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Sicarius (673 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
who's a terrorist?
probably you.
Sicarius (673 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
Terrorism means the use of violence or the threat of violence against civilians (non-combatants) for political ends. To identify terrorists, therefore, one would logically look for evidence that such acts have been committed and attempt to identify the perpetrators.

However, much in the same manner that law-enforcement profiles consider African Americans likely drug dealers, a new Missouri Information Analysis Center (MIAC) report profiles militia members as likely terrorists, and in turn gives signs to help identify militia members that include support for Ron Paul, Chuck Baldwin, Bob Barr, the Libertarian Party, the Constitution Party (mistakenly called the Constitutional Party in the report), the Campaign for Liberty, opposition to the UN, IRS, CIA, FBI, etc., and displaying symbols associated with the American Revolution such as the famous "Don't Tread On Me" flag.

And this is just the tip of the iceberg.

Other MIAC reports target white supremacists, black separatists, and anarchists.

Meanwhile, reports produced by other "fusion centers" enlarge the field of likely terrorists. A report issued by the North Central Texas Fusion System identified organizations and individuals that have supposedly turned public support toward terrorism, including CAIR (Council on American-Islamic Relations), ANSWER (Act Now to Stop War and End Racism), IAC (International Action Center, headed by former US Attorney General Ramsey Clark,) and Cynthia McKinney, former US Congressmember and Green Party candidate for president.

And then there's the Virginia Fusion Center's report, "2009 Virginia Terrorism Threat Assessment". You know things are getting off to a bad start when you see the center's symbol bearing the motto SCIENTA EST POTENTIA. That would mean "knowledge is power", if they hadn't misspelled the Latin word scientia.

This report has garnered little public attention other than criticism of its characterization of colleges, including what it calls "Historically Black Colleges", as important centers of ideological "radicalization" and thus breeding grounds for terrorists.

The Virginia report gives an area by area breakdown of terrorist/extremist (note the shift from terrorism to simple political dissidence) group presence and activity along with entries for various groups of likely terrorists, also noting "intelligence gaps" -- a term very difficult to mention without adding an ironic comment.

Concerning "Anarchist Extremists" we learn that: "Anarchist extremists adhere to the anti-government movement which rejects governmental rule and police authority and advocates violent means to overthrow social, political, and economic hierarchies." and that "Although the anarchist threat to Virginia is assessed as low, these individuals view the government as unnecessary, which could lead to threats or attacks against government figures or establishments."

The report describes various anarchist groups, such as the Garbage Liberation Front, whose terrorist activities seem to bear a remarkable resemblance to dumpster diving. Another group profiled is Anonymous, who protest against the Church of Scientology. It also includes a motley assortment of Islamists, white supremacists, black nationalists, and many environmentalist and animal-rights groups, such as Earth First! (with the exclamation point usually omitted), ELF (Earth Liberation Front), ALF (Animal Liberation Front), and SHAC (Stop Huntingdon Animal Cruelty).

In the report's "projections" we find the following: "Current calls for vandalism, boycotts, and other 'direct action' by environmental extremists such as Blue Ridge Earth First[!] against financial institutions in Virginia deemed to be supporting environmental degradation are likely to continue."

And so merely failing to patronize certain businesses seems to have become an act of terrorism. Some people are easily frightened--



http://www.nolanchart.com/article6151.html
Centurian (3257 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
Oh no! A group of idiots reporting on different idiots. Surely this is worth a comment.
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
Sic, most people would not even care to read what an organization called "Anarchist Extremists" or "blah-blah Front" stand for, after they hear that name. For me at least - this is where I stopped.

If you want to be taken seriously you cannot call yourself "...army of the dirty angry mob of social outcasts..." - and yes, most likely such a title will put you on the police radar.

I don't want to sound elitist - but I find some of these groups actually do more damage than justice to the causes they stand for. I might endorse what you're fighting for - but you do make it hard for people to associate/support you.

Is there not a single person there who's taken at least Marketing101 or creative writing? Someone who can talk/write coherently without screaming for revolution and upheaval. And why all this hate and anger ... :)
Sicarius (673 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
there is no group named 'anarchist extremists' this is an excerpt from police documents.

I dont see any screaming for revolution or hate & anger.
can you point them out to me?

I dont are if you endorse what I'm fighting for, I posted this because I thought some might find it alarming that you could be put on the terror watch list for reading the constitution or having a dont read on me flag or digging through the garbage or being a ron paul supporter.
I guess I'll just go back to my historically black radical breeding ground and rethink this.
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
Sic, I don't want to argue semantics - my point was simple - thrashing a city that was 'lucky' to host a G8 meeting or something does not get you much friends...

You probably meant to say that you don't CARE about what I think/endorse - and that's a part of the problem - politicians may be scum but even the worst of them would never be so stupid to say such a thing.

I am only saying this in a constructive way - I'd like freedom/green movements to have more say in the world - and most people I know are like this - but not if they look like fanatics :)

In this regard - you should really let the other thread (I'm on the news) drop down from the forum.
Sicarius (673 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
you're missing the whole point. I'm not going to argue the validity of the environmental movement.

this is about the 'terrorist' designation being thrown around like birthday confetti or 5$ whores.
if you voted for ron paul you might be a terrorist?
if you voted for cynthia mckinney you might be a terrorist?
you odnt see anything wrong with that
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
I am in no position to judge (and don't care enough to read it all) what was the basis for the MIAC report.

What I do see from your link is this:
"Update: After complaints from Paul, Barr, Baldwin, and many others, the MIAC has apologized for and retracted its report on militias. Other mischaracterizations of peaceful political dissidents and activists will most likely require a similar public outcry before the government takes any action to atone for labeling them likely terrorists."

Which sounds reasonably ok for me - they made a mistake, they took corrective action. This is a good as it gets when dealing with governement.

My response was more conceptual and not so much for this specific issue - you've posted enough inthe past year for me to have to limit myself to this post only :)

And once again I have to leave the discussion with the feeling I was in a dead-end argument with someone who does not really care about what worries me and what I have to say - but is only interested in getting me to agree that everything government/capitalist comes straight from the Devil and we should fight it at all costs. But, my problem is, that I'd rather support someone 'evil' and rational than someone 'good' and crazy :) - it's easier to deal with the first one.
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
You see, just like in Diplomacy, I'm more likely to ally with Marek and the like, than with "Die little pigy!!! HAHAHAHA"
Sicarius (673 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
how am I crazy?
zuzak (100 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
Pretty ridiculous what they're doing.

"...that have supposedly turned public support toward terrorism..."
Its amazing how organizations are capable of making people think that getting attacked and killed is good. Yeah, there's tons of public support for terrorism.

"Sic, most people would not even care to read what an organization called "Anarchist Extremists" or "blah-blah Front" stand for, after they hear that name. For me at least - this is where I stopped."
Forget about those groups, what about the second paragraph in the article? Supporting certain political parties makes you more likely to be a terrorist? Supporting the American Revolution does?
Sicarius (673 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
of course it doesnt. but the government says that because of those things they have reason to suspect you.
If someone created a legal political party named 'Abu Nidal' or 'Islamic Jihad' or 'the Real IRA' or 'Shining Path', 'Capitalism Must Die Violently', do you think it unreasonable that their members might be watched?
Tolstoy (1962 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Sam Adams and company were a bunch of piratical cop-killing terrorist drug kingpins who owned large stockpiles of illegal military-style assault weapons. Many of them also had kooky religious and political beliefs and married underage girls...

Most of them would've voted for Ron Paul, as well...

It's all a matter of perspective. And spin.
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
"Supporting certain political parties makes you more likely to be a terrorist? "

Yes, of course it does. Some people don't care about politics, etc. at all - they are clearly less likely to do anything politically-related than someone who's a party member. And yes, it depends on what the party/movement is.

Seems like a reasonable analysis in general. The fact someone made a wrong judgement call does not require us to bring the house down - especially if it was corrected afterwards.
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
@Tolstoy - it is a matter of perspective :) - and the fact is people like George Washington and the like are not the standard, but the exception. Maybe there're some freedome fighters and innocent people in jail - would you declare a full amnesty?



How many George Washingtons
zuzak (100 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
"If someone created a legal political party named 'Abu Nidal' or 'Islamic Jihad' or 'the Real IRA' or 'Shining Path', 'Capitalism Must Die Violently', do you think it unreasonable that their members might be watched?"

There's a slight difference there, don't you think? The Libertarian and Constitution parties don't advocate terrorism, and I fail to see any connection between either of them and terrorism. I will agree that there could be connections between some political parties and terrorism, but in this case there aren't.

"Yes, of course it does. Some people don't care about politics, etc. at all - they are clearly less likely to do anything politically-related than someone who's a party member. And yes, it depends on what the party/movement is."
And there are people who care about politics, but aren't a member of a party.

I made my previous post before I saw the apology, so I guess this whole argument is pointless.
@Zuzak,
Of course there's a difference. But Sicarious seems to be upset that you could be a member of a legal party and be targeted because of it. I was trying to figure out where that line in the sand is; can you be a member of Shining Path and not expect to be watched? Who draws that line?
Chrispminis (916 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
If what the article says is accurate, then the MIAC is clinically retarded.
Sicarius (673 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
you dont draw the line at the green party?
really?

well then watch out guys theres a terrorist around every corber
I am asking where to draw the line... Probably lots of ALF members in the green party.
Dexter.Morgan (135 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
Most of the deadly (U.S.) recent domestic terrorist acts has been by right-wing people... often Republicans... I might find that to be instructive and somewhat disturbing... but it hardly is going to make me come to some sweeping conclusion that the Republican Party en masse needs to be put on some terrorist watch list. (On the other hand, I do think that I'd put Glen Beck, Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter and a few others on such a list).
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
Yeah, I don;t know about that :)

From an outside perspective (at least from my 'world') I would have a serious look through the Republican Party - some pretty crazy people there :)
Oh, and Fox news staff ...
vamosrammstein (757 D(B))
13 Apr 09 UTC
Palin?:]
amonkeyperson (100 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
speaking about terrorists...
I just watched this right before I saw this post.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_OIXfkXEj0&feature=rec-HM-rev-rn

Sicarius (673 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
I think if your a member of the animal liberation front you're already past the green party.
but thats like, oh he voted republican? watch him in case he tries to bomb an abortion clinic.

besides the ALF has never hurt anyone. ever. or an animal.
I thought a terrorist was someone who kills civilians to inspire fear and terror.
do you have a new definition?
Sicrious, my point wasn't about the ALF at all; there is no need for you to defend or attack them. My point was that you can't draw arbitrary lines like you are trying to. Why look at the Shining Path party, or the KKK party or the Abu Jihad Party, but not the Green Party? Or are you suggesting that the feds shouldn't watch a legally established KKK party?
aoe3rules (949 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
Ah, good ol' Sic.
diplomat1824 (0 DX)
13 Apr 09 UTC
Ah, good ol' Sic x 2


28 replies
scottkwong (426 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
Mod Please Help with Unpause
http://phpdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=9098

England was CDed when all other countries voted for a pause. Before the pause started (within 5 minutes), a new England came in, but said that it was an accident and was leaving the game. All countries, except for England, have now voted to unpause, and the game has not yet proceeded. Can someone please manually unpause the game? England never voted for the pause and said he wanted to leave, even if it meant losing points.
4 replies
Open
nomoney (532 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
stonebridge
New game up, join and lets start playing
0 replies
Open
gomey (781 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
Extra unit on board.
Could a mod look at this please? In game: http://phpdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=9655

England was just forced to disband two units out of four, but still seems to have three units on the board. The fleet in St.Pet shouldn't be there right?
2 replies
Open
Invictus (240 D)
12 Apr 09 UTC
I found a gray hair today.
I'm 19.
23 replies
Open
Thucydides (864 D(B))
11 Apr 09 UTC
Turritopsis nutricula
This jellyfish is immortal. Literally.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turritopsis_nutricula
14 replies
Open
Malleus (2719 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
Potential multi-accounter (or meta-gamer)
http://phpdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=9625
5 replies
Open
Javabeans (252 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
Question on Civil Disorder / AFK player
Hey guys, we have a player in a private game that has not turned in moves after the first move orders. We were wondering if there was anyway to replace him with another friend who wanted to play, or the conditions until the game basically does not wait for him to turn in moves. I believe this is called civil disorder yes? How long does it take to get into civil disorder? Thanks
1 reply
Open
Sicarius (673 D)
01 Apr 09 UTC
I'm on the news
not trying to brag or anything but I am very proud of what we're doing

http://www.wtol.com/global/Category.asp?C=151146&clipId=&topVideoCatNo=14996&topVideoCatNoB=129734&topVideoCatNoC=129730&topVideoCatNoD=129733&topVideoCatNoE=106878&autoStart=true&topVideoCatNo=default&clipId=3606968
263 replies
Open
djbent (2572 D(S))
11 Apr 09 UTC
is it meta gaming?
a theoretical question about meta gaming. i have my opinion, wondering about others' views.
22 replies
Open
Thucydides (864 D(B))
11 Apr 09 UTC
You all seriously need to sign up for this lol
http://the-state.mybrute.com/

its fun and a good way to blow off steam
13 replies
Open
airborne (154 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
Publishing a variant
Where do I go? I have two variants which I believe are great diplomacy experiance. Do I have to give out personal info?
9 replies
Open
kman1234 (100 D)
13 Apr 09 UTC
fun 3 game
1 hour moves!!!
1 reply
Open
xgongiveit2ya55 (789 D)
06 Apr 09 UTC
PPSC
Lets just get rid of it. Anyone agree?

Or maybe we should implement other variants as well?
165 replies
Open
mapleleaf (0 DX)
11 Apr 09 UTC
New game.
All are welcome, living or dead.....
5 replies
Open
Kaleidoscope (113 D)
12 Apr 09 UTC
Support Hold on Move
Just a question I was wondering about. If you move a army(1) into another army(2) (without support, thus does nothing), and army(3) tries to support hold army(1), does army(1) get the support hold bonus when someone tries to invade it with 1 army with 1 support army?
1 reply
Open
CaesarAugustus (100 D)
12 Apr 09 UTC
New game, PhD2
Hi, we have a new game, PhD2. Pot of 5 per person and several of us know each other but that doesn't mean we're inclined to favour them over anyone else. We're just here for fun.
0 replies
Open
New game
Made a new game, only 5 point wager. This is mainly for fun not for points, so join if you can please.
4 replies
Open
Taelisan (127 D)
11 Apr 09 UTC
New Game with fixed alliances
I have started a new, cheap game. It will be played with a variant for fixed alliances.
8 replies
Open
jadayne (283 D)
12 Apr 09 UTC
differences in playing styles as the stakes get higher
I've played a few games in the 5-20 point range and i think i'm ready for some higher stakes games.
8 replies
Open
eliwhitney (107 D(G))
11 Apr 09 UTC
Could a mod kill this game - The coast is NEVER clear

I mistakenly made a private game called "The coast is NEVER clear". I do not have 6 friends, so please delete this game OR open it up to the public.

Thank you in advance.
4 replies
Open
Daedalus (100 D)
12 Apr 09 UTC
New game 25 points
Audentes fortuna iuvat (fortune favors the bold), 25 point buy in, 24 hour turns:
http://phpdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=10034
0 replies
Open
Canada86 (100 D)
12 Apr 09 UTC
Steady the Mainsail
72 hour phase game just started, bet is 50, check it out so we can start playin!
Steady the Mainsail
0 replies
Open
americandiplomat (0 DX)
11 Apr 09 UTC
Controls
How many different controls are there? I know /unpause, and /draw, but nothing else.
5 replies
Open
greendjinn (0 DX)
11 Apr 09 UTC
Embarrassed to ask...
.....but this is my first game here. How do the pull-down menus for the moves work? For example, if I want to move and chose that, where do I find the options for WHERE to move? The FAQ doesn't seem to give much detail on the mechanics of the site.

Thanks in advance!
4 replies
Open
Ukla (390 D)
10 Apr 09 UTC
Starting Placement
Is there some kind of placement by ranking that goes on with the computer? Just curious, as I seem to get freaking Turkey a LOT. Like way too often for it to be random.
17 replies
Open
Quadsniper (110 D)
09 Apr 09 UTC
Quit/Surrender option
I'm fairly new to this site, but in a few games already I've really seen the need for a surrender option. In these 48 hour turn games, it's unbearable to wait the full turn limit for retreats when the player is obviously giving up on the game. I know not everyone would use it, but for those who are nice enough to quit when they don't feel like playing instead of wasting all of our time i think it would be great.
17 replies
Open
Javabeans (252 D)
11 Apr 09 UTC
Is it possible to start a private game over or delete it?
Hey guys, my friends and I have started a private game but we have a problem. The move deadline is soon and a player has dropped out. While i have a replacement i would rather not let that country hold for the first turn so is there anyway to delete the game or restart it so we can start with a fresh slate? thanks!
1 reply
Open
TheSleepingBear (100 D)
11 Apr 09 UTC
Help with move rules
Hi, can someone help me with move rules in this game:
http://phpdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=9866http://phpdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=9866 (see the reply for more info). Thanks.
6 replies
Open
Hamilton (137 D)
11 Apr 09 UTC
Join Quick Game
12 hour per turn!
0 replies
Open
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