"Because all the jailings are somehow directly related to an event which happened 57 years ago"

After you bring up events from 1930, 1937 and 1950. Nice. And lets not talk about the FALN bombings throughout the United States, the perpetrators of which were most likely pardoned by the president of the United States

"And that shooting happened in a historical vacuum that wasn't preceded by decades of assassination and terror against the independence movement."

Which Im sure played into the President of the United States decision to release the people who shot 5 US congressmen from the viewers balcony

Yeah, because Puerto Rico = Assad's Syria. You're talking out of your ass.

"I'll remember that next time Syria comes out with a poll that says Assad has a 99% approval rating. "

CONNECT THE DOTS!!!!

"After you bring up events from 1930, 1937 and 1950. Nice."

Yes because it brings up a little thing called context.

"Which Im sure played into the President of the United States decision to release the people who shot 5 US congressmen from the viewers balcony"

You're the one who brought up the shooting as an excuse for the jailing of PR nationalists today, which has nothing to do with that event. It's a cheap guilt by association tactic that the US authorities have used to justify their continued repression.

"It's never OK to open fire on the US Congress, regardless of some alleged history of assassination and terror on an independence movement which barely seems to exist."

Assassinations and terror are fine and justified, and are given the qualifier "alleged". Any independence activist, however, is presumed guilty before you even bother to look at the facts. That's ok, I've gotten used to this hypocrisy by now.

Anything "barely seems to exist" so long as you have absolutely zero interest in the actual history of the movement.

Really, for someone who gnashes his teeth every time something happens in another country, you have a rather cavalier attitude towards atrocities against US colonial subjects. So much for your claim that you condemn US crimes. Don't ever give me your sanctimonious lectures about human rights again.

And most blacks don't advocate the program of the Black Panthers for two reasons. First, they're nuts. Second, they weren't a real party. Where was there a Black Panther alderman? Most were just thugs with a fleeting conscience. But I suppose it's impossible for a movement composed of corrupt criminals to be rejected by the black community organically...

"you have a rather cavalier attitude towards atrocities against US colonial subjects."

Frankly, they just sound like a small group of criminals. If a group is committing acts of violence it's totally fine for the government to move against them and try to put a stop to it. It's not like the peaceful end of the movement is outlawed. You're just looking for an injustice to get worked up about.

"Yeah, because Puerto Rico = Assad's Syria. You're talking out of your ass."

You don't even bother to investigate. You just take the reflexive "American never does anything wrong" position, like you always do. Activists are guilty because you say so. America never engaged in repression because you say so. Polls are no reflection of political repression, even though nationalist leaders are sitting in jail today, because you say so. Rah rah America.

"Most were just thugs with a fleeting conscience. But I suppose it's impossible for a movement composed of corrupt criminals to be rejected by the black community organically..."

This is really an outrageous comment, and demonstrates that this "discussion" is pointless. You don't bother to investigate, you just smear all Black Panthers as thugs and criminals. You don't even know what the Black Panthers advocated, which was an eminently reasonable program of self-help and caring for their own community. School lunch programs and the like.

"You're just looking for an injustice to get worked up about."

Right. Well it's only an injustice if some other country does it. America is so angelic it has grown wings and a halo.

Jesus, Putin33. Are there American tanks killing Puerto Ricans in San Juan? No. You can't even compare the two. Be serious.

Independence is always an option in referenda and so far they've always said no.

sure sure, because the vote doesn't align with Putin's beliefs Puerto Rico's vote must be either rigged, the product of intimidation, orUncle Sam's Mind control. Im not arguing past mistreatment of Puerto Ricans (although the relationship was always much better thatn it was with the Span-Am war conquests, though that doesnt say much) what Im saying is the only thing that is relevant is the PRs vote, which will be honored either way.

Jesus, Invictus. Because history doesn't matter right? Because activists rotting in jail for no reason doesn't matter, right?

Because there's not an insurrection going on right now that means Americans haven't assassinated and terrorized Puerto Rican activists.

You're ridiculous.

"Well it's only an injustice if some other country does it."

Does what? Move against a group that attacked the Capitol and tried to assassinate a president? There is no evidence the United States would to anything to stop Puerto Rico from becoming independent if the people of the island wanted it and went about it peacefully. Using violence is quite another thing and the federal government has every right to put down criminal behavior like that. Is this really such a hard thing for you to understand?

@Putin - If you hate it here so much, go to fucking Russia. We don't want you.

"And most blacks don't advocate the program of the Black Panthers for two reasons. First, they're nuts. "

Most of what the BPs did were inner city food drives and community outreach. They scared the crap out of white suburban denizens which is remarkably why a certain museum in the US calls them a Terrorist organization/

Kill off/jail the movement and then congratulate yourselves for the fact that independence isn't popular. Brilliant tried and true tactic. Colombia did the same thing with the UP. Oops, the UP isn't a popular party anymore. Because they're all dead or jailed.

sure

BTW somewhere on the internet you can see what the new flag would look like, the Army heraldry institute has designs for up to 56 states

"Is this really such a hard thing for you to understand?"

Right, right, keep repeating the same line about 1954 over and over, while ignoring 1937 and the campaign of terror which preceded it. "Oh but fighting back is never justified". Right, of course.

?"@Putin - If you hate it here so much, go to fucking Russia. We don't want you."

And leave the country in the hands of misanthropic fascists like you? No, sorry.

The circle one looks kinda dumb, but the stripped one looks nice.

Can I just say I am proud to live in a country that had the mercy to release a gang that shot 5 congressmen on the floor of the us congress. Dont think there are many countries that would do the same X)

i think the circle one kind of goes against the whole concept of our government, but it has been done in the past

Yeah I'm proud to live in a country that assassinated two people for no reason.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerro_Maravilla_incident

Merciful indeed.

A quick Wikipedia search shows that you UP was a front for the FARC, a terrorist group. Would you be so supportive of a party the equally brutal Colombian paramilitaries threw up?

I really don't understand why you're so worked up here, Usefulidiot33. The United States has jailed individuals who belonged to a group that committed acts of violence. But the independence movement as such is totally permitted and independence is an option on every referendum. That all just seems so reasonable, assuming one isn't caught up in delusions of revolutionary romance.

"Yeah I'm proud to live in a country that assassinated two people for no reason.

Merciful indeed. "

Probably why you support a country that assassinated 24 million ;)

"Their original plan was to set fire and sabotage the towers to protest the imprisonment of Puerto Rican nationalists convicted of the 1950 assassination attempt on U.S. President Harry S. Truman and the 1954 shooting at the United States Capitol where five members of Congress were injured."

I'd hardly say no reason. What the officers did was scandalous and unjustifiable and it's right that they were eventually held accountable for their actions, but these people who were killed were certainly not just off to deliver medicine to grandma.

You're so lazy it's pathetic. Wikipedia is the sum total of your desire to learn about any subject.

No I'm not in favor of killing off Uribe/Santos's political parties., as you seem to be with the UP, because you take the paramilitaries word for it that they were a FARC front.

I don't know about the rest of you all, but it seems Putin now advocates violence as a means of change *unless* the violence is directed against the cause celeb du jour. You can't have reasonable discussions with people who think terrorism and violence are a solution in a civilized world where other alternatives exist.

oh boy

"Wikipedia is the sum total of your desire to learn about any subject."

Demonstrably false. Look at links I've posted here going back years.Hardly any are from Wikipedia. It is, however, the sum total of the amount of effort I want to put in to arguing with a Kremlin Wall such as yourself.