces's poll. Link, please?

T Broadley,

I followed the link in Fasces post that he clearly included.

http://politicalcompass.org/canada2011

"@Fasces: They did win! That's why they're in power. But a majority of Canadians wanted a government that is left of center. And why would the NDP call for a merger if the Liberals were a right-wing party? "
Did you even read what I second on my second post? THE LIBERALS ARE NOT LEFT OF CENTER SO IT WASN'T A VOTE SPLIT BETWEEN 2 LEFT OF CENTER PARTIES!!!!!!!!!!!!

"Also, I bet that the polls spoke of a coalition including the Bloc Quebecois. Now that the BQ are no longer a force in national politics, perhaps voters will be more receptive to the suggestion of a coalition."
The coalition was referrring to the BQ-NDP-LIB Coalition that was formed in 2008 and disbanded after public out cry. The poll was in the globe and mail referring to that coalition. Maybe they would be more accepted to an NDP-Liberal Coalition, but the Libs and the NDP didn't have enough popular support together to beat out the Conservatives in 2008 or in this election so it had to be with the BQ...

Anyway back to the original discussion about tough on crime:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/canadas-crime-rate-at-lowest-level-in-almost-40-years-statscan/article2104745/
It seems to be working, as Stats Canada as shown that conservatives tough on crime policy is working. This disproves what you are suggesting...

The Liberals are traditionally left of centre, as they embrace something akin to a social democracy of the kind supported by J. Rawls, for example.
They have been moving more right (as many social democrats have during the last 15 years), likely because of growing pressure from the world of big banking and big business. It's hard not to when our southern neighbours are so obviously and undoubtedly going in that direction: even Obama is not really stopping it. And let's not get started on Goldman Sachs...
The big problem for the Liberals, however, is that such a move makes them a pale copy of the Conservatives and they are thus incapable of convincing their natural supporters to vote for them en masse. Hence the split vote during the last election. There's a lot more to say, and I'd love to have that conversation around beer with any of you, but I fear that trolling will just kill this thread and I actually care about that stuff too much to suffer trolls.

"It seems to be working, as Stats Canada as shown that conservatives tough on crime policy is working. This disproves what you are suggesting"

No it doesn't. The new crime bill has not been implemented yet. Besides, it takes several years for the effects of crime legislation to show itself in trends like this.

Liberals have been traditionally left of center, but all their leaders in the last 27 years with the exception of Dion have been fiscally conservative. It hasn't been a recent trend but a trend that has lasted for almost a quarter century...

I disagree Fasces...

Chrétien maintained taxation and even increased it. His focus was simply not economic reform: he believed his job to be to follow on Trudeau's footsteps in making the country healthy again on a political level. His main concern was us, Québec.

His main concern was Quebec, however he was fiscally conservative in the sense that he cut spending, that is something most left wingers seem to think is the biggest sin possible.

I thought it would be funny to point out in a thread about Canadian politics that I am supposed to be playing hockey tonight (ice hockey, for those foreigners glancing at this thread) but this heat wave is ridiculous. 38C (100F) but it feels like 49C (120F) with the humidity. Kill me now.

But back on topic - The assertion that someone is left or right of centre is so nebulous that is pretty irrelevant. I think the point is that, at least on social issues, the grits and NDP are closer than the grits and the tories.

Also, Fasces, Harper increased government spending. So does that make him fiscally left?

So the NDP wanted Jets?
So the NDP wanted Corporate Tax Cuts?
More often then not the grits have sided with the Cons then the NDP. By that I mean in the last 3 years.

@yonni: you in Toronto?

Chrétien cutting in public spending was made necessary by the FIASCO that was the Mulroney gvt and the recession in the early 90s.

Yeah, the heatwave is ridiculous here in Detroit too. When my wife left for work at 6:45 this morning, it was 85 degrees F. And humid as hell.

"Also, Fasces, Harper increased government spending. So does that make him fiscally left?"
He increased the military budget...

"Chrétien cutting in public spending was made necessary by the FIASCO that was the Mulroney gvt and the recession in the early 90s."
NO! NO! NONONONONO!
It was not Mulroney's government that created the massive public debt, it was Trudeau's...

Liberal/NDP coalitions have, in the past existed, and the one occasion this happened that leaps to mind, the resulting government was centre left, and first implemented Canada's healthcare system.

The Liberal party may have a record of being centre or centre-right ever since the days of Martin`s government at least, but they have in the last few elections been attempting to position themselves in the public eye as a party of the centre-centre-left.

He actually spent more on health care too.

@Fasces: If the Libs are really a right-of-center party that has little in common with the NDP, why would the NDP want to merge with them?

@Tettleton: that link only shows the political leanings of each party, not the poll that show that 58% of Canadians did not want a coalition in 2009.

Do not mistake the Liberal party with the representation it has since Chrétien's departure. The founding ideals of that party are indeed of a social-democratic bent, and philosophically that places them flat centre or ever so slightly left.

Trudeau is responsible for the huge debt. Chrétien and Martin (under Chrétien) are responsible for cut backs and the balanced budget on top of some surpluses. That being said, Mulroney did mess things up pretty badly on all sorts of fronts, social and economical. And Chrétien did not, by any stretch of the word, cut in social spendings in a way that could be construed as conservative. Fiscal responsibility should not be the appanage of the right-wing parties.