What exactly is wrong with Mises? Their scholarship is well documented and their argument sound.

If you studied economic history, you'd know that there have been several evolutions of theory since Keynes that have affected monetary policy. Hardly anyone is a true Keynesian anymore

Japan's problem was inflation. Deficit spending was the Japanese government's undoing. It was the opposite of a deflationary problem.

*please show me where economists say deflation is good

Autocorrect

I'm familiar with the monetarists theory, if that's what you mean. An improvement, yes. But it still depends on government control of the money supply and like Keynesianism, it is driven by numbers rather than logic and common sense.

Okay, now you're just making things up

https://tradingeconomics.com/japan/inflation-cpi

For the past 20 years, Japan's inflation has been effectively 0.

Christopher P. Casey, Deflating the Deflation Myth, https://mises.org/library/deflating-deflation-myth

Johnsson, Richard C. B. "Deflation and Japan Revisited." The Quarterly Journal of Austrian Economics 8, No. 1 (Spring 2005): 15–29.

Okay, the first is not an academic study. I'll take a look at the second once I get access.

I don't think you'd find any economist that would say comparing the financial system of the 1800s and the financial system of the modern day would yield worthwhile results. And that's not even getting into data issues.

A Japanese Lesson
"All along, the Japanese yen has fluctuated wildly between 124 yen to the U.S. dollar in 1991, 99 in 1994, and 132 today. In the face of so much instability and adversity, Japanese authorities have sought guidance from the universal full-employment prescript which is Keynesian economics. They have wholeheartedly embraced the most influential formulation of the economic thought of the twentieth century and have deliberately pursued a policy of spectacular deficit spending in order to revive the economy." etc.
https://mises.org/library/japanese-lesson

I don't know why you wouldn't consider historical evidence from the 1800s. It supports a freer financial system than the one we had beginning in 1913. You have to look back to find an example in the US for a time when we were free of central banking. But even back then, you had the banks using their influence with politics to intervene and obtain advantages like fractual banking or limitations on use of other currencies like silver.

If you want to focus on contemporary evidence that decentralized financial systems work better, you can look at Singapore and Hong Kong.

Uhhhh, 30% fluctuation over three years isn't "wild". 10% a year is expected in business circles.

Bitcoin has done what...1000%? More?

Because there wasn't a fiat currency in the 1800s? One of many, *extremely important* differences

Correct me if i'm wrong, which I'm not, but bitcoin is married to some pretty deeply corrupt activities. Ive heard stories about people using it to exchange cocaine and heroin. I knew a guy down in Missouri who was like 26 and extremely wealthy. I always asked how he made his fortune, he told me bitcoin. Id try to dig deeper but he wouldnt wanna talk about it. Basically he used bitcoin to sell tons of cocaine I believe.

Point is, this is a currency not controlled by governments, not regulated by banks that leaves only one source of power: cartels, mafia, and criminal organizations.

Definetely a risky venture that is volatile. Hell no

I went back and looked at your link. It only went back ten years and shows a Japanese inflation between 0 and 3 % annually. If you go back to the 1990s, it was as high as 4%. The problem with the Japanese economy came from massive deficit spending. That's the reason the Japanese economy is floundering. Not deflation.

Brainbomb, BT is agnostic with who uses its currency. The currency itself isn't controlled by anyone. That's the beauty of the BT system.

The late 1800s offer several examples of roaring economic periods. There were recessions and panics, but arguably, they resulted on bank runs caused by the fractional reserve systems and failure of banking institutions to have specie on hand when demanded. Or banking/government interference in silver trade as an alternative to the Greenback. The Greenback was fiat currency issued by the central government.

I agree the recent run-up of Bitcoin prices are troubling (unless you were an early investor ; - ) ). However, as the BT currency gains more and more world-wide acceptances as an alternative to government-backed fiat currencies, it may actually appreciate even more. The limits on the amount of BT available cause prices to rise as demand for BT increases.

@Gold: That's basically what bankers do :P
And this debate seems kind of pointless to me since bitcoin will still be added to the economy, and you can break bitcoins down to around a millionth I think.

@Brain: Yes, you can buy drugs with bitcoin and it's been done in the past. (See Silk Road) You can also buy drugs with cash.

(unless you were an early investor ; - )

sounds like a ponzi scheme

It's very possible your friend made cash off bitcoin simply by buying it cheap and selling. It probably had nothing to do with drugs, and if it was, he got rich off selling drugs, not bitcoin.

lol Brad. There are many complaints you can make about bitcoin, but it's not even the same genre of a ponzi scheme.
You should probably research it for at least 5 minutes before judging it.

i would rather take that time and study real estate since that is where i made my money

nobody cares Brad.

how many of you 'brilliant' scholars actually 'own', not rent or pay mortgage on, property?

bah, your all renters. sad

actually not so sad, as that is where i derive some of my income, through renters payments

Bitcoin is a whole different level of risk because of the idea that if it becomes more than a fad the gov't could be forced to take action to shut it down. That threat alone makes it insanely volatile - it reminds me a bit of the marijuana stocks that started years ago and took off. Both had that fear of government stepping in and crushing it.

So is there an economic study on the cost of Bitcoin generation v its sell price now? Won;t it be self-regulating eventually?

two things can be true at once.

1. Bitcoin will crash, 1 bitcoin is not actually worth 10,000$, this is an obvious bubble
2. If you time the liquidity correctly, there is a lot of money to be made off of it

Frankly, I think this will make for a great case study in just how far the market can speculate until a crash occurs.

Imagine a game of Jenga where all the best Jenga players come together, and it's basically a bunch of Crosses stacked on top of one another.

Let's see how high we can go. 20,000? 30,000? 100,000?

as long as the bitcoins aren't being used as collateral, the extent of the crash will be alright... more of a dot.com bubble, less of 2008... but we also could have a lot of underbrush built up in the forest so to speak. Slow continued growth for nearly a decade now is the equivalent to no forest fires in a decade in a forest. Once there is one... it doesn't stop burning. this could act as a catalyst for a bigger crash, but we survived October... so if it does come it's going to be a pretty special event.

Also, we need to see whether or not Powell lowers the balance sheet, and whether or not inflation is going down the transitory or permanent path.

Also also how Trump will react.

Also also also whether or not NK tries to Nuke us.

Also also also also how Trump would respond to that.

That's a lot of alsos.

"I look forward to the day when I can bury my Bitcoins in a hole in the backyard."

You can store your wallet locally on your computer--that's how I lost my LTC.