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A place to discuss topics/games with other webDiplomacy players.
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brora (100 D)
20 Jul 14 UTC
Question about 'Ready'
If you 'Save' your orders but forget to press 'Ready' does the system process the 'Save' orders or count your turn as having received no orders?
28 replies
Open
ILN (100 D)
18 Jul 14 UTC
Essay help
So I have to write an essay on the Caribbean, and the topic I chose was the economic effects of colonization in the Caribbean from the 15th to 18th century.
I want the arguments to focus on how colonization benefit or hurt the economy, e.g. gold, sugar, slave trade
53 replies
Open
KingGuru (105 D)
20 Jul 14 UTC
Is it okay to ask for help from outside a game?
I would really appreciate some outside help with games I'm playing, kind of like tutoring, and I don't want to ask for help if you feel that it's unfair or whatever. I'm new around here, but enjoying the experience. I haven't played in -cough, cough- years and am glad I found this place. Thanks.
11 replies
Open
bo_sox48 (5202 D Mod (G))
12 Jul 14 UTC
Sir Nicholas Winton
All this one-sided talk of Israel today reminded me why we have a nation in the first place - World War II. It also reminded me why the Jewish religion still exists, because of people like Winton. If you don't know the story:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0aoifNziKQ
42 replies
Open
SYnapse (0 D X)
20 Jul 14 UTC
American political history
What's the best textbook on analysis of American political changes/Presidental history?
15 replies
Open
CommanderByron (863 D (S))
18 Jul 14 UTC
Hillary?
So fellow United States citizens. This next election in 2016 is going to be my first presidential election. I already have an opinion of who I would like to vote for, for reasons that I have fully developed. I am curious how everyone else feels about Hillary Clinton.
137 replies
Open
CommanderByron (863 D (S))
19 Jul 14 UTC
CD -_-
There needs to be a punishment for people who CD. Like i hear stoning works well. maybe guillotine? I personally think the old fashion firing squad should handle these people pretty well.
13 replies
Open
krellin (80 D X)
18 Jul 14 UTC
(+2)
Oh noes...the AIDS Researchers...
Just listened to Obama blathering about the AIDS researchers on the Malaysian flight. Oh noes...the AIDS researchers....suddenly this flight is more important than others, because of the AIDS researchers...

If it were just shmucks like you and I that had died…not so big a deal. But the AIDS researchers…oh noes…Anyone else think that every life is precious, not just the AIDS researchers….OH NOES!!!
106 replies
Open
pangloss (363 D)
20 Jul 14 UTC
WBC SoundCloud
The Westboro Baptist Church has a SoundCloud page. They have 7h30 worth of parodies, some good, some bad (in terms of singing, production, etc.).
https://soundcloud.com/wbcsays/sets/parodies
In particular, 666 (Pumped-up Kicks) is fairly well done.
5 replies
Open
obiwanobiwan (248 D)
19 Jul 14 UTC
The WebDip Forum Drinking Game
Take a shot if.......
49 replies
Open
NBA Free Agency
I thought it would be nice to have a thread on NBA free agency, see what everyone was thinking about the main 'dramas' unfolding
133 replies
Open
Al Swearengen (0 D X)
18 Jul 14 UTC
Zionism, Jihad, Integration and the Postbellum South
By Al Swearengen

Actually, I probably won't get around to writing this.
18 replies
Open
Yaniv (1380 D (S))
19 Jul 14 UTC
Diplomacy, statistically speaking...
what are the odds of a player (a) soloing; (b) drawing; (c) surviving; (d) losing?
11 replies
Open
THELEGION (0 D X)
19 Jul 14 UTC
bar fight
Ok so there's a giant drunken bar fight between the irish, germans, vikings, russians and a combined force of american red necks and hill billys which group will win.
5 replies
Open
ThatBuhlLarry (100 D)
19 Jul 14 UTC
For Anyone Interested in a World Game
1 day phases; starts in 3 days
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=144739
1 reply
Open
VashtaNeurotic (2394 D)
05 Jul 14 UTC
(+3)
Mafia IV: Reptilian Invasion
See inside.
1463 replies
Open
krellin (80 D X)
18 Jul 14 UTC
:) OR (:
Why do smiley faces always have to come eyes-first?
19 replies
Open
bo_sox48 (5202 D Mod (G))
18 Jul 14 UTC
Now Trending on Tumblr
Another person killed by stupid aggressive cops for no fucking reason. Is anyone surprised?

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/staten-island-man-dies-puts-choke-hold-article-1.1871486
10 replies
Open
Hellenic Riot (1626 D (G))
17 Jul 14 UTC
Malaysian Airliner shot down over Ukraine
Never getting on a Malaysian aeroplane...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-28354856
198 replies
Open
NigeeBaby (100 D (G))
18 Jul 14 UTC
I work for a US multi-national and.....
.... they use websense to prevent me going to certain undesirable websites.
I cannot access the Labour Party or Liberal Democrats websites.
Guess what, I can access the Conservative website.
16 replies
Open
Draugnar (0 D X)
17 Jul 14 UTC
(+1)
does life get any better?
Sitting out back, fire pit ablaze, smoking a cigar and sipping a scotch while the dogs run around a d bark at the dear and the sun sets...
32 replies
Open
obiwanobiwan (248 D)
14 Jul 14 UTC
(+1)
What I've Been Saying About Gaza:
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/israel-iron-dome-could-prolong-195600244.html Main quote inside, but essentially--the Iron Dome, which has (thankfully) stopped hundreds of rocket attacks in just a few days now, has taken all pressure off Netanyahu to negotiate, while Hamas arguably stands to gain more from prolonging the conflict--ie, shooting rockets knowing they'll be intercepted and reprisals will come--than by making peace. So, settle in, boys and girls...
249 replies
Open
NigeeBaby (100 D (G))
17 Jul 14 UTC
WTF is wrong with Indian men....
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-28340617

Kiddie rape in India ...... the police are so useless some might accuse them of being part of the overall problem
19 replies
Open
zultar (4180 D Mod (P))
17 Jul 14 UTC
(+9)
Babak wanted to say "Hi" to WebDip
Babak asked me to say "Hi" to webdip on facebook. He is doing well, has a 6 month old baby, and just moved to a new country, but once things settle down, he might join us again.
So in the mean time, shape up your diplomatic and tactical skils and let's see who else we can drag back. :)
19 replies
Open
josepr (100 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
what is the average age of webdiplomacy players?
Is there a statistic? I want to know. In a game I felt I was playing with the stubbornness of a child. He/she wanted ALL his way. All the negotiation was "this is mine mine mine". He/she couldn't see the repercussions of a bad decision because he/she wanted the gratification of now.

Seriously, knowing the age of a person before starting a game or a negotiation can help a lot. Psychological speaking.
78 replies
Open
brora (100 D)
18 Jul 14 UTC
How to join a new game?
I'm a new player - new to this site. I am trying to get into a new game. When I press on 'New' I see a list of new games. However, some are 'padlocked' and require passwords. How do I get into those? Or can I only play games without padlocks?
9 replies
Open
lixu893 (0 D X)
18 Jul 14 UTC
Where to buy Cases For Samsung Galaxy S5
You need a special case for your new Samsung Galaxy S5, to show your taste and protect your phone. We happen to have thousands of different styles cases for Samsung Galaxy S5. It is your best choice for shopping at our store. Free shipping for two cases now at http://www.centurycases.com/.
3 replies
Open
NigeeBaby (100 D (G))
17 Jul 14 UTC
^^^^ UK General Election 2015 ****
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-28339128
Lib Dems have gone early while Cameron is on the defensive after his re-shuffle. Because of the current coalition of Tories/Liberals there will be a new dynamic to the elections, also the rise of UKIP is a bit of an unknown factor.
30 replies
Open
mikelikeike (100 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
Live Game, Players needed
Low risk game. Join now. Slots will go fast!
gameID=144714
3 replies
Open
SYnapse (0 D X)
16 Jul 14 UTC
How to Solo as Italy
Is there a way?
President Eden (2721 D)
16 Jul 14 UTC
(+2)
http://webdiplomacy.net/profile.php?userID=25958&page-games=1#top

scroll thru here and u will eventually find some solos
A_Tin_Can (2244 D)
16 Jul 14 UTC
(+1)
Yes, of course. This article: http://www.diplom.org/Zine/F2007R/Burton/statistician3.htm
has this map, which is pretty interesting:

http://www.diplom.org/Zine/F2007R/Burton/article3-solo-I.png

It shows the percentage of games (from 553 italian solos on a JDip dataset) that each centre is held at the time that Italy solos.
A_Tin_Can (2244 D)
16 Jul 14 UTC
Assuming the most independently likely centres are picked up (which is of course incorrect), this means that PE's solo here: http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=88425 is the most likely Italian solo.
ghug (5068 D (B))
16 Jul 14 UTC
(+4)
Step 1: Intoxicate yourself on any manner of recreational drug.
Step 2: Enjoy to live game gogogo gameID=103940
Step 3: Manipulate people into doing really stupid things.
Step 4: Flounder around not winning for way too long because step one made strategy hard.
Step 5: Man up and win the fucking game.

Works every time.
Putin33 (111 D)
16 Jul 14 UTC
Italy has the delightful combination of being vulnerable to attack like Austria and unable to develop like the UK.

The only way Italy wins is if other players play incompetently or CD.

ghug (5068 D (B))
16 Jul 14 UTC
It's much easier to develop England than a lot of countries, Putin.

Italy generally does better in games with really tough competition and really bad competition. Anything in between and it kind of sucks.
Putin33 (111 D)
16 Jul 14 UTC
With what neutrals? You get Norway for sure, that's it. If France wants Belgium, you're not getting it. Ditto Germany and Holland. There's nothing left. Denmark is German. Sweden is German or Russian. Iberia is French.
ghug (5068 D (B))
16 Jul 14 UTC
That's balanced by a lack of threat early though. An England that gets a foothold in Belgium in '01 is quickly overpowering tactically. The first center on the mainland is the hardest, but once you have that you're kind of hard to stop.
Putin33 (111 D)
16 Jul 14 UTC
Sure there is a trade-off between vulnerability and early development. My point was Italy gets the worst of both.
ghug (5068 D (B))
16 Jul 14 UTC
Italy's not very vulnerable though, and England's early development isn't that difficult.
Putin33 (111 D)
16 Jul 14 UTC
Relative to the corner powers, Italy is vulnerable. Relative to the central powers who can often gain 3 SCs after '01, England's early development is difficult. You even said getting a foothold on the mainland is difficult.

Putin33 (111 D)
16 Jul 14 UTC
Here just to clarify what I thought was a fairly straight forward point.

Ordinal rankings of powers in terms of vulnerability (1 = most, 7 = least vulnerable)

1 = Austria
2 = Germany
3 = Italy
4 = Russia
5 = France
6 = Turkey
7 = England

Ordinal rankings of powers in terms of difficulty of early development (1=most difficult; 7=least difficult)

1 = Italy
2 = England
3 = Turkey
4 = Russia
5 = France
6 = Austria
7 = Germany

Italy is on the bad end of both scales.
How are we rating vulnerability here? Development category focuses on early game -- does vulnerability do so as well? Because if so Italy is the least vulnerable of all, if you ask me. France attacking Italy is an embarrassing luxury, and other than France coming in from behind, Italy just isn't going to be attacked.

I would agree that its midgame vulnerability tends to be somewhat high, but I think that's just because Italy is a high-variance country. If you manage to notch that crucial fifth and sixth center in the first 2-3 game years, then you can typically carve out a large enough corner of the board to expand at a reasonable rate and repel attacks. If your Lepanto stalls out and you're looking at Autumn 1904 with Tunis and your home centers, you're fucked.
Putin33 (111 D)
16 Jul 14 UTC
I had in mind mid-game vulnerability. I especially had in mind 2-on-1 attacks. I admit that France doesn't go for this very often early on.

But at some point the French are going to build in the Mediterranean, and you have the prospect of fleet build-ups by the French and Turks, combined with having your home SCs adjacent to Austria. Compared to other powers, Italy doesn't survive a 2-on-1 for very long. I've seen Russia last years fighting two, sometimes even three powers. Ditto Turkey and England. If somebody can explain to me how Italy fares better in those scenarios, I'm willing to listen.
Germany and Russia are in that class with Italy b/c their home centers are on major stalemate lines. Italy doesn't handle 2-way attacks well, but I don't think Russia or Germany handles them well either; Russia getting hit by Turkey and England or Germany after the early game can get crunched out quick depending on the timing of the attack, and Germany getting slammed by any pairing of England or France and Russia or Austria doesn't have a prayer.

Turkey and especially England are almost invincible if they get out of the early game with a good power base somewhere. Ditto Austria. France is somewhat more vulnerable depending on what other Western power made it out of the early game and how it went down, but it's not in the same class.

I'd agree that in terms of middle game vulnerability Italy's near the top, but I think that's mainly the result of not getting a good power base in the early game.

ghug hit on a good point in high-class games, competent Italian players tend to be fairly dangerous in those imo. I think Italy tends to get misused in the early game. The prevailing strategy seems to be a wait-and-see angle, opportunistically swinging units around to affect the balance of power in the southeastern and western corners of Europe. I think that's damned from the start because Italy's problems -- early expansion and middle crunch due to it -- clearly demand an aggressive strategy in order to fix them, but most players don't pursue it.
mendax (321 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
(+1)
If you want to learn how to Solo as Italy, you could do worse that looking at the recent Italian solo in the SoW. I say that only partly because I was the TA.
ssorenn (0 D X)
17 Jul 14 UTC
I have two Italian solos as Italy and 3 3way draws...it's my favorite country to play.
ghug (5068 D (B))
17 Jul 14 UTC
(+9)
Do you have any French solos as Italy? Austrian?
ssorenn (0 D X)
17 Jul 14 UTC
Funny
ssorenn (0 D X)
17 Jul 14 UTC
I even gave you, ghugy poo a +1
ghug (5068 D (B))
17 Jul 14 UTC
(+2)
I think it's your job as redundant head of redundancy to do so twice. :P
Putin33 (111 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
(+1)
Italy is that bad that you have to specify that you solo'd as Italy while playing as Italy, because people don't believe you.
Putin33 (111 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
Although wasn't WWII an attempt at a German solo by Austria and the Napoleonic Wars were a French attempt by Italy?

Ssoren is more profound than he appears.
WardenDresden (239 D (B))
17 Jul 14 UTC
It was a pretty stupid game, and I manipulated Germany a lot for the end, but gameID=14083 is one of my Italian solos.
ghug (5068 D (B))
17 Jul 14 UTC
@Putin, I'd argue that it's the reverse, but then we're just getting into semantics.
ssorenn (0 D X)
17 Jul 14 UTC
Here's one mine, gameID=135720
uclabb (589 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
(+2)
A_Tin_Can and I have talked a lot about how to play Italy as we are Italy together in the team game (and we are doing very well). I think Italy is very strong, but it requires the ability to understand the whole flow of the game and manipulate it for your benefit. It's hard to explain exactly how, but my suggestion is to be ambitious as Italy, especially in the beginning. The beauty of Italy is that you not only start with zero enemies, even if you attack people they will just ask you to go away. Be aggressive diplomatically for sure, and if the situation calls for it, tactically.
ssorenn (0 D X)
17 Jul 14 UTC
Uclabb hit the nail on the head I think.
Chaqa (4231 D (B))
17 Jul 14 UTC
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=143352#gamePanel
Sevyas (869 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
(+4)
I dont know if anyone else noticed this before, but all of those italian solos have in common that Italy got at least 18 centers at some point really close to the end of the game...
VillageIdiot (7813 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
Soloing with any country is of course possible, but it's certainly a bit more challenging with Italy as it is with any of the other middle countries. With Italy you need to be a very diplomatic player just to make it to the mid-game alone, usually riding the coattails of some threesome or multiple side alliances. Three person alliances are very beneficial to Italy, especially if they're northern countries (Germany, Russia, or England) since it's very hard for them to stab Italy later on.

To have any chance you're going to need to carve yourself out a corner of the board by the time you've reached the end of the mid-game phase or you'll never stand a chance. If you can manage to get yourself into the southeast or southwest corner then you've got as good a chance as any of the other players in the game to solo.
guak (3381 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
I think that Italy has as much solo-potential as Russia/England/Turkey. It is obviously no France or Germany. Nor Austria. But I think that Russia England and Turkey have a really hard time soloing. England and Turkey have much more difficulty in the end game getting their units in position in time because they are so far away. And Russia suffers from large territory syndrome that makes other players realize that they are a solo threat long before there is an actual solo threat.
Yaleunc (11052 D (B))
17 Jul 14 UTC
Here are some gunboat solos.
In this one I went from non-threat to suddenly unstoppable by picking up 4 centers over a 2-year span in mid-game.
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=126690#gamePanel

Here is one with a big comeback. In Autumn '08 Germany was ahead 16-11, with the other 3 remaining countries at 3,2, and 2. I was originally just trying to salvage a draw but then got rolling and turned it into a solo for me.
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=120750#gamePanel


guak (3381 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
I for one have 4 solos with italy out of 48 solos. Given that I have around 10 solos on other maps and that I have probably soloed with france and germany around 22 times combined, I would say Italy solos have been as frequent as those by any of the other 4 nations. I may even have more Italy solos than Russia or Austria (I think I am not the best Austria soloer, I usually get stuck near 17) solos and probably very similar amount to England and Turkey.
VillageIdiot (7813 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
Gunboats not a good measuring stick, you're really not going to solo without some really incompetent neighbours or even more likely (as happened in those two examples) a few NMR's from your neighbours.

Turkey is one of my best solo rate counties, just after France.
Yaleunc (11052 D (B))
17 Jul 14 UTC
It takes even more incompetent neighbors to allow a solo in a press game VillageIdiot.
VillageIdiot (7813 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
(+1)
Hmm.. I don't know if I'd go that far. You can win a press game with skill but with gunboat luck of the draw plays significantly more into your chances.
ghug (5068 D (B))
17 Jul 14 UTC
(+2)
It's easier to stop a solo in a press game though. Unless it's PPSC, but that's not as much a game as a cooperative exercise in stupidity.
VillageIdiot (7813 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
(+1)
Sure - if you've got an idealistic game full of level headed, decently competent, conservative players then it's easy to push for a draw. But there's a lot of different personalities that can come in to play.

Perhaps there's two players who are equally aggressive towards a solo and are willing to gamble it, or one player despite being a good player still loses his cool when stabbed, or an ally who deep down believes that his partner is willing to share two-way with his (up until then) super loyal and honourable guy, or the guy who doesn't know how to effectively attempt a kingmaking strategy, or the advisaries too stubborn to bend to a kingmaking strategy. All these little nuances don't really factor as much into a gunboat game which for all intensive purposes is just a seven person game of checkers.
ghug (5068 D (B))
17 Jul 14 UTC
(+1)
Intents and purposes*

Gunboat has all of those things too, they're just much more subtle and harder to resolve in an optimal fashion.
Octavious (1712 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
Gunboat's second biggest flaw, after the turn one lottery, is that it is effectively public press. All your subtle messages are broadcast to everyone playing the game at equal volume. Gunboaters often say the board never lies. In Diplomacy this is complete tosh as the board is the best liar in the game, but in gunboat it carries a truth as the public nature all but destroys any advantage you can gain from misleading movements.
Yaleunc (11052 D (B))
17 Jul 14 UTC
People that equate gunboat with checkers don't understand gunboat. But back to the original point of preventing solos, even a checkers player should be able to figure out that coordinating defense to stop an attempted solo is far easier when you can send press to coordinate said defensive moves.
2ndWhiteLine (3375 D (B))
17 Jul 14 UTC
Italy is sneaky in gunboat because it can win without fighting over the traditional stalemate centers. IMO, its a lot more obvious to the board that you're going for a solo when you throw armies against Munich, Berlin, or Moscow. In this sense, Italy can stumble into an "under the radar" solo, especially if the Italian player secures Marseilles, Spain, and Portugal before eliminating Turkey. Without hitting Munich at all, some players may be apt to overlook the impending solo.

gameID=140096
VillageIdiot (7813 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
2ndWhiteLine's example just reinforces my point since in that game Italy got to benefit from a NMR'ing France. I think you'd have a challenge finding a gunboat game where Italy soloed that didn't have any NMR's. Without the benefit of communication Italy (as well as Austria) is at a tremendous disadvantage.

This goes to show that for Italy to solo in a regular press game he really needs to leverage his diplomacy skills a lot.
ssorenn (0 D X)
17 Jul 14 UTC
My game had no nmr
VillageIdiot (7813 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
Yup, you're a solid exception. It's not impossible, just 10 times more harder then somebody like a France of a Turkey.
tvrocks (388 D)
17 Jul 14 UTC
Here's one that i won that had no nmrs: gameID=141525 , though turkey did not play very well...
Anyway, i really like italy in gunboats mainly because you get your choice of who you're at war with. In most cases no one will start out attacking you so you can choose where you want to expand to. opening ven tyr rome ven and nap ion is probably the best starting move in a gunboat for italy if you're going for austria.


47 replies
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