Forum
A place to discuss topics/games with other webDiplomacy players.
Page 760 of 1419
FirstPreviousNextLast
Tettleton's Chew (0 DX)
29 Jun 11 UTC
What's in a defintion
A sign in a parking lot says American Made Cars only. What's in a definition?
84 replies
Open
BenGuin (248 D)
03 Jul 11 UTC
Team Games and Declaration of War
I know that this idea have been going around a long time, but I want to add some twist to it be predetermining the alliances... anyone intrested?
7 replies
Open
quebeclove (109 D)
22 Jun 11 UTC
SoW game
I would love to be a student in an SoW game. Would people have any interest?
237 replies
Open
Ulysses (724 D)
03 Jul 11 UTC
Terrorist killed in Afghanistan just hours before posting a video online
http://tinyurl.com/3awf6d2
4 replies
Open
Furball (237 D)
03 Jul 11 UTC
webDiplomacy: 1 year anniversary!
Hey all!! It's been 1 year since the first time I came online in webDiplomacy!!
I'm congratulating myself!!
Not exactly one year, but about 1 year!
9 replies
Open
Sicarius (673 D)
24 Jun 11 UTC
War and Peace
.
Page 1 of 3
FirstPreviousNextLast
 
Sicarius (673 D)
24 Jun 11 UTC
In a remarkable act of chutzpah, the administration sent to Congress its response to the growing concern over its abuse of war powers. Its argument, in a nutshell, is that the War Powers Resolution is not relevant because US armed forces are not actually engaged in hostilities because Libya is so militarily weak it cannot fight back! This explanation would be laughable if not so horrific. The administration wants us to believe that there is no real violence because the victim cannot fight back? Imagine if this standard was applied to criminal law in the United States! I am sure Libyans on the receiving end of US and NATO bombs feel hostilities are quite definitely taking place.
We must recall the origins of these attacks on Libya. The Obama administration made no claim that Libyan leader Gaddafi was killing his civilian population. Rather, the claim was that Libya might begin killing its civilians in the future. One need not defend Gaddafi's regime – and I most certainly do not – to object to this flimsy and dangerous rationale for violating the sovereignty of another country. Imagine a scenario where the UN approves military action against the United States as a preventative humanitarian measure over US enforcement of its immigration laws, for example!
Now in Libya we see the possible use of depleted uranium shells, we see infrastructure destroyed, we see universities bombed, we see all the "collateral damage." Yet, this is a "humanitarian intervention”? Remember, we were told that this attack would last "days, not weeks" and we are already three months and likely nearly a billion dollars into it. As the bombings obviously target Gaddafi's houses, even killing some of his family members, we can see that the real goal is regime change rather than protection of civilians. Do we know much about the rebels whose side we have taken in what is, in fact, a civil war?

This comes days after the the pentagon said “A response to a cyber-incident or attack on the US would not necessarily be a cyber-response, All appropriate options would be on the table.” A White House statement also said the US plans to “respond to hostile acts in cyberspace as we would to any other threat to our country,” implying that computer hackers could soon face retaliatory attacks by the US military.
So when the US decides to invade foreign nations, often times without necessary congressional approval, it is just a simple act of exerting kinetic energy. But when a computer hacker correctly guesses a password and breaches the security protocols of the US government or one of its contracted companies, this is an act of war. And so it goes in the arbitrary world of the military-industrial complex, where definitions of war are applied only when it benefits the corporate oligarchy.

In truth, this latest cyber fear mongering out of the Pentagon is just another excuse for those running the US government to widen the scope of those it considers to be terrorists and enemies of the state. And now that the announcement has been made, you can expect to hear about many more “cyber-attacks” that will predicate convenient excuses to launch new kinetic military actions against nations, groups, and perhaps even fellow American citizens.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whytAReStUQ&feature=related
Sicarius (673 D)
25 Jun 11 UTC
I detect a hint of sarcasm.
Sicarius (673 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
It's all dominos

http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/features/2011/06/201162114131825860.html

http://english.aljazeera.net/focus/2010/08/201082214554232983.html
Gunfighter06 (224 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
@ Sicarius

Frankly, why is this a big deal? It's not like we're in an expensive, bloody ground war. Our allies are doing most of the work. I think the resources in Libya should be redeployed to Afghanistan, where they could actually do some good. We should just put a JDAM through Gadhafi's bedroom window and be done with it.
taylor4 (261 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
1. NATO allies' financial war contributions fraction of US costs.
2. Casualties. UK moving all Afghanistan homeland funerals to side streets, to minimize Large crowds of mourners and on-Lookers.
3. Syria. Hezbollah has moved all missiles to Lebanon and out of Syria, as Damascus will fall to the insurgency/democracy installed by, who else? The mods at Geekville and Farmville.
4. Ancient Athens compelled its allies to impose "democracy" like theirs (tho resident aliens, slaves and women had no say); the Soviet Union gone, there is no Sparta out there, only pirates ...
5. Libya. Civil war. The American Civil War was just as inhumane; thus, the New York city draft riots.
6. Realpolitik. Oil and mineral wealth of insecure Afghanistan.
7. US domestic opinion. The elitists in power have come up against right, left & centrist opinion in the House resolutions.
But, they are still in power.
8. Civil disorder, or a military takeover? Hither & yon, unlikely in Egypt, now imminent in Utopia
Sicarius (673 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
"Frankly, why is this a big deal?"
um... It's war. War is considered by most humans of any time to be a horrible thing to be avoided at all costs. War is hell.

define expensive.
The US alone has already spent at least 400m with it costing on average 100m a week. and those are old figures.

Why is the US in yet another war, in libya, in the first place?
Sicarius (673 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
WASHINGTON - The cost of the air war in Libya for the U.S. military has reached $608 million, a U.S. defense official said April 11.
Gunfighter06 (224 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
So? The Stimulus cost a hell of a lot more than that and did a hell of a lot less. Normally, I disagree with Obama on everything. He should have gotten congressional approval, but I think he is right to attack Libya.

And it's not a war. It's a civil war. Libya versus Libya. Airstrikes don't count as "war" in the traditional sense of the word.
Sicarius (673 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
http://www.mennoweekly.org/blog/2011/6/27/oppose-all-wars-especially-half-wars/?print=1
Invictus (240 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
I almost agree with Sicarius here. This is an illegal war. Illegal because Obama sought no Congressional authorization to send forces into combat when not responding to an attack or grave threat (the more serious one), and illegal because what we're doing now goes beyond the UN authorization. Without the authorization of Congress it's illegal at first principles, so the UN thing matters less.

What we should have done was give the rebels loads of weapons like we did to the fighters in Chad when Gaddafi kept invading in the 1980s. Instead we're fighting a war while pretending not to, and have only just a last week or so really decided to make Gaddafi a target. If he had been targeted in the beginning and killed this conflict would be, if not "over," at least not a civil war on this level. Gaddafi is the state, and with him alive the Libyan people cannot hope to move on.

The only good thing to come out of this intervention is that it totally discredits the "responsibility to protect," which hopefully will keep us out of future boondoggles. There's no way you can defend going into Libya but not Syria and be consistent based on humanitarian grounds.

This whole operation is a scandal. We went in for no good reason, and once in fought with both arms and one leg tied behind our backs, all the while blatantly ignoring the Constitution.
Sicarius (673 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
"So? "
War is atrocious. Horrendus. I dont know how anyone could support any war, for any reason, with the possible exception of self defense.

"Airstrikes don't count as "war" in the traditional sense of the word. "

The most recent figures from Libya's health ministry show 856 civilians have been killed in NATO air raids since they began in March. The figure could not be independently confirmed.
I'm sure the libyans being bombed may disagree with your douchebag definition of what a war is and isnt.
Invictus (240 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
"And it's not a war. It's a civil war. Libya versus Libya. Airstrikes don't count as "war" in the traditional sense of the word. "

No. We have committed acts of war on Libya. By your logic, if Russia started bombing Ukraine after a disputed election that wouldn't be a "war." I'd hazard to guess the Ukrainians would think differently. There may have been no 19th century gentlemanly declaration of war, the military is killing people. That's a war.
Invictus (240 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
There may have been no 19th century gentlemanly declaration of war, BUT the military is killing people.
Sicarius (673 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
Yeah I agree with invictus.
except that maybe that its a war for 'no good reason'

If libya's top export was yams I doubt this would have happened.
Draugnar (0 DX)
27 Jun 11 UTC
OK, just to chime in quick.

It wasn't illegal to follow the UN mandate for up to 30 days. The President has that leeway, but beyond 30 (and we are no beyond 90) required the grave threat to extend to 90 days and beyond that requires Congressional approval. It is now an illegal war. The President can prevaricate and say "no soldiers on the ground" but if even one manned sortie flies over (and there have been manned ones) then soldiers' (airmens') lives have been put at risk and it requires Congressional approval. At least G W Bush had the good sense to get his intel people to come up with an excuse and take it to Congress (even if it was bogus).
Invictus (240 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
Under the Constitution it was never legal. The president can only initiate the use of force in response to an attack or grave threat to the United States without the authorization of Congress. Such was never the case in Libya. Obama is hiding behind the War Power Resolution (which is probs unconstitutional), saying that while he believes that it IS constitutional our involvement in this "kinetic military action" doesn't rise to the law's requirements. In so doing he manages to both weaken the presidency by accepting this silly law and make a pig's breakfast of the Constitution by claiming for the president the right to wage any war he like so long as it doesn't get too big. But limited engagements can quickly escalate into major wars. In effect Obama has claimed that the President of the United States can send the military into action anywhere in the world without consulting Congress. As long as it starts out small, that is.

It was illegal to even follow the mandate without the Congressional approval. We didn't trade the UN Charter for our Constitution. Indeed, the Charter says states must go through their own domestic mechanisms when the UN authorizes some sort of military action.

Bush stretched the Constitution in many ways, but never in this way. Afghanistan and Iraq both got authorization. Yemen and our involvement in the Sahara and in Pakistan probably went under broader War on Terror authorizations, but I'm not familiar with the details there.
Draugnar (0 DX)
27 Jun 11 UTC
@Invictus - incorrect. He does not have to get approval, he just has to consult and report.

Section 1543

(a) Written report; time of submission; circumstances necessitating submission; information reported
In the absence of a declaration of war, in any case in which United States Armed Forces are introduced—
(1) into hostilities or into situations where imminent involvement in hostilities is clearly indicated by the circumstances;
(2) into the territory, airspace or waters of a foreign nation, while equipped for combat, except for deployments which relate solely to supply, replacement, repair, or training of such forces; or
(3) in numbers which substantially enlarge United States Armed Forces equipped for combat already located in a foreign nation;
the President shall submit within 48 hours to the Speaker of the House of Representatives and to the President pro tempore of the Senate a report, in writing, setting forth—
(A) the circumstances necessitating the introduction of United States Armed Forces;
(B) the constitutional and legislative authority under which such introduction took place; and
(C) the estimated scope and duration of the hostilities or involvement.
Draugnar (0 DX)
27 Jun 11 UTC
I suggest you actually read the War Powers Act. A copy of which is online here. http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode50/usc_sup_01_50_10_33.html
Draugnar (0 DX)
27 Jun 11 UTC
And 1541(c)(2) is why this wasn't an illegal action to begin with. It goes as follows:

(c) Presidential executive power as Commander-in-Chief; limitation
The constitutional powers of the President as Commander-in-Chief to introduce United States Armed Forces into hostilities, or into situations where imminent involvement in hostilities is clearly indicated by the circumstances, are exercised only pursuant to
(1) a declaration of war,
(2) specific statutory authorization, or
(3) a national emergency created by attack upon the United States, its territories or possessions, or its armed forces.

Note that 1541(c)(2) refers to specific stautory authorization. As part of NATO, we have a statutory authorization and even obligation to fulfill. This was a NATO action and we were obligated by statute to participate.
Invictus (240 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
Did you read my post? The War Powers Act is a red herring. A president can't use the military without Congressional approval when there is no attack or threat on the United States or its allies. Obama's actions are outside even that broad definition. At best the War Powers Act sets up a structure for the president to carry out the powers inherent to the office. No law can change the Constitution, which is what you seem to think the War Powers Resolution does. By intervening in Libya, which was never a threat to American national security, without Congressional approval Obama acted beyond the powers of his office. This is an illegal war and sets a troubling precedent. Congress should either cut off funding or authorize the war. This transformation of the President of the United States into the unaccountable Warlord of Earth has to end somewhere.
Draugnar (0 DX)
27 Jun 11 UTC
Mind providing a citation from the Constitution? Nothing I see in Article 2 limits his power to act *except* the war powers act. Your "grave threat" does not exist in the Constitution. Epic. Fucking. Fail.
Draugnar (0 DX)
27 Jun 11 UTC
Here is Article 2, Section 2, of the United States Constitution.

Section 2 - Civilian Power over Military, Cabinet, Pardon Power, Appointments

The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the Militia of the several States, when called into the actual Service of the United States; he may require the Opinion, in writing, of the principal Officer in each of the executive Departments, upon any subject relating to the Duties of their respective Offices, and he shall have Power to Grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment.

He shall have Power, by and with the Advice and Consent of the Senate, to make Treaties, provided two thirds of the Senators present concur; and he shall nominate, and by and with the Advice and Consent of the Senate, shall appoint Ambassadors, other public Ministers and Consuls, Judges of the supreme Court, and all other Officers of the United States, whose Appointments are not herein otherwise provided for, and which shall be established by Law: but the Congress may by Law vest the Appointment of such inferior Officers, as they think proper, in the President alone, in the Courts of Law, or in the Heads of Departments.

Invictus (240 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
I suggest you look up some scholarly sources on the subject, which are replete with support for the president only having the power to act without Congress when responding to an attack or imminent threat.

But maybe you like the idea of the president being able to start wars without getting the authorization of Congress. In which case, well, screw you. That's an intolerable amount of power for one person to have.
Sicarius (673 D)
27 Jun 11 UTC
@gunfighter
what good exactly, could more US soldiers in afghanistan do? seriously?
Tettleton's Chew (0 DX)
27 Jun 11 UTC
The War Powers Act is unconstitutional and Congress knows it. Senator George Mitchell said so himself when he was majority leader. That is exactly why Congress has never confronted a President for violating it in the 35+ years since it was passed. The Supreme Court would toss it in a heartbeat for violating the separation of powers and Congress has Constitutional means to stop any conflict any time it wants by cutting off funding.
taylor4 (261 D)
28 Jun 11 UTC
ICC International Criminal Court put out a warrant for Libya's leaders.
US not a party to the ICC, rejecting juirisdiction.
Military proposes greater air-ground presence, which they say should have been done earlier, in force
The Libya conflict is now 100 days old. It is indefinite...
Are we printing "Not worth a Continental:" Yanqui dollars, to police the world?
Tettleton's Chew (0 DX)
28 Jun 11 UTC
The ICC, bane of criminals all over the world!
When a criminal hears the ICC has put a warrant out for them the end is near!!!!!!!!!!!!
What a farce the ICC is.
Just another money drain for statists.
Draugnar (0 DX)
28 Jun 11 UTC
@Invictus - Those "experts" do not rely on the Constitution. The whole point of the War Powers Act was to *restrict* the Executive branch powers because *nothing* in the Constitution says *anything* about when he is allowed put our troops in harms way and it effectively, as Commander-in-Chief, gives him Carte Blanche to do so.

@Tettleton - there is some debate on that. I agree that Congress used the "necessary and proper" clause a bit loosely but whther the Supreme Court would kick it as the court resides right now, I don't know. Especially as Congress overrode Nixon's veto and the SC is usually reticent to act against Congress in this situation. But it's simple. Congress should cut funding. That is their domain and it would damn well put a stop to our participation over there.
Tettleton's Chew (0 DX)
28 Jun 11 UTC
Draugbar, excellent points all, but my question is why hasn't Congress ever invoked it if they believed it Constitutional? SCOTUS loves separation of powers issues though. Poor Nixon couldn't veto anything after awhile.
President's always make Congress back down on the funding side, as happened yesterday when the blowhards in the House condemned the President's action in Libya and then funded it. What brazen hypocrisy.
My personal favorite is when Congress refused to fund Teddy Roosevelt's Great White Fleet's circumnavigation. He had enough funds to send the fleet half way and dared Congress not to appropriate the rest.
There is so much propaganda on the air waves and the web I wonder if anyone else had heard that the Libyan revolt is so diverse that elements of Al Qaeda are involved, and also elements that worked with Al Qaeda in Iraq.
Call me inhumane but I could care less if the tribal politics of Libya have broken down and the various tribes are at war. It has been going on there for centuries.
Americans don't even understand Arab tribal politics to begin with.

Page 1 of 3
FirstPreviousNextLast
 

81 replies
dD_ShockTrooper (1199 D)
03 Jul 11 UTC
I wonder...
With the new mute feature...
17 replies
Open
Tettleton's Chew (0 DX)
03 Jul 11 UTC
Community Reinvestment Act
If you do not know about this act, first passed in 1977 during the Carter administration and updated significantly during the Clinton adminstration, you should because it has had enormous impact on the United States.
3 replies
Open
Sicarius (673 D)
02 Jul 11 UTC
Police
having an interesting convo about "peace" officers in a game. Thought a few others might like to share their opinions on it. Or call me an idiot for mine.
36 replies
Open
obiwanobiwan (248 D)
30 Jun 11 UTC
This Time On Philosophy Weekly: Dawkins, Hitchens, and The New Atheists Get Heir Turn
I'm going to try something different with this week's go-around, as I think a few people believe me to be overly-agressive in pushing my opinions and also because this is a topic I've put off doing for a while now, as not a fan of the New Atheist movement, but not knowledgable enough about the particulars to try and tackle it. So, I aim to be more the receiver here, and I ask two questions, both inside--and I'll get my education from you all. ;)
146 replies
Open
orathaic (1009 D(B))
27 Jun 11 UTC
It's only a theory...
see inside...
72 replies
Open
manganese (100 D)
02 Jul 11 UTC
Pet peeves
A thread where you can voice what annoys you with Webdip games.
29 replies
Open
Onar (131 D)
02 Jul 11 UTC
New Feature
So... what does the mute player function do? And how long has it been there?
4 replies
Open
orathaic (1009 D(B))
29 Jun 11 UTC
work less party
http://worklessparty.org

26 replies
Open
☺ (1304 D)
03 Jul 11 UTC
Live gunboat-105 EOG
25 replies
Open
kestasjk (64 DMod(P))
02 Jul 11 UTC
webDip 1.01, user muting
Details on the new feature and version 1.01 inside
54 replies
Open
♞ (100 D)
29 Jun 11 UTC
Neigh
Neigh
91 replies
Open
Invictus (240 D)
01 Jul 11 UTC
Trip the light fantastic
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=62829
50 D, 24 hours, points per center, 10 days to join
4 replies
Open
mr_brown (302 D(B))
02 Jul 11 UTC
Games not being processed?
Is the server down again? One of my games is not being processed. gameID=60766

Anyone else get weird things happening?
3 replies
Open
deathbed (410 D)
02 Jul 11 UTC
join now
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=62827
0 replies
Open
☺ (1304 D)
29 Jun 11 UTC
Tettleton's Corner
"Actually I would be perfectly content to post my thoughts in a thread that is completely ignored by anyone and everyone."

I invite you to never comment outside of this thread. Everyone else: Move along, nothing to see here.
39 replies
Open
Thucydides (864 D(B))
02 Jul 11 UTC
Bug maybe?
Hey uh.... is it a bug that PE and WoY are shown as no longer in CD? Or are they actually not in CD? Can I get a second opinion? ID: 62827
2 replies
Open
Tru Ninja (1016 D(S))
02 Jul 11 UTC
Kids...
I hate the way that they get really quiet when you're putting in your diplomacy moves and when you get up to check on them (because quiet kids are synonymous with kids getting into trouble) and you find them throwing things into the toilet.

Yesterday I woke up after hearing the kids play in their room at 5:30 to find that one of them took off their diaper and thought it was a novel idea to do various things with their poop and top it off by peeing on his crib.
4 replies
Open
Tettleton's Chew (0 DX)
02 Jul 11 UTC
How taxes relate to winning in sports
How do NBA teams in a high tax environment compare to ones in a low tax environment in the 2010-2011 season.
5 replies
Open
Cachimbo (1181 D)
02 Jul 11 UTC
Where my ratings at???
C'mon Ghost! It's July 2nd already!!!
6 replies
Open
Leif_Syverson (271 D)
01 Jul 11 UTC
Stupid parking enforcement.
Story to follow..
34 replies
Open
Thucydides (864 D(B))
01 Jul 11 UTC
Best pick up line I've ever ever seen
"If I were to ask you for sex, would your answer be the same as the answer to this question?"
46 replies
Open
President Eden (2750 D)
02 Jul 11 UTC
I know this HAS to have been asked before, but...
I joined a gunboat game in place of a cheater who was banned in S01. The message saying the cheater was banned can't be read, so I get the notification at the top. My OCD senses are tingling. Is there any recourse for this interesting situation?
0 replies
Open
Ulysses (724 D)
26 Jun 11 UTC
CHINA will overtake the US in military power within the next three years (FACTS INSIDE)
See below
100 replies
Open
iotivedo (100 D)
02 Jul 11 UTC
Installation error
Hello, I'm a new webDiplomacy user, I installed the script on my server and I got this: http://playthegames.org/diplomacy/
Any Help? thx
2 replies
Open
Page 760 of 1419
FirstPreviousNextLast
Back to top