i think you should as long as the person has a valid excuse and an agreed upon start and stop for the pause is decided. also the pause time cant be too long. how long is too long. i dont know but whatever seems reasonable to everyone. pausing can be annoying but most people will if the above criteria are met. i think the above should be good enough to get a mod to force pause it too and unpause at the agreed time.

question: does everyone need to vote unpause once a game is paused?

@ Red Squirrel - Yes they do.
@ Geofram - Real life exists. We all have things to do aside from Diplomacy, and might have things higher on their priority list. People on this website tend to forget that sometimes. Just vote pause.

I disagree that a moderator has grounds to force pause a game. Force unpause yes, because someone capable of STOPPING play is wrong. The reason its a vote to pause is because everyone must agree, otherwise the player wouldn't need to vote.

Again, this is just me playing devil's advocate. I'd be furious if someone did this to me.

@Mafia

Real life exists in FtF too, but the game must go on.

Just ask Thucy! =)

"Real life exists in FtF too, but the game must go on." - Why must it?

yes but the point of playing online (not live) is so you can have time to do other things. sitting down to play FTF or a live game is committing to a long consecutive chunk of time and there in lies the difference. pauses should exist for online though in live play almost impossible and FTF only has the problem of no pause if its tournament play.

Then I ask you, why is the pause system a vote call? In FtF, the game can be paused if all players agree and the tournament allows, otherwise the player just has to take whatever comes out of his need to not play.

I've never heard of a case where players didn't pause, but I think its important to note the distinction that every player must AGREE to the pause.

I dunno. Basically the way I see it is, this is a game. It's meant to fun, a friendly experience between people. I mean, it's also ruthless and full of lies and deceit and betrayal. But fun lies and deceit and betrayal. Not being accomodating and gracious with things like pauses seems...rather counter to the entire point of a game.

i do think everyone should agree but if someone is not pausing just to be a dick i believe you should be able to appeal to a mod. i can see people not pausing if they have 17 and will likely win anyway but it is much more honorable to cast the vote even if you dont want to. as you say forced unpausing should be allowed

No you don't appeal to a mod, you get a sitter. I had completely forgotten that webDip allows for sitters for this exact reason.

Honestly, I don't get the urge to play the mystical "trve Diplomacy" (not that you do it, Geofram). That can never happen here anyway. If you want to play Calhammer's vision of Diplomacy, find some same-minded people and have fun. Many things are untrve here and honestly, the pause function is a step forward for me even though I haven't needed to use it, yet.

Don't expect that anyone else will take "upholding the spirit of the game" as an excuse for whatever you do here (even though someone will, of course). If you decide not to pause for whatever reason, fine, that's not against the rules here at all. But don't be pissed when others will treat you as a jerk because of it. Everyone's free to decide with whom he wants to play. Someone will not want to play with someone who doesn't pause, someone doesn't care. Big deal.

the problem is the like-minded people are scattered over the country so they have to play on webdip

http://webdiplomacy.net/rules.php
5. The Pause/Unpause feature is not a diplomatic tool

Whoa ulytau, why do you sound like you're attacking someone?

I'm not doing it to "uphold the spirit of the game," believe me, some of the shit I pulled in Boston was demented and I'm only glad that the webDippers found it sneaky rather than deplorable. I'm not talking about trying to spy on a conversation, that is sick and childish. Though, if you talk within earshot of the whole board, then you deserve whatever was leaked.

I already mentioned one trick here about fake NMRing. But we look at players past games, we even try to find out who they are in Anon to do it. What about sending messages to players knowing that their lifestyle doesn't allow them to respond before the phase change, leaving the blame for our orders not syncing in their lap.

There are tons of holes that webDip has created beyond the holes that FtF allows. There are more holes in FtF just because the physical world allows itself to be bent more often than the virtual, but its the same game.

You'd have to be the lowest of scum to not pause a game if a player came up with a serious emergency. But I think more players ought to look at sitters.

@bas, that's saying you can't say "I won't vote unless you give me this centre." but it does not say you have to vote. (to pause, we've already gone over why unpausing is a forced issue.)

I'm attacking only a strawman I constructed in that post. Though I remember there are sometimes threads with posts debating what is trve and what is not and that sickens me a lot so that strawman is partially based on that.

Noone will prove you that you used pause button as a diplomacy tool (unless you openly admit it). What I tried to say is that you can do a lot of nasty stuff here but if you decide to do it, be prepared to face consequences. Not pausing in press game in order to win will stick with you so if someone calls you out for it in the future, don't try to make up an excuse along the lines that such behaviour is cool in FtF.

I never said it was cool in FtF. The only reasons I brought up FtF is because my recent experiences led me to think outside the box. And the only reason I wanted this conversation was because I'm addicted to playing devil's advocate.

Well, I said you don't do it so we agree :) But I have to say you're not playing devil's advocate very well. Similarly to quality trolling, you must never admit your beliefs are in contradiction to your words until it's all over. How would a debate look if someone began with "This house believes..." and ended with "...I don't actually mean it, just playing devil's advocate here."

I know, it just seemed like the debate was turning into "this isn't FtF, it's webDip" and I needed to make it clear that I'm not talking about FtF.

I do not think refusing to pause a game is wrong. I think the backlash from the community once the game was over would be rough, but if a player refuses to have a sitter lined up for something they knew they were going to be away for, then they need to be prepared to find players that don't cooperate.

1) The rules clearly state that unpauses cannot be used as a diplomatic tool. If someone is refusing to unpause to force a draw or anything else, a mod should be contacted.
2) F2F games do *not* follow only the rules. There are always house rules or tournament rules that supersede the official rule book.
3) Live games are almost never paused by a mod. If a player doesn't want a pause, a mod will only pause under extreme situations. If all but one player wants a pause, a mod may inquire into why that last player doesn't want a pause.
4) I don't see why, for instance, a player should miss a turn because of a natural disaster. Similarly, I don't see why a player should miss a turn because one player didn't notice the request for a pause. Again, if a player specifically says they don't want to pause, a mod will rarely force pause.

Thanks for clearing that up abge. What are your opinions on the matter personally?

Personally?

I don't think live games should ever be paused. Unless someone has been a huge dick, I always pause when it's requested. It's just a game and I'd rather play with everyone later than play now without everyone.

And if it meant a win? If the one NMR meant taking the lot, would you consider not pausing when requested?

No. I get not pleasure from artificial wins.

I agree that a live game shouldn't be paused. I'll draw in a live game if some CD's end up changing the scope, even if I could win it.

As far as pausing non-live games...I don't care if people don't pause games I need a pause in, but I'll usually vote pause if someone asks (unless I don't see it).

In one of my games England once refused to pause and as a result broke though the stalemate line we had on him while I NMR'd. I will never play with that asshole again.

Why? Because he refused to accept anything but the win?

My viewpoint on someone not accepting my pause request is that while I have life issues that require me not to be online, they might have life issues that require them to tie up the game faster.