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A place to discuss topics/games with other webDiplomacy players.
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manganese (100 D)
18 Aug 11 UTC
I love the retro look...
Also, I can finally tell fleets apart from armies.

http://img593.imageshack.us/img593/9541/rertro.png
36 replies
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gramilaj (100 D)
18 Aug 11 UTC
Chicago Tournament, Weasel Moot on September 9-10
Weasel Moot is coming up on September 9-10, and it would be great to have a strong webDiplomacy presence.
4 replies
Open
Tettleton's Chew (0 DX)
03 Aug 11 UTC
Great Articles Today
In the aftermath of the phony August 2nd deadline created by Geitner and Barack there are some absolutely excellent articles today.
44 replies
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Conservative Man (100 D)
18 Aug 11 UTC
KRELLIN
The grown-up bully. See inside.
103 replies
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Tettleton's Chew (0 DX)
17 Aug 11 UTC
Is Playing Diplomacy a "Right?"
How many teenagers and twenty-somethings fritter away their days playing diplomacy instead of making sure they get an education or aren't a burden on society?
99 replies
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King Atom (100 D)
18 Aug 11 UTC
Fire!
Just that.
14 replies
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spyman (424 D(G))
17 Aug 11 UTC
Why is America in so much debt?
The size of America's debt is staggering and it is really hard to imagine it ever being paid off and the long term negative consequences are very worrying. How did a country run by smart people allow itself to get into this awful predicament?
97 replies
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Yellowjacket (835 D(B))
15 Aug 11 UTC
variant idea
Has this been tried before?

So I'm thinking of attempting to design some kind of randomly generated map to stir things up and avoid the same old alliances and same old outcomes. Would the community be interested in something like this? Would the powers that be support it if I was able to develop a good one?
25 replies
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yebellz (729 D(G))
18 Aug 11 UTC
How to find your "Mute List"
Want to see a list of who you have muted (both in game or globally)? See inside for instructions.
13 replies
Open
King Atom (100 D)
17 Aug 11 UTC
Going Out With A Bang!
Like I said before, I'm leaving soon, so I'd like to have one last forum in which to annoy the hell out of you all. Simply put, I'm inviting all my friends to come and bitch before me. (friends meaning those of you on my lists)
22 replies
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Hugo_Stiglitz (100 D)
18 Aug 11 UTC
CALLING ALL FORUM FIREBRANDS
@TC, CM, Krellin, First Apple.....or anybody else who argues in the threads
24 replies
Open
yebellz (729 D(G))
17 Aug 11 UTC
Flag of the Austrian-Hungarian Empire?
Is anyone here knowledgeable on Austrian-Hungarian history? What would be the appropriate flag to represent the Austrian-Hungarian Empire in the context of the historical period related to the game of Diplomacy?
21 replies
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Yonni (136 D(S))
17 Aug 11 UTC
Life without parole for an ounce of coke and 3 joints
Just wondering what the community's reaction to a sentence like this would be?
http://www.alternet.org/rights/152038/how_3_joints_and_an_ounce_of_coke_got_an_oklahoma_grandfather_life_without_parole_/?page=1
49 replies
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ninjaruler (101 D)
17 Aug 11 UTC
No Message-Global Message
HEY! So I am in gameID=64922 its no messaging whatsoever but I have a global message to look at, I assume it is something about a multi getting kicked but I can't read it to get the little message at the top to go away, so how do I get it to go away?
7 replies
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Draugnar (0 DX)
12 Aug 11 UTC
Abgemacht is an asshat fucktard.
He is the worst mod fucking damaging the community by insisting on bumping a post to the top that insults graphically and abusively another player in the opening message. Let's see how the fucktard likes this post staying at the top!
106 replies
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Thucydides (864 D(B))
16 Aug 11 UTC
Stop Coddling the Super-Rich: NYT op-ed by Warren Buffett
Read: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/15/opinion/stop-coddling-the-super-rich.html?_r=4&ref=opinion
12 replies
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fortknox (2059 D)
16 Aug 11 UTC
Mod Email, unpausing, etc...
I had to get a cervical epidural (that'd be in the neck) yesterday that put me out of order for a bit, so I'm behind in the mod email list, but I'll get to it later today. Thanks for your patience.
3 replies
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FirstApple (100 D(B))
17 Aug 11 UTC
Why is the colonial variant disabled?
I noticed that there are four other variants that are on the server yet are disabled. What is the purpose of this? Wouldn't more variants mean more gameplay for the members here? I know I'm new here so if there was a good reason before I left, I'm interested in hearing about it.
7 replies
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King Atom (100 D)
16 Aug 11 UTC
Sort of a Goodbye
School will be starting soon, so I'll have trouble keeping up with all of my games. I will definitely be taking a break, so you might not see me again until December. By then, I'm sure I'll have several new people to argue with in the forums and quite a few of you will have forgotten about me. But that's great! Wouldn't it be nice to have some worshippers on WebDiplomacy? That way I'd win every game!
4 replies
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Draugnar (0 DX)
16 Aug 11 UTC
I need cheering up... :-(
I'm sitting here unable to focus on work and contemplating why I even bother sometimes...
53 replies
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Conservative Man (100 D)
09 Aug 11 UTC
Am I being naive here?
I never understand why people would ever want to have one-night stands/casual hookups. If you're attracted to someone enough to fuck them, why wouldn't you want to date them? I mean, I'm sure sex is fun, but wouldn't a relationship+sex be even more fun?
196 replies
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Tru Ninja (1016 D(S))
09 Aug 11 UTC
Recruiting for a new game
101-200 D | WTA | 1.5 - 2 day phases | anon / non anon | classic
36 replies
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abgemacht (1076 D(G))
17 Aug 11 UTC
Portland, OR
Had some time to explore Portland, OR today. It was really nice. Clean, not congested, I never had to wait to cross the street. Overall, a much "happier" city than Boston. Oh, and a cute chick was dancing around flashing people, so no complaints there.
15 replies
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pjmansfield99 (100 D)
17 Aug 11 UTC
The Troll Hunter
Just saw a trailer for this film at the cinema and made me chuckle - so appropriate!! http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1740707/ Pj
1 reply
Open
Draugnar (0 DX)
16 Aug 11 UTC
This time on Philosophy Weekly...
Is hellalt dipshit #1? Or is he dipshit #2? And is he full of #2?

:-)
3 replies
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obiwanobiwan (248 D)
09 Aug 11 UTC
England's Riots
Does anyone oever there--or over here, for that matter--know what's going on, ie, why these folks are rioting?

All I get in searching for it are notifications about England's...cricket team...? And a friendly? Is that it, is this all one big "soccer riot," so to speak, or has Yahoo's serach engine failed once again, and there are real, important reasons behind all this?
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Gunfighter06 (224 D)
11 Aug 11 UTC
The British cops need to get their shit together. These riots have gone on for far too long. Careful application of excessive force can work wonders...
SergeantCitrus (257 D)
11 Aug 11 UTC
For real! They should learn from Syria. That's a country that has it together.
Sargmacher (0 DX)
11 Aug 11 UTC
For all those in the UK, there is a special episode of Question Time on tonight (in 20 minutes on BBC1) dealing with the riots.

As David Dimbleby said, if parliament can be recalled during the summer so too can Question Time.
Octavious (2701 D)
11 Aug 11 UTC
Ah, good old QT. What we really need right now is half a dozen people talking an length about how they don't really know why it happened, punctuated by a few cheap jokes by the token comedian and pointless political pointscoring.

For those of you wanting to take a traditional British stand (in both its style and ultimate pointlessness), you may want to consider joining this...

https://www.facebook.com/#!/event.php?eid=261568193854371

Huzzah! That'lll make the rioters think twice!
Sargmacher (0 DX)
11 Aug 11 UTC
"What we really need right now is half a dozen people talking an length about how they don't really know why it happened"...like our parliament then?
Octavious (2701 D)
11 Aug 11 UTC
You missunderstand the purpose of parliament. Parliant takes several hundred ghastly people, united in their hunger for power and skill at lying, and keeps them in an over crowded room where they can't hurt anyone or bugger things up.
Sargmacher (0 DX)
11 Aug 11 UTC
Actually, my comment was meant to be a humorous and facetious response to your own. Are you trying to be funny with comments like "You missunderstand the purpose of parliament" or are you actually just smug and condescending?
Sargmacher (0 DX)
11 Aug 11 UTC
Because it's one too many comments like that for me to know how to read your tone anymore.
Octavious (2701 D)
11 Aug 11 UTC
@ Sarg

Yes, I am trying to be funny, and yes I am smug and condescending. Honestly, man, just because I don't feel inclined to write lol after every other message doesn't mean I don't appreciate your humour.
Sargmacher (0 DX)
11 Aug 11 UTC
Ok, man.
Asher Powers (0 DX)
11 Aug 11 UTC
Look, all I know is that it is every American's dream to be on TV, and in England they have cameras everywhere and the kids just want to cover their faces and wreck everything?!? I think everyone would be happier if they made aired CCTV live and made Jeff Probst the host.
Octavious (2701 D)
11 Aug 11 UTC
I have no idea who Jeff Probst is, but it's an interesting point. Personally I think it may have more to do with a love of danger than fame. When it comes down to it, riots are really quite exciting. Fire, noise, violence, the risk of being caught... Part of me can see the attractive side. We have made life far too safe for youngsters today, and teenagers need more than that.
Asher Powers (0 DX)
11 Aug 11 UTC
All I know is that it is every American's dream to be on TV and in England all the kids want to do is cover their faces and wreck everything... I think everyone would be a lot happier id they aired CCTV live on BBC 24/7 and made Jeff Probst the host.
Asher Powers (0 DX)
11 Aug 11 UTC
sorry for the repeat, and Probst is the "Survivor" host.... Who will be the next voted off the island? I vote Edward.
ulytau (541 D)
12 Aug 11 UTC
Good for Edward, at least he won't be beaten to death by them hoodie mobsters who are plaguing the island right now.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
12 Aug 11 UTC
or eaten by werewolves...
Sargmacher (0 DX)
12 Aug 11 UTC
or a swarm of killer bees.
Gunfighter06 (224 D)
12 Aug 11 UTC
@ SergeantCitrus

Hahaha. That's not what I meant. Why don't they declare martial law and call in the army? Britain still has an army, right?
obiwanobiwan (248 D)
12 Aug 11 UTC
^
I hadn't thought of that...that IS a good question--

Why doesn't England just declare martial law and bring in the troops? That might sound like an overly-forceful "Yankee" solution to the problem, but surely the amount of damage and disorderliness warrants it...
Sargmacher (0 DX)
12 Aug 11 UTC
1. The violence has abated now.
2. The British Army's purpose is not for use against it's own people and it would be unprecedented to see our own soldiers on the streets. Soldiers don't even want to do such a job and it isn't theirs to do.
3. Soldiers are very different to trained police.
4. This is police matter.
5. Only if the violence got so out of control that the police could not possibly deal with it on their own (a boundary that hasn't been reached), then the army should be used as a last resort. And not as a gung-ho reactionary measure.
orathaic (1009 D(B))
12 Aug 11 UTC
prison sentences are a waste, community service to repair the damage done makes more sense. discuss.
Octavious (2701 D)
12 Aug 11 UTC
Bring in the army? All three of them? Like Sarg says, it's not the sort of thing that the British army wants to do and would be very bad for moral, and they're not all that good at it. Besides, the riots have already been quashed by the power of the great British drizzle, and there are more than enough police about when they put their minds to it.

As far as comunity service goes, what would you get them to do? One of the reasons so many of these people have no jobs is because they lack anything close to a skill (either by being too young or too pathetic). I can't see them making any significant contribution to the repair work even if they wanted to. You could march them into a mine and only let them out when they achieve a certain tonnage, but even that would be more trouble than it's worth.

Shove them in gaol for a couple of months, and let them reflect on what they've done and get a better appreciation for the freedom they have when their out.
Sargmacher (0 DX)
12 Aug 11 UTC
The seriously criminal cases aside, I think in a lot of cases community service would be the right penalty. Many of the young people who participated in the violence and looting were doing so because they have no opportunities and they have been disregarded as useless and mindless by people like Octavious who condemn them as 'lacking anything close to a skill'.

We need to give these people a role in society otherwise they will keep behaving in this way.

The problem with simply sending them to prison for a couple of months 'to reflect on what they've done' is that they clearly aren't the type who sit and reflect much - and it seems hypocritical of people like Octavious who condemn these people as having no skills, as being mindless, but then arguing that they just need to 'think' about their actions.

This is an opportunity for us to do something different. We shouldn't condemn people in society as 'too pathetic' or 'beyond help' - and giving them community service jobs to repair the damage they've done what be a step in the right direction to rehabilitating them as useful members of society. Training them in skills is surely a better way to turn them on the right path then locking so many of them away to sit in a prison together feeling even more angry with a society that tells them they have no part in.
Sargmacher (0 DX)
12 Aug 11 UTC
*Training them in skills is surely a better way to turn them on the right path then locking so many of them away to sit in a prison together feeling even more angry with a society that tells them they have no part in it.
Octavious (2701 D)
12 Aug 11 UTC
Sarg, you really don't have to insult me every time we disagree, you know?

The fact remains that there exist useless people in society. People with neither skills, intellect, or even a redeeming likable personality. Claiming otherwise does not make this less true. It is something we have to live with.

Still, I can't recall saying that the rioters were mindless. I dare say some of them are, and I expect many of them lack skills, and I am quite sure that almost all of them would be completely unsuited to doing riot repair work. Even if they were then I doubt having them cleaning up the damage while angry locals glare at them, spit at them, and insult them will do all that much to calm things down.

I find it disappointing that you think so little of these people that you believe them unable to reflect upon their actions. I don't think much of them, and believe most of their problems are their own making, but at least I still see them as human.
fulhamish (4134 D)
12 Aug 11 UTC
This is pretty good I think:

Peter Oborne
Peter Oborne is the Daily Telegraph's chief political commentator.
The moral decay of our society is as bad at the top as the bottom

By Peter Oborne Politics Last updated: August 11th, 2011


David Cameron, Ed Miliband and the entire British political class came together yesterday to denounce the rioters. They were of course right to say that the actions of these looters, arsonists and muggers were abhorrent and criminal, and that the police should be given more support.

But there was also something very phony and hypocritical about all the shock and outrage expressed in parliament. MPs spoke about the week’s dreadful events as if they were nothing to do with them.

I cannot accept that this is the case. Indeed, I believe that the criminality in our streets cannot be dissociated from the moral disintegration in the highest ranks of modern British society. The last two decades have seen a terrifying decline in standards among the British governing elite. It has become acceptable for our politicians to lie and to cheat. An almost universal culture of selfishness and greed has grown up.

It is not just the feral youth of Tottenham who have forgotten they have duties as well as rights. So have the feral rich of Chelsea and Kensington. A few years ago, my wife and I went to a dinner party in a large house in west London. A security guard prowled along the street outside, and there was much talk of the “north-south divide”, which I took literally for a while until I realised that my hosts were facetiously referring to the difference between those who lived north and south of Kensington High Street.

Most of the people in this very expensive street were every bit as deracinated and cut off from the rest of Britain as the young, unemployed men and women who have caused such terrible damage over the last few days. For them, the repellent Financial Times magazine How to Spend It is a bible. I’d guess that few of them bother to pay British tax if they can avoid it, and that fewer still feel the sense of obligation to society that only a few decades ago came naturally to the wealthy and better off.

Yet we celebrate people who live empty lives like this. A few weeks ago, I noticed an item in a newspaper saying that the business tycoon Sir Richard Branson was thinking of moving his headquarters to Switzerland. This move was represented as a potential blow to the Chancellor of the Exchequer, George Osborne, because it meant less tax revenue.

I couldn’t help thinking that in a sane and decent world such a move would be a blow to Sir Richard, not the Chancellor. People would note that a prominent and wealthy businessman was avoiding British tax and think less of him. Instead, he has a knighthood and is widely feted. The same is true of the brilliant retailer Sir Philip Green. Sir Philip’s businesses could never survive but for Britain’s famous social and political stability, our transport system to shift his goods and our schools to educate his workers.

Yet Sir Philip, who a few years ago sent an extraordinary £1 billion dividend offshore, seems to have little intention of paying for much of this. Why does nobody get angry or hold him culpable? I know that he employs expensive tax lawyers and that everything he does is legal, but he surely faces ethical and moral questions just as much as does a young thug who breaks into one of Sir Philip’s shops and steals from it?

Our politicians – standing sanctimoniously on their hind legs in the Commons yesterday – are just as bad. They have shown themselves prepared to ignore common decency and, in some cases, to break the law. David Cameron is happy to have some of the worst offenders in his Cabinet. Take the example of Francis Maude, who is charged with tackling public sector waste – which trade unions say is a euphemism for waging war on low‑paid workers. Yet Mr Maude made tens of thousands of pounds by breaching the spirit, though not the law, surrounding MPs’ allowances.

A great deal has been made over the past few days of the greed of the rioters for consumer goods, not least by Rotherham MP Denis MacShane who accurately remarked, “What the looters wanted was for a few minutes to enter the world of Sloane Street consumption.” This from a man who notoriously claimed £5,900 for eight laptops. Of course, as an MP he obtained these laptops legally through his expenses.

Yesterday, the veteran Labour MP Gerald Kaufman asked the Prime Minister to consider how these rioters can be “reclaimed” by society. Yes, this is indeed the same Gerald Kaufman who submitted a claim for three months’ expenses totalling £14,301.60, which included £8,865 for a Bang & Olufsen television.

Or take the Salford MP Hazel Blears, who has been loudly calling for draconian action against the looters. I find it very hard to make any kind of ethical distinction between Blears’s expense cheating and tax avoidance, and the straight robbery carried out by the looters.

The Prime Minister showed no sign that he understood that something stank about yesterday’s Commons debate. He spoke of morality, but only as something which applies to the very poor: “We will restore a stronger sense of morality and responsibility – in every town, in every street and in every estate.” He appeared not to grasp that this should apply to the rich and powerful as well.

The tragic truth is that Mr Cameron is himself guilty of failing this test. It is scarcely six weeks since he jauntily turned up at the News International summer party, even though the media group was at the time subject to not one but two police investigations. Even more notoriously, he awarded a senior Downing Street job to the former News of the World editor Andy Coulson, even though he knew at the time that Coulson had resigned after criminal acts were committed under his editorship. The Prime Minister excused his wretched judgment by proclaiming that “everybody deserves a second chance”. It was very telling yesterday that he did not talk of second chances as he pledged exemplary punishment for the rioters and looters.

These double standards from Downing Street are symptomatic of widespread double standards at the very top of our society. It should be stressed that most people (including, I know, Telegraph readers) continue to believe in honesty, decency, hard work, and putting back into society at least as much as they take out.

But there are those who do not. Certainly, the so-called feral youth seem oblivious to decency and morality. But so are the venal rich and powerful – too many of our bankers, footballers, wealthy businessmen and politicians.

Of course, most of them are smart and wealthy enough to make sure that they obey the law. That cannot be said of the sad young men and women, without hope or aspiration, who have caused such mayhem and chaos over the past few days. But the rioters have this defence: they are just following the example set by senior and respected figures in society. Let’s bear in mind that many of the youths in our inner cities have never been trained in decent values. All they have ever known is barbarism. Our politicians and bankers, in sharp contrast, tend to have been to good schools and universities and to have been given every opportunity in life.

Something has gone horribly wrong in Britain. If we are ever to confront the problems which have been exposed in the past week, it is essential to bear in mind that they do not only exist in inner-city housing estates.

The culture of greed and impunity we are witnessing on our TV screens stretches right up into corporate boardrooms and the Cabinet. It embraces the police and large parts of our media. It is not just its damaged youth, but Britain itself that needs a moral reformation.
Maniac (189 D(B))
12 Aug 11 UTC
Peter Oborne +1
Sargmacher (0 DX)
12 Aug 11 UTC
Octavious, in one breath you say that you “find it disappointing that I think so little of these people that you believe them unable to reflect upon their actions” yet you yourself condemn them as ‘useless people in society’.

You say there are ‘People with neither skills, intellect, or even a redeeming likable personality. Claiming otherwise does not make this less true. It is something we have to live with.’ And whilst the former is true – people do exist without skills or intellect – the latter statement that we ‘have to live with it’ is absolutely not true at all. There is no reason for us to simply put up with such a situation or accept the status quo. Things can change.

Moreover, I never said that I believe these people unable to reflect upon their actions – so please don’t put words into my mouth. I said that, based on their actions, the perpetrators are clearly people who have not spent much time reflecting. If you think about it properly before pompously jumping down my throat you will easily see that I was not seeing that they lack the ability to reflect, merely that they don’t spend much time doing so, clearly have not been taught how and have no desire to, and so therefore throwing them in prison , as you said, to reflect on their actions would be a completely futile act only serving the purpose of brushing the problem under the carpet for a few months or years. I of course see these people as human beings which is why I said they need opportunities not prison sentences.


As for your comment that you can’t remember calling them ‘mindless’, I did not put those words into your mouth – I said people like you, who have argued the same narrow right-wing opinions that you did in your previous post. And with regards to insulting you, that was not my direct intention – although I do feel passionately against the devil-may-care position you are taking on some of these issues.
However, I agree with you on your very fair counterpoint to community service when you commented that ‘I doubt having them cleaning up the damage while angry locals glare at them, spit at them, and insult them will do all that much to calm things down.’ This could easily happen and from this point of view community service would be the wrong direction. I do think work schemes would be a better use of money on these people rather than wasting lots of money locking them up in a prison where their attitudes aren’t really going to change. Also, in prison they will inevitably have to be placed with other rioters and it will just give them some downtime to get together and plan revenge attacks and ways to get round the police in future disruption.
Sargmacher (0 DX)
12 Aug 11 UTC
@Maniac: Peter Oborne is right, although it is a point that has been made by many already.

However, I don't think this a problem just in our country but something that many countries across the world have to deal with.
Gunfighter06 (224 D)
12 Aug 11 UTC
Despite lack of training in riot control, a NATO-type military (or any disciplined military) can be very useful in ending widespread riots. I know the British don't really have any history of martial law or military involvement in domestic unrest, but the military is an a effective tool. After the National Guard and the Marines showed up, the '92 LA Riots ended very quickly.

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166 replies
King Atom (100 D)
16 Aug 11 UTC
Word Association Thread
I literally joined the day the last one ended, so I would like to start another. For those of you who don't know, just write a word and then you write the first word that comes to your head.
19 replies
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Sydney City (0 DX)
16 Aug 11 UTC
Unpause game PLEASE
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=64619#gamePanel
This has Been emailed to mods- but no reply
2 replies
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King Atom (100 D)
16 Aug 11 UTC
Raise Your Hand if You Don't Know Me!
I'm pretty sure that very few of you would raise your hand, but I'd just like to clarify: Nobody here actually knows me.
SO QUIT ACTING LIKE YOU DO!
7 replies
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Conservative Man (100 D)
16 Aug 11 UTC
School started today......
This year is gonna be really fucking hard. But it's worth it.
73 replies
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