Naw, Oztra's vote on snowy was townie - stupid + snowy are scum

There's absolutely no scum motivation behind Oztra's vote on snowy - stupid's analysis is scummy or at best desperate to look smart (and failing)

Fuck I thought I'd make it to page 7 at least. Of course we did skip the joke phase so that had an impact.

@scumteam sorry for being so obvious, this is my first time being anything other than vanilla town.

Take me away boys.

Desperate to look smart lmfao I'm the guy who lynched doc d1 I never said I was good fam, I may be scum but don't paint me as some sort of narcissistic smarter than thou poser.

##vote stupidfighter

Thx for the concession.

For future games where I am town, could you explain the town motivation for a snowy vote so I can improve my play?

Snowy is edgy and weird so the vote is totally legit - and scum are more cautious about being bold, especially noobs. I don't see why scum would vote snowy in that manner. Your analysis is poor.

Can multiple people tell me what snowy was like last game

stupidfighter says: "Unrelated, I find this introduction by Balki highly questionable. Town doesn't gain anything from hearing he has a gun. Directing discussion toward his shit item and away from scum-hunting is bad for town. If the mafia believes him, they can use this information to target someone potentially more valuable, like the nifty doctor and cop items."

❈ Why wouldn't town benefit from crowd-sourced wisdom in determining how to use my gun?

❈ Also, really? You think I've hurt town by "shifting discussion away from scum-hunting" with my single post? And then you bless us all with your "Take me away boys" joke? I'm very sorry to interrupt. Carry on with your elaborate scumtrap.

❈ For real -- should I just holster this thing? As far as I can tell, the rules make guns worth less than nothing. Somebody tell me if I'm missing something.

DemonOverlors says: "You claimed it for what exactly? To get someone else to direct your shot or something?"

❈ I think that I should use the gun today, if at all, so there is no reason to keep it secret. Also, if I'm going to take a shot today, I'm going to call my shot and be accountable for it.

@Balki nice try but I'm not discussing your alleged gun. Keep it in your pants hombre.

@DO I don't see Snowy as acting wierd. I do see that announcing Snowy and I as a scumteam is your first real post. On page one you made fun of how prolific snowy was and he mentioned you were acting much differently in this game, so I think you are just OMGUSing on him and now me for attacking the shitty vote on him.

You can tell Oztra he's being stupid if you disagree with his vote, but your scum read on him based on it makes no sense. Your whole post felt try hard and pushed. Snowy and I have also never played together so I'm not sure why his meta analysis of me would he concerning?

i think snowy is deliberately trying to mislead people so that he and the mafia can gain a foothold and start killing people
just my thought, and warranting how my vote is gud

I guess there needs to be scum in every post now

@Jacob do not post in this thread if you are not in the game. Do not reply to this either.

##GM NOTE:

Please do not post in the game thread if you are not a player.

Thank you

@DO ... Snowy was one of the more talkative players despite it being his first game on the site and was quite effective. If I recall correctly, he was fearkilled by mafia at some stage after I was, or at least there was discussion of killing him if he wasn't. He played well. I feel like he is trying too hard so far this game, but we're only a few hours in and I don't often cast judgment that early.

@Oztra ... how do you figure that snowy is misleading people? You surely have a few particular lines that caught your attention.

@stupidfighter ... you're calling far more attention to Balki's gun than Balki did. He was clearly baiting someone to try to arrange his shot and connect themselves with someone or for someone, maybe even someone who appropriately named themselves "stupid," to take the bait and go apeshit on him. There was nothing unintentional about what he did nor was did he particularly veil what he was trying to do, and yet if only because Balki types fancy and looks classy when he plays, someone - you - bit. What's your plan? Are you trying to get reactions out of the guy trying to get reactions? Are you trying to get reactions out of other people? Or are you just going batshit over something because you feel like you need something to go batshit over to make yourself look good?

@Vash ... what exactly about your strategy of being totally useless, getting cleared, and still being totally useless worked last game?

@RHK ... can you go into detail about the ghost the last time it was used? I don't remember that game. Obviously, this setup might be different but it is important for all of us to know how the ghost acted then. Hell, maybe the ghost will try a similar strategy as whoever played the ghost that game. Never hurts to keep your eyes open.

@bo...
he wanted to know who the new people were so he could prey on them bc he is scum
he is also asking heaps of questions about who is lynching the ghost and who will want to lynch the ghost
also may be giving misleading stats to therefore give the mafia an upper hand.
also i think stupid is mafia
mafia protects their own i reckon

Decent observations. I'll be interested in seeing how those develop as the day goes on.

One should have hoped that any of you would've had the decency to try to clean up this mess before vanishing.

@Balki you must be the one Balduran is always gushing about. Also a pleasure.

If you spoke the truth regarding your gun, I believe it was a mistake. There is an item in the game called the pitchfork which allows the player to commit suicide at any time in the game. Consider carefully when such a move would be beneficial for town, and you will have your answer as to when you should use your gun, if you did not wish to risk yourself. And let us speak no more of this matter as, as stupidfighter points out, it is distracting from the main discussion.

The timeline of Oztra and my interaction is notable. At 9:44pm est, I make a number of comments on this and that in a single post and immediately thereafter he makes a response to a question I posed regarding his experience with mafia. I presume he just returned to the game at this point. 2 minutes later, he states "lmao vote snowy" which, combined with the fact that he followed through on my advice on how to make a valid vote makes me believe it too was intended to be a valid vote.

So then, it seems reasonable to conclude that it was the post made at 9:44pm which led him to believe that I was deliberately misleading town. If I am incorrect in this assumption, please let me know. Here is the post in question: http://mafia.peterlund.se/e/web/msgs?word=%22I+am+perhaps+placed%22

I should care to hear elaboration on this matter.

Setting Balki aside for now, stupidfighter comes in some hours later and unilaterally declares Oztra to be scum while simultaneously defending me. Granted, there's no justification there as to why he believes me to be town, but certainly one can interpret this to be an early pocket attempt.

The issue lies in that I also see little ostensibly scummy about Oztra's j'accuse. DO's judgment that there was absolutely no scum motivation behind it seems premature, but nonetheless.

Speaking of which, her claim that she has never played a game with me is untrue. We played a discord game together, unorthodox as it was, and she was also the GM for M27 so I presume she has as much meta knowledge on me as anyone else in the game does. But then why lie about something so easily disproven? Certainly there are a number of players who were with both of us in Tibet Inn. It bears thinking.

All of this is secondary to the bomb dropped by stupidfighter claiming mafia. The first instinct is to suppose that it's far too audacious of a ploy for scum to attempt, especially so early. On the other hand, what motive would a town have to make such a statement? Certainly the game is more muddied by his assertion, and of also note is how he specifically brought up the joke phase in his comment implies a certain defensive mindset.

Of the three, I would certainly rate stupidfighter to be the scummiest. I believe Maniac was the one who mentioned that in their most recent game, he claimed MVP. This lends credence to this being a bluff, as I'm not seeing how that was good town play.

Of Oztra I know little, but at least he's communicating.

I would like to hear Balki's opinions on people, rather than the mechanics of his gun claim.

Sup, checking in before i go to sleep. Thought this started Monday.

Balki, if he really has a gun, is probably town. No way scum takes a 50/50 shot like that.

Snowy's posts seem so stiff and articulate, and don't really seem to say a whole lot, but maybe that's because I've gotten used to him on Discord.

Thamrick was the ghost last time - he basically lurked, then outed and decided to help town, for whatever reason. Honestly, I don't think we really need to worry about ghost right now, he's not nearly as powerful a 3rd party as, say, bio in M24. Not much he/she can do.

Oztra is reminding me more and more of Damdaniel in that forum game he was scum: having no idea what to do but feels pressure to do something, so goes half-assed on a theory that makes no sense.

@Bo you called Oztra's observations decent? They made sense to you?

Oztra preempted me it seems. The maybe misleading stats, at least, I can assure to be absolutely true.

@Oztra would I be correct in believing you did not in fact make your determination after reading my 9:44pm post? If so, when did you start seeing misleading incongruities in my statements?

@snowy I didn't declare Oztra to be certain scum, and I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "unilateral" in this context, I have a vote just like everyone else and I used it. I've explained why I feel Oztra's play hurt the town.

That said, I feel my presence in the thread is currently hurting town. I'm going to withdraw form the game until and unless I have something of true importance to say.

@Moscow ... it is quite clear what his second observation about snowy is referring to and he has a point, albeit a very basic one, about stupidfighter. The others, no, I don't know what he was saying. It seems to me that snowy does, though, based on his most recent posts. Oz is doing townie things so far - his vote was quite obviously genuine - and playing the game instead of sitting on his hands, so I tried to give him a little bit of motivation to keep pointing out things that look weird to him throughout the remainder of the day. He made a read on snowy, tried to justify it, and then used that read to possibly connect another player. That is exactly what we're supposed to do. Not many newbies actually come in and represent well in their first game so when one comes along and does something right, you should give them some props and some motivation to keep an eye out and continue scumhunting throughout the day.

@stupidfighter ... backing down hurts town. Walking away when people have questions for you hurts town. I don't remember you being such a coward when a little heat came your way but it's been a long time I guess.

quote from snowy:
"Setting Balki aside for now, stupidfighter comes in some hours later and unilaterally declares Oztra to be scum while simultaneously defending me. Granted, there's no justification there as to why he believes me to be town, but certainly one can interpret this to be an early pocket attempt."
"why he believes me to be town"
therefore snowy is deliberately saying that he is mafia because he is implying that he is believed to be town, and is therefore not town.
snowy, i partly used that post and a few others to make my determination that you are scum. if you see my earlier post to bo that gives some reasons that i think you're scum.
also, snowy, if you believe stupidfighter to be scummy, why not put your vote to good use?

also thanks bo for motivating me
i know im new, but i can do semi decently at doing stuffs and following a lead. also, nothing else to do during school if you know what i mean.

@moscow... you are mostly correct that i am following a half assed lead, but it might go somewhere and seems semi decent.

"Snowy's posts seem so stiff and articulate, and don't really seem to say a whole lot"

This is consistent with how snowy communicated last game. He reminds me of bad movie dialogue that gets critiqued with the thought that nobody in real life actually talks like that.

"Oztra is reminding me more and more of Damdaniel in that forum game he was scum: having no idea what to do but feels pressure to do something, so goes half-assed on a theory that makes no sense"

@Moscow: You also say "Oztra is reminding me more and more of Damdaniel in that forum game he was scum: having no idea what to do but feels pressure to do something, so goes half-assed on a theory that makes no sense"

This is an odd viewpoint. You think scum newbie would feel more pressure to contribute something than town newbie?

@Oztra Good! Pursuing your reads!
I'm not bought into your conclusion yet, since your argument relies on his phrasing, and I'm not keen on jumping on that alone. Beyond that, your other points are okay, other than I know via meta that Snowy generally tries to avoid lynching new players D1, so that could be why he's asking.

@Balki Your gun could be more useful later if the fab guns are fired and yours gets confirmed real.

Was stupidfighter's concession real? It seemed so sudden and unnecessary. Only ONE person was accusing him of anything, and that accusation was not packed with evidence. If it is a joke, it isn't all that funny, or that well carried out. I am not sure what to think of it.
@Ezio, Hellenic Riot, Ikenako, and Kakarroto... wake up and post some insightful things for us to examine.
@