Why do people who have nothing invested in something so eagerly want it to fail? Something to do with the human condition?

@abge --I will assume you think I want it to fall or fail.
Answer=no
You also assume that I don't own some. Well in the end that is for me to know.

I am a markets guy and I like most of the banter here about topics such as these

Here's my problem with bitcoin - and yes, abge, I do not fully understand them, but do understand that they are a "secure" and anonymous form of e-currency.

1. While they are "secure" and abge insists that nobody can ever steal his bitcoins, evidence suggests the contrary. Perhaps it is because abge is smart and knows how to protect himself, etc...or maybe he's naive - I'm not sure -- but the idea that bitcoin can not be stolen is contradicted by numerous articles on the subject, involving hackers and phishing scams, etc. abge may be sophisticated enough to protect his wallet...but I'm not certain his mother and father are, or the vast majority of technologically naive humans, lead project engineer. despite years and year and years of being told not to, still click through emails from unknown people, cough up passwords, get nasty spyware installed on their computers, etc. which will lead to increased scams targeting bitcoins as they get more popular and make it just as insecure as existing forms of currency. EXCEPT…when my credit card is charged fraudulently, I can check it online, file a claim and have the charges reversed. Bitcoins…the anonymous, decentralized currency? No so…stolen BTC is gone under the current regime

2. One of the primary uses of BTC seems to be illegal activity, or anonymous transactions (presumably to hide activity - which one might want to do to avoid paying taxes, for example). The one "positive" is that they allow for the side-stepping of banking fees...while buying your cocaine from silk road, or shielding a high dollar transaction from federal eyes. This *may* be a good thing (if you are an anarchist, think payign taxes is wrong, etc) - but I'm not certain the upside compensates for the downside of anonymous criminal transactions, money laundering, etc.

I will surely be bashed now for being anti-technology, blah blah blah. I'm not. I love technology, have a house full of tech, everyone in the family has an ereader and a smart phone, etc etc etc, I hate cash and hardly ever carry it....I just don't see why this is the best possible solution to....toooo.....uh...what's the problem it's trying to solve????

I only say that because of the sensationalist way you're portraying what is happening. If you look at places like btc-e and bitstamp, which is where you should be getting your infor from (not CNBC), you'll see the price has been fairly stable the last few days and that this drop is less severe than the one in Dec. Prices fluctuate. It's nothing to be concerned over.

krellin

Cash has the exact same problems as what you listed above for BTC. People use cash every day anyway. Not much more to say.

"The slide continues"

This is the same slide and already stagnating for a bit. Once mtgox gets their shit together and secured and allows withdrawals again, which they claim is no later than Thursday, the price goes back on the up.

When you have an asset that can fluctuate 50% in less than two months I would be concerned if I were you. But if you have thAt kind of stomach to be able to handle the swings, I have a ton of stuff to sell you.

Sold

This market is new. It is still in its transient state. Such fluctuations should not be unexpected, especially when you look at the different causes.

I agree But I could argue there was no reason to have the valuation that it had to begin with, besides the hype. As I said If you can stand the heat all the power to you. But know that just cause a one point it exceeded 1100 doesn't mean it can go to zero

Yes, of course the high of 1000+ was an anomaly. I expect it to stabilize between 600-800 and then slowly creep up over time as people start actually using it more.

oh look, another OP decrying new technology he doesn't understand

krellin,

1. if someone charges your credit card online. The money is still gone. If someone robs a bank and takes "your" money, it is still gone. It's just that the credit card company or the bank "eats" the loss, not you. The only way to get the money back is to catch the thief, and even then, if they have hidden it well, it is still gone. Basically, all theft is really irreversible unless the perpetrator is caught.

2. Bitcoin are not really anonymous. Every transaction is public information. It's actually less anonymous than a cash transaction. If a drug dealer transacts business in cash, no one knows where it came from or where it goes. If a drug dealer tries to transact business with bitcoin, it leaves a permanent public record of where the money came from and to whom it went.

3. What problem is it trying to solve? I think one thing it attempts to solve is the government manipulation of money. A government cannot simply over spend, and then print more money to pay the debt.

And if that is the case, all you libtards would be fucked because every social program would go belly up and then everyone would be fucked because economies would crumble

@abge - great, BTC has the same problems as cash...so what's my argument for using it. You need to convince me it is somehow BETTER before we overthrow the current currency system. Change because kids think this is gee-qiz-cool isn't a good enough argument. Enough said...


"1. if someone charges your credit card online. The money is still gone. If someone robs a bank and takes "your" money, it is still gone" ....WRONG - I have had falsse charges reversed - it is not gone, because there is a corporation/federal governement that backs my money. My cash in the bank is federally secured. Not so with BTC as it currently stands.

2. Not really anonymous...well, if you are good enough at what you do online, they can essentially be anonymous. But...if they are not anonymous, then again, what's the point?

3. So the thing it is solving is government manipulation of money. lol that's funny. Not that I don't agree that governments manipulate money, but....oh, never mind. You may indulge your fantasy that bitcoin will suddenly sweep the world, the US dollar and other cash currency will dry up and the collective government will just throw up their hands and quit. Yeahhhhh.....I also own a Unicat that farts rainbows.


I'm not trying to bash this new technology...and morons like PE who have the attitude...it's NEW it **MUST** be awesome...do not make a convincing argument.

I'm just honestly trying to understand how this is better, without Utopian nonsense in which the new e-currency supplants government backed money and suddenly all economic systems work perfectly and nobody ever gets screwed again...because those pie-in-the-sky fantasies are silly.

3. Uh....what's the value of a bitcoin again? It's backed by nothing, and all value is...<pulls lever on slot machine>...Oh boy! today I'm RICHHHHHH!!

Yes, in time it will stabilize...and just like the the gambling market...er....I mean the stock market...value will rise and fall based upon factors for which you, as an owner, have no clue and no control. is this somehow better?

Abge. I want to know why you think $600-$800 is fair value for BTC

"I want to know why you think $600-$800 is fair value for BTC"

Because that's what people seem to be willing to pay for it

http://preev.com/

Actually, it seems they are only willing to pay $620 for one today...

Really that's your assessment. So what will you say when it's $75 and trading there. Everything in the world is only valued at what someone is willing to pay at the time they want it. Supply and demand

People's desire to believe a new technology is the second coming of gold get completely over zealous with owning a piece that they create a bubble and it seems with BTC, that that bubble might be about to pop. Maybe not but it sure looks like it.

krellin,

"1. if someone charges your credit card online. The money is still gone. If someone robs a bank and takes "your" money, it is still gone" ....WRONG - I have had falsse charges reversed - it is not gone, because there is a corporation/federal governement that backs my money. My cash in the bank is federally secured. Not so with BTC as it currently stands."
- You recovered it, because the credit card company was willing to take the loss, at which a fee was paid to them every time you used your credit card. The theft was still irreversible. I hope you don't believe that the thief gave the money back so you could get your money back.


"2. Not really anonymous...well, if you are good enough at what you do online, they can essentially be anonymous. But...if they are not anonymous, then again, what's the point?"
- Being anonymous is not the point of bitcoin. In fact, all transactions are public and verifiable... by anyone. That is the point.

"3. Uh....what's the value of a bitcoin again? It's backed by nothing"
- Money printed by governments isn't backed by anything either. If a government runs out, it has the ability to just print more. So, saying it is backed by the government is a hollow promise. The only reason printed money has value is because people believe it has value. That is the same thing that gives bitcoin value.

But your question is: Why is this better? Unlike printed money, there is a fixed number available. The government can't print more. Also, if the government issuing it collapses, so can the value of the printed money. But Bitcoin is not dependent on any government. It won't collapse if any particular government collapses.

You are sadly mistaken