For what it's worth, I'm getting somewhat convinced by semck and bosox that squiggs could be scummy. He's posted enough to deserve another good read-through.

I agree with you when you say that it's weird semck waited to push against you until someone took a shot at started the bandwagon. Seems like a way to deflect attention later on. Why'd you wait, semck?

@y2 - I agree that we have had a bad day, mainly because of people like you not posting enough. I think our chances of hitting non-human are low too. At this stage we are not going for a no-lynch. The only thing we can do is get rid of non-team players. I reiterate that I'm willing to go one-on-one with Krellin. I think he is either reptilian or a bad team player. If he's innocent, and I get him shot, I won't weep.

I still have my eye on you, but for now krellin is my target.

Please all. Either #vote Krellin or #vote maniac.

Can we disallow voting for oneself? It's going to throw off the vote counts as the GMs update them and then those votes are inevitably going to get moved at the end of the day because no one is actually going to keep a vote against themselves. It'll just make things confusing.

@bo,

I didn't "wait." I didn't think y2k was very suspicious until I saw Maniac's post, and then I thought it was a pretty good case, at least on the hypothesis that krellin is also Mafia (which I have no idea about).

It's not like I was worried about y2k voting for me. His whole case was based on my not having done anything, which I had already corrected by the time he posted.

No, Maniac. I don't happen to find either of you the most suspicious, and I'm not going to do it just because you two are on some little scuffle of your own.

For what it's worth, by the way, I still don't consider y2k all that suspicious unless krellin gets lynched and flips mob, in which case, the interpretation of that as an intra-mafia conversation would interest me quite a bit.

I doubt Krellin would want to throw in the towel this early if he were mafia, that would seriously piss off his teammates. Hence, I understand why you would be suspicious of me if he was in fact mafia for trying to prod him to man the fuck up. I really don't think he's mafia though, not at this stage.

GM Note: to cancel a vote for someone please go ##UNVOTE, alternatively you can just vote for a new candidate.

Fair enough, semck, point taken.

Ok, last post for a while.

@semck: Regarding krellin, his play has been strikingly similar to M2, where he was mafia. Maybe it is naive of me to think this, but I tend to believe krellin is a smart guy and that if he were a lizard this time around he would avoid making the same mistakes he did last time. I found krellin out precisely because he shielded himself from offering content by making it seem that attacking him was 'stifling discussion'. He said the same thing this game and I think it makes no sense for him to say the same thing that got him hanged last time. It is all just a feeling though, nothing concrete. I would just prefer to not lynch him today.
Regarding Squigs, I was the first to point out that he showed interest in determining the power roles and that he shouldn't. But it has been blown out of proportion. He also did this in the last game and was one of the selling points that got him hanged. He has been one of the most proactive players and I would not want to hang him on Day 1 for that reason. I also do not see how he is trying harder to be liked by others than in the previous game when he was vanilla, and do not understand why some people are calling him out for behaving differently to M3. I do not have a town lean on him, but feel that the case against him is far weaker than some people around here are trying to lead us to believe.

@ILN: post some content for the love of god. What good does it do to simply back off krellin and never even explain why you were voting for him in the first place. Also, post your reads on other players, you have posted very little and it has all been around krellin and WD. Scum tend to speak about the same players all the time. You smell like scum so far. If you are not, use some soap and post your reads on everyone.

@uclabb: I agree that bosox concerns were quite scummym but I tend to believe it was just a noob mistake. After seeing M3, he is still trying to get the hang of it. I was the first one to call him out for mentioning that and ghug eventually clarified my explanation on why it was scummy. Yet, I think that bosox has been active and helpful and do not support a day 1 lynch of him. I think that so far your top three suspects have been among the most active and possibly helpful people around here. Since your reads on M2 and M3 were quite accurate I am torn between suspecting you as mafia or thinking that all my reads are wrong so far. You had a scum read on pj who hardly posted on Day 1 in M2 and a scum read on YJ who posted a lot on Day 1 in M3. There is not even a pattern on who you went after and yet you were right on both counts. So I ask you, who is your top scum read so far and why? I would really appreciate a solid explanation that does not depend on just one slip, although I would understand if there is simply not enough info avaliable due to the lack of posts.

@ Guak - Your argument about Krellin's actions being the same as last time just doesn't ring true to me. There's something about this time in his defensive play that reads weirdly off. (but believe me when I say I'm not digging out a whole previous Mafia thread to check!) I also find it interesting that he's calmed down now quickly and is again willing to have conversation - almost like it was faked?

@Krellin - thanks for your response but I then have to agree with Semck's follow up, all your doing is stifling the information flow and not helping the discussion move forward.

@ Maniac - Similarly, trying to split a vote between you two is pointless, I would prob put Squigs up as my second choice, based on others comments but would need to re-read to put an actual vote in. I'm really not interested in voting for you and I don't see how - Not wanting to vote for Krellin = vote for Maniac

PJ, that often happens when you take a night to sleep it off. He's just more composed today, but that doesn't mean his emotions last night were less real.

Thank you guak.

I am leaving my vote on Squigs for now. I am also going to bed. I will get up later and have about ten minutes to evaluate where things stand and whether I should change my vote, before I have to leave for a meeting that will last past the deadline. Sorry about this.

I hope there is a vote count up early afternoon. I want to help ensure there are no ties.

"all your doing is stifling the information flow and not helping the discussion move forward."

AHhhhh ha ha ha!! Says the guy that votes for me because I disagree with him! Pot...ktettle...BLACK!

##VOTE MANIAc

er....I mean...

##VOTE PJMANSFIELD

Bo - No, we cannot disallow voting for oneself, as it is a legitmate vote. There is no law against suicide in Libtardia...I mean...WebDipistan...

anyone have a POST COUNT update so we can now move forward and lynch a lurker.

Enough conversation has been sitrred up that we know who is active, and who is not.

Voting for a “lurker” later on when we have more viable suspects is often viewed as wasteful/dangerous, since they provide no link to someone with conversational ties.

So…let’s pony up the urker list, and killa lurker.

YES – this is a dramatic change in krellin’s behavior. Ding ding ding. Yes, what I have been doing is playing a part, to provoke conversation, to provoke responses, to get people to draw up battle lines, to at least get people to post.

NOW…let’s take whatwe have, and use Day 1 to kill a lurker, because since Day 1 is a random-ass crap shoot, might as well use it to kill a lurker.

##UNVOTE

wating for post count so I can kill a lurker.

@guak- y2k has been one of the most active and helpful posters so far? I don't think so.

As far as my top scum read, I already posted who it is and why, but I can summarize again:

My to scum read is krellin, primarily because he has outright contradicted himself three times. First, he claimed he was just playing devil's advocate when he was arguing against early accusations, then he switched to outright condemnation of them. Second, he has tried to dismiss using past games as evidence, but then used past games as evidence himself. Third, he claims that he has accepted that we are going to lynch someone today, yet he doesn't want us to discuss who that should be.

Further, he hasn't actually contributed anything and has only "tried to generate discussion" about procedural issues that we all have already come to a consensus about.

Anyway, I can't be sure I will log in again until the end of the turn as, again, this is my first day of work, so I will get a vote back in, namely ##vote krellin.

@ Krellin - YAWN - voting for you because you disagree with me, NO.

Voting for you because I think your scum, YES

@krellin- Maniac posted a post count pretty recently if you want to go find it.

Current post count, assuming Maniac's last post was correct. I lost count once so it might not be perfect but it's close enough to get the point across.

Captainmeme 2
WD 5
ILN 6
Ghug 8
PJ 12
Chaqa 13
Y2K 13
Guak 15
Maniac 19
Semck 27
Uclabb 32
Bo_sox 33
Squigs 34
Krellin 53

Post count has nothing to do with post quality, but a few players need to come out and play a little more, that's for sure. Meme, WD, and ILN in particular need to be sure they stay involved. Ghug was gone, so he'll catch up. Y2K has been more active this morning, as has PJ. Chaqa hasn't posted since yesterday that I can recall and then there wasn't anything good anyway, so I'd say he's lurking right now. I think Guak is borderline on number of posts but what he's said has been quality, so he's all right. That's where we are though.

##VOTE ILN. Lurker, but not the lurkiest...just enough to feel he is safe. Scum!

He's brand new, don't lynch him on day one. Have some humanity (pun intended)...

pjmansfield - If you seriously think I am scum because of your vast psychic abiity, then vote for me -- have fun with that. I'll be happy to be the martyr so I can throw it in your face in some future mafia game - trust me on this one.

I am votign for a lurker becuase history dictate at least one mafia will be lurking...and there are fewer lurkers than active posters, therefore my % chance of hitting scum is higher by going for a lurker. I am *not* so ridiculously self-absorbed and arrogant as to actually think the postings of Day 1 nonsense (and MOST of it is bullshti and nonsense) gives me a true read on anyone...and history of mafic dictates I am right in this assertion.

So vote for me if you want. You are a fool. I will go for a "reasoned" random vote. You stick with your arrogance.

Bo - then YOU choose a lurker (lowest 4 of the current vote) and I will follow you.

I give my vote to Bo as long as he votes for a lurker.

Also, please note since the mafia has not yet had a night phase, there is no way they could have coordinated to say nobody should lurk -- thus, my suggestion to nab a lurker Using the historical precedence that at least one mafia will be lurking can NOT be a contrived mafia strategy. So if you believe history dictates a mafia is lurking, and you believe we must have a Day 1 lynch – I have just given you the best shot to kill a mafia Day 1.

Now, for those that think I’m a bad guy – continue to lynch me, and I’ll be coming after YOU on day 2, because I just presented the best Day 1 town strategy to be presented so far.