wooooo and uclabb were the professors, djbent was teaching assistant, hamilton, spyman, farmerboy, darth, and bigzombiedude were students.

Isn't that a 6 way EFGITR draw?

sorry my statement is ridiculously long

1901

Diplomacy got off to a great start. Hit it off well with everyone, the only slightly reticent one was England, who subsequently started to talk more. However, England was quite aggressive and pushy in his press, which pre-disposed me against him. Germany was very non-committal, so wary of him. France and I had immediate bond, same with all the eastern powers, though Turkey also could have started off on a slightly nicer foot. I’d rather not bounce in BLA, but T insists on it, so have to. Things are going very well with both Italy and Austria-Hungary – GAL DMZ is good, and Italy wants to move on AH, while T seems open to an alliance though quite cautious I guess. Could be a great start. I decide for a strong opening to the north, hoping to keep peace with T and AH for now, and if Italy follows through on the attack, I’ll join later. Then I can decide who to support, Italy or Turkey. Germany suggests a northern opening, but I already had that planned, and I don’t seem to need to worry about him. He agrees to me having Sweden, vaguely, and England is also non-committal, so I feel I need to be able to take it by force if need be. I’m inclined to work with G and F against E – I’m a bit alienated by England’s press. F and G are committed to that, though I hear similar things from France that England’s press is pushy and that Germany is very vague – not a good sign at all.

England’s opening surprised me a bit, but seemed inconclusive. He continues to be pushy, and Germany is pressuring me hard to bounce him at NWY. I am concerned about an English army at NWY, a fleet is not as big a deal. After a lot of thought, and agreements from Germany not to bounce me at SWE, and from England not to convoy to NWY, I decide not to bounce, and tell them both my intentions. This is affected by rumors that AH might try for RUM, bouncing me – which would leave me with no SC!! Not a good possibility. Italy seems committed to keeping the fight against AH, and T is hesitant, clearly considering siding with the Hapsburgs. But I convince him he can get GRE, believing that AH (who I’ve kept good relations with) will also try for it. Don’t want T too strong now! AH says he has no designs on RUM, tho he had considered it. Italy lets me know he is agreed to Key Lepanto with AH, but will turn it into a stab. Ouch for AH!! Good for me, for now. France and maybe England seem to be on board against Germany, but not totally sure – F says he will let E have BEL, which seems fine to me. I hope that will encourage E not to break his word with me.

Alas all well laid plans can become SNAFU. Both G and E blatantly lied. G obviously has been a devious diplomat, and as I suspected, tried to get E fighting me and F, so that he (G) has the best options. This set of moves is a huge boon for G, minus my move to FIN, and I see now why he lobbied against it. I am pissed at both G and E, but ready to work with them – I think G is the bigger threat, and manipulating E, so I decide to try to make up with E, and work with him and F to take down G. Things in the east went perfect, just as expected. Though having T’s fleet at ANK still is not something I’m too fond of. After much deliberation, an army at WAR is my build.

Spring 1902

I came to a deal with England for support into SWE in exchange for us working together, despite his lying ways. I felt suspicious of his build at EDI, but he said he “didn’t want to anger the French” – fair enough. Of course, once I talk to France, I learn E had never even asked F about where he ought to build and if LON would be offensive or acceptable. Germany meanwhile is saying he’s going for SWE again, but suspects I can take with my superior forces. I also don’t like the fleet at KIE, but think I have got G to move against E. England not being contested in BEL means G continues to play him like a fiddle, but I’m hoping I can turn him around.

In the south I continue to work with Italy, and Turkey. Setting Turkey up for the least advancement, if possible. That doesn’t quite work out – I thought BUD was a walk for me and T would bounce at GRE. Alas, the opposite! Not a big deal though. Italy obviously needs a friend and an alliance with me makes way more sense than with T – commentators notwithstanding =P

At the last minute, I decide E is likely to go for STP after all, even though he has repeatedly promised not to (kinda like his promises not to convoy to NWY). So I change my orders. And despite planning an anti-german campaign with E, I decide to not send WAR into SIL or PRU – just keep it in place where it can be handy. With hindsight, I probably should have sent it to GAL instead. But at WAR it is more flexible if I need it in the north due to potential English treachery.

Autumn 1902

And treachery it is! Is England capable of telling the truth? I have to laugh at that, and G’s seizure of BEL. E seems to like the role of tool for German expansion. I finally take BUD. I’ve been telling T that we will move together on Italy – thinking maybe it’s a good option – but he is NMR. Oops! G’s move to TYR is clever and guarantees a role, but he has me, IT, FR and I imagine E all pissed off and not trusting him by now, so I think the German position will not last long. But he’s obviously extremely crafty, so I make a deal with him for now. I need SCs – so T it is, and I’m thinking I’ll build a fleet at SEV. I’ll reach out to E – but he needs to take a bit of a wupping at G and F’s hands before I will work with him. I continue to be on great terms with F and IT, and I just wish F would quite messing up his orders =(

1903
CD Turkey gets a new player, starts off with great press and even continues after we come to blows. Definitely considering taking up his offer for support into Serbia or Trieste. Meanwhile I have to figure out where that crafty Austrian is going next. I thought E would try for STP, and so I changed my orders at the last minute, but I wish I hadn’t – I could really use that army in STP now! On good terms with G still it seems, though his promise not to interfere with AH seems to be hollow.

Can’t believe it! I got G to support me into Vienna, and took Bulgaria as well. I knew I couldn’t guess AH’s move, so I went for the one that I thought would give me the best leverage to kill him, and leave an SC open in case I got a build, which I did! I am sure I’ll see AH move to Sevastopol with T’s help, but that’s ok, it’s just a matter of time before AH is gone. With my alliance with Italy still solid, we will move against Germany. I had planned to help Germany and keep options open, but a messed up move in the north left G furious at me, so I have to move against him now. I do hope E will finally do something useful, and I’m so glad F finally got his build for Portugal.

1904
Somehow I overlooked Turkey being able to take Bulgaria, but no matter I can take it back. I’ve got AH apparently working with me now, we’ll see how that works out. G is acting belligerent as usual, but I’ve got a commitment from E to support me into Sweden, which is great. Autumn brings trauma with Italy definitely not going with the plan, though it doesn’t totally look like a stab (why not take Budapest if he’s stabbing me). AH and E both do as promised, which is great to see. And G loses Sweden to me, which I’m quite happy about. But the loss of Bulgaria means I don’t get a build, which I need badly, and delays Turkey’s demise by at least another turn. I haven’t heard much from F, but looks like he is now allied with G, who is desperately trying to get me to change course and help him. Not so pushy any more! Turkey does a great job making the case for why I should work with him, but I just don’t see it working out. If Italy hits me again next year, then it’s a different story, but for now I’ve got to accept Italy’s story that he messed up his orders b/c he was reading my press on his iPhone and couldn’t see it properly.

1905/06
My trust in Italy proved to not be misplaced. I decided to eliminate AH, b/c a wild card is not very helpful at this point, and to press on against T. I thought E would be sure to stick with Italy and myself, but that did not work out. Still, retreat phase allowed me to take make up for the loss of NWY. In the end I don’t think that will work well for E. I’m kind of glad, because I find him very difficult to work with and I’d rather not include him in the draw if possible. Admittedly, Italy’s build of a second army has me on edge – he needs more fleets to break out into the Atlantic and not get stalemated at Gibraltar. Still, Italy’s relative inexperience, and unfaltering loyalty so far, have me keen to stick with him. From here I can safely work with G and T this turn and move on Italy, with notice, and then see where the chips fall – if it’s advantageous to press the “fake stab” I will, if not, I’ll go back to beating up T and G. Considering what a bad position I’ve been in most of the game, especially after the beginning, I think I’m doing alright. At the last minute I have decided to not move against Italy after all, despite what all the commentators say.

1907
What a terrible year. We start off with Italy going NMR, and I make some key mistakes tactically. I took the safe route and support GoB-Stp, but wish I had sent Fin in, b/c then I’d keep that fleet in play. I thought G would tap me at GoB to cut support for sure. Lots of mistrust in the Western Alliance it seems. The only good outcome of it all was Italy getting out into the Atlantic with that fleet. In Autumn, some luck, as I took Berlin, but again missed opportunities – Italy should have picked up an SC from me, since I can’t take advantage of the builds. Add to that Italy’s mess-up in Ion, and we’re in trouble down south. I’m working E and F tirelessly, trying to peel them off, but little progress. I know F doesn’t like working with E or G, so trying to use that as leverage. I can maybe go for a solo, if there’s a way to make it happen. The board is in total chaos right now, so it may be the time to try for it. An army at Sev is about useless, so I build a fleet, and that could be leveraged for Italy’s sake, or my own.

1908
I thought we had France on our side, but at the last minute he changed his mind, afraid I might go for the solo. It’s just not possible. The game is getting a bit stagnant, and Germany is calling for a draw. I think Italy and could break through if we got lucky, but I’m getting tired of the game actually and I want to be playing in fewer games anyway, so I am inclined to go along with it. We’ll see how Autumn plays out, but I do think if France came over we could get to a neat 3-way quite quickly. Too bad he’s not willing to do so.

In the end, it looked intractable and I got tired of playing the game, so I agreed to a draw. It was a fun game, I have too many others right now, so bringing it to an end is excellent.

oops yeah. i'm bad at math. ;)
6 way draw

Copied from the main SoW thread.

[SoW IV Official Commentary End-Game]

First off, booo hisss! Soft draws are extremely unsatisfying for me, and there was so much potential here! A six way draw?! Congratulations for completely defeating Babak's ulterior motive of promoting the WTA game play. =P

I'll comment on everyone, but I have to admit that they may be meaningless since they are based on outside speculation without knowledge of the quality and quantity of press involved. I imagine the EOG's will be far more informative. I'll start with my personal pick to win.

My actual prediction from the start of the game was that djbent as Russia would solo, and I remained quite hopeful that I might be proven right throughout the game. I stand by my statement at the very start of the game that djbent has the potential to become a force of a player if she refines her play. She's got the diplomatic chops, but I think she needs to think through her tactical orders more. Case in point, she had great expansion but was always slowed down by various units sneaking past her lines.

BigZombieDude, incredible resilience and resourcefulness. Good co-ordination with various powers to assure your persistence to the end for what I saw as an unlikely share in the six way draw. It's a shame you weren't there from the beginning because I think the game would have shaped quite differently if you hadn't inherited a flawed position. You did a fantastic job with what you were handed.

uclabb, alas, I can't really comment here because of your relatively short stay, though I'll credit your resilience.

FarmerMAN, Great early stab, and I was pleased that through the seeming hiccoughs between you and Russia, it was always patched up in time. You didn't succumb to the ever present tall poppy syndrome, and the results speak to your talent. I'm tempted to say beginner's luck with the early stab, but as we all know, luck has no real part in Diplomacy.

Hamilton, you've certainly got the diplomatic chops. I was very impressed when you snuck into Belgium, and at the time, you were my favourite player on the board, in terms of play style. The situation didn't really give you a lot of room to work with, and I thought it took you a little too long to consolidate within the defensive alliance but perhaps this is a vestige from PPSC play. Once on board, I think you showed the most impressive amount of co-ordination, at two simultaneous fronts, and with three different players.

spyman, despite your NMR and your various tactical bungles, you stayed a significant player through the entire game. While France is notably friendly to mistakes, I don't think I can avoid giving you credit for your diplomatic play. Lesser players would have been quickly gobbled up in your position, but you managed to avoid this plight quite admirably, successfully fending off aggression from all three of your neighbours at different times! I was sad to see the game drawn in large part because I wanted to see you take this final opportunity to develop and expand in a way that the situation never allowed you to earlier.

wooooo, you're currently ranked higher than me on Ghost Rating (by 4 points and 3 ranks =P), but perhaps I can still offer something. I immediately liked your moves to Tyrolia and Bohemia, and they showed maturity and foresight and a good innate sense of the board's balance that so many players lack. Alas, you were foiled by the solidarity of I-R, despite valiant attempts on your part, and by England's short period of waffling. I suspect you might have been a little hampered by your imposing status as a veteran.

Thanks everyone for an interesting game. It was a pleasure to commentate for you all, and I hope I was helpful.

1901.

I get England, which pleases me, but the most experienced players on the board are germany and russia, which doesn't. My diplomatic style is very straightforward, which doesn't work to well with France and Russia. However, since I believe England can only succeed if it owns St.P and France is gone, I don't mind too much. I trick France, but am surprised by Russia's move to St.P. I lie to Russia to get an army into Norway. As far as I'm concerned, that's what she gets for moving to St.P. I regret not taking Brest. I try to talk to Turkey, but to no avail, he's going to be eaten by the I-R monster and I know it, but he doesn't seem to care. I wanted Austria to last for awhile, to slow the growth of my two powerful veteran neighbors, but thanks to T, not going to happen. I maintain friendly relations with Italy.

1902.
I build in Edi to send it to take St.P. Russia is my enemy. I strongly believe I cannot trust Russia unless I have protection from her(St.P) and this is simply a part of that thought process. I've become aware that Germany will stab me, but I don't know when quite yet. France's moves against me are nothing to worry about.

I'm more worried about the South. Italy has become too strong. I am afraid that he will gain the centers in France that I want after he pummels Turkey and Austria. Turkey still is marching to his death. After 1901, I'm in perfect position. I have Bel, NTH, NWY, and NRG. My armada is exactly where I want it. Germany built in Kie, but he moved Kie to Baltic, so I feel confident. Then G and F stab me.

1903
I try to sneak into Holland, which fails. Things look grim.However, I can coordinate with Austria. I make a tactical mistake with France. I'm very busy with work this week, so I'm feeling like this particular game is a lost cause. I manage to somehow get Russia to save my ass.

1904

France promises to work with me, then NMRs. Italy sneaks into Germany. Austria decided to work with the new Turkey instead of me. My press is still hampered by my work schedule. Germany feels the incoming invasion and finally decides its time to work together(despite his fleet in NTH). I try to help G into Sweden, take MAO from France, and align myself with the Western Alliance. Things have finally improved. F always managed to input moves when I try to attack him, but always seems to forget when he's supposed to work with me. Italy takes Mar. G and I fail to take Sweden again. Austria is going to die, and Turkey is surrounded. G and I need F on board or we fail. In the fall, I take St.P but forget that G's move to Sweden will finally be successful. I lose Norway. Italy takes Munich. All hope seems lost, and an I-R two way draw seems imminent, I am listening to offers from both for a three-way draw.

1906.

Just in time, I sneak into North Africa, France comes back alive, and I-R gets into a petty fight. We use the temporary instability to retake NWY and sneak into Tunis. Things look stalemated, and I can either betray my alliance or try to stalemate. I work with Turkey to keep him alive and on my side.

1904

PyroMancer commented about the importance of having a long term plan. I remember reading a article which stated that a strong player should know exactly which centers he would need to conquer to get to 18.

But, although aware of need of having the way to victory planned from the start, on practice I have no idea of how setting such a plan, considering the changes that occur on the board. So I start with an inicial plan to take over some country and folowing step only at most. After that I just go with the flow to where Im able to expand.

This is something that I really would like to read commented here by some experienced player who took part and finished a SoW: a commentary on the game focused on the long-term goal and how to achieve it, what did they take in consideration to settle it and how it has been adapted along the game.

pallas - that's a great question. i think you should ask it in the other SoW thread

Sorry, silly me, I have posted it wrong.
Actually I had the 2 threads open and thought I was posting on the other one :)

I just wrote out a bit of an explanation for you, Pallas, and I hope it helps. Hopefully some of the others will throw in their two cents as well.

SOW IV EOG - France

Spring 1901
England offered Eng DMZ I accepted. He seemed keen to ally.
Agreed Pie DMZ with Italy
German wanted a bounce in Bur, but otherwise non-committal
Russia friendly. It was clear that she was talking to everyone.
Decided to play Belgian Gambit with a view to convincing Germany to make a deal.
England played to Eng! The dirty liar! He was the one who offered a DMZ.

Autumn 1902
Germany non-committal
England seemed a little aggressive. Says he made the opening move so he could bargain with me to ally against Germany. I agreed to let him take Belgium but then after talking to Germany I decided to bounce England. I figured that England might be too hard to work with.
I made a last minute decision to move MAO to Eng (instead of Spain) - figuring that England would take Belgium with support from North Sea. The reason I did this was that Russia played a northern opening and I figured that England's best chance of securing a build would be to take Belgium with support. I also figured that would be worthwhile to trade gains for positional advantage. I guessed wrong. Russia also chose not to bounce England in Norway to my disappointment.

Spring 1901

German was still being fairly non-committal and I still had the English fleet on my doorstep. For this reason I decided to see if England would be more open to a dialogue - I apologized for the bounce. England came around and seemed much friendlier - looked liked I could work with him after all.
Still I was uncomfortable - due to my bad opening I felt that I would be the junior partner in an alliance with either England or Germany. So I encouraged them both to form a triple alliance. Germany was not keen.
At this stage I betrayed Germany and supported England to Belgium. I then put the triple idea to both again. My fear was that as Italy was so strong early on and clearly allied to both Russia and Turkey that the logical person for him to turn on would be France. I felt that if I was bogged down fighting either Germany or England my back door would be open (remember I only had four units - not five due to my bad opening).
Germany and England agreed. Germany however (in my view) did fully commit - he still wanted us to bounce in Bur whereas I wanted to get to Italy as soon as possible). The triple was doomed from the outset as there was not enough trust or action.
This was the move I played the rather ineffectual move MAO to West Med.

Autumn 1902
Germany decides he wants out of the triple and for us both to attack England. Figuring that the triple was not working I agreed. This might have worked okay but I forgot to leave my army in Portugal thus depriving myself of a build. Plus this upset England very much when we stabbed.

Spring 1903
My not holding Port for autumn meant that I could not build a fleet in Brest. This completely stuffed up my plans with Germany. By this stage I wanted to quietly dematerialize from the game. It was turing into an embarrassment for me.
The best I could do was bounce England in Brest.

Autumn 1903
Finally I get Portugal. I can build a fleet in Brest.

Spring 1904
This was to be the turn we attacked England - I had two fleets ready for action. Alas I got very drunk came home entered my orders but did not click update. I woke up the next morning and logged on. I had missed the end of phase by minutes. NMR.

Autumn 1904
Germany messages me and suggests that we get the triple going again as R/T are looking like they might be unstoppable. I understood that England had agreed but we did not communicate during this period so I wasn't sure. I assumed he had.
In fact his moves were aggressive against me.
So while I was trying to attack Italy - England was attacking me.
I had to back track. This is why I was never able to leave France.

Spring 1905 to end of game.
I defend an attack from England but lose Marseilles to Italy.
Italy actually offered to bounce me as but I didn't get the message in time. So this loss could have been avoided.
England then messages me and claims he was trying to help me and that I had stuffed his plans for us. This I did not understand - how was him taking Brest off me going to help us. Certainly was not going to help me.

Autumn 1905
Woooo posts to global forum threatening to NMR if E/F/G didn't get it together - and tells England to stop attacking me.
We all agree to work together.

Spring 1906 to end of game.
The Western Power work together and stop the evil Russia/Turkey alliance.

Closing stages
Italy and Russia were trying to convince me to switch sides. I try to sound interested (and there was potential but it didn't strike me as a likely proposition).
I also try to convince Italy that Russia would win the game. He sees my point but realizes that he has no other choice but to stay allied (and of course djbent is such a good diplomat - who wouldn't want to ally with her?)

This is why I decided not to.
Sharing in a draw was better than I hoped for. I can't believe I survived this game considering how badly I played.
The best I could hope for was to upgrade my six way draw to a three way draw, but the risk was that I would be eliminated on the path to Russia's victory.
I decided I had too much to lose and too little to gain.
Furthermore I figured this game was cursed for me and that I should count my blessings to get a draw.

That's my statement. (A bit on the long side, I know).

A few typos in that post.
Of course we stopped the evil Russia/*Italy alliance - not Turkey.

I missed my second NMR there - that was in Autumn 1905.

great EoG statements... not at all too long... I will reserve comment until we've heard from the remaining 4 players... but I think there are a lot of lessons in here for both the in-game rookies/players and for any observers...

As Turkey, i will be writing an EoG in the next day or so...i relly enjoyed taking over the CD Turkey and wish i had been in from the start...and the draw was a huge bonus for me.

Ill get my take on it up very soon indeed.

Mine should be up by tommorow.

bump

bump

sump

still waiting on turkey, italy, germany, and austria-hungary.

I'll get mine in later today.

Big Zombie Dude as Turkey SOW IV.....

Spring 1903.
I took over from the previous CD Turkey and thought i would at least give it a go. Italy had already taken Greece and the previous Turkey had retreated to Alb. I was left with 5 SC's and 4 units, as the previous version had CD'd with no build, so i was in a tough spot.

My biggest problem with this was the 3 minutes i had left to make my first move. I had no idea who was working with who, what had gone before and i had no chance to find out, so i did the moves very quickly and didnt do very well.

Autumn 1903

Italy had taken Greece and i destroyed the unit in Alb. I was left with 4 SC's and 3 units, 2 fleets and 1 army. One fleet occupied the Aegean, the other was in Con and the army resided now in Armenia. Rubbish.
I wrote to everyone and i filled up the Russian inbox....and then i filled it some more. Italy was initially gracious and pitied the position i had, but still piled on the pressure. The Italian had a fleet in Ionian and Greece while Russia had a fleet in Bul and Sev but the BLA was still unoccupied. I had little choice at this point. I had Bul with no unit covering. Hmmm. I filled up the Russian inbox again.

Spring 1904.

I was forced out of the Aegean by a supported fleet from the Ionian. I supported myself into Russian Bul with Con, giving up the BLA to Russia. However, the lone Austrian unit needed help, so i supported him into Sev from Arm. It seemed like the right thing to do, it showed Russia i was going to get in the way and gave me someone to work with. I was without a friend and the only person who would answer my messages at this stage was England, who was in no position to help. Hmmmm

Autumn 1904.

The moves here were slated in the commentary. I moved from my position in Bul, out of an SC was i was unlikely to keep if Russia had supported Italy in and straight back on Con, covering Smy and Ank with the 3 units i had left. The reasoning behind this, was that Italy had moved another fleet into the Eastern Med, had the Ionian and was going to take Bu anyway. Had the Italian gone for anyone of my home SC's, he would have taken them, had it looked like i bounced Italy out, the commentary would have been different but the end result was me being defensive and getting the Italian moves wrong. However...Russia started to talk and the lack of support or movement in the BLA gave me hope, so i filled the Russian inbox again and didnt stop until i got some constant chat going...i had hope.

Spring 1905

The hope didnt last long. Russia supported Italian army from Bul into Con and i lost the fleet without a retreat option. I was down to 2 and i had no help. Austria was going to be dispatched and i was on my own. There is nothing i could do to stop the onslaught, diplomatically or strategically. I had been pushed back on each consecutive move and that was purely down to my initial position. I told Russia not to underestimate my position 'because under those 2 remaining units was a tactical genius waiting to get out'. I got a laugh at that and kept the chat going.

Autumn 1905.

Austria was dispatched and i was really alone. I was quite hurt by this, but i kept my chin up and decided i knew what the Italian would do next. Italy had Con and a fleet in the eastern med. He was going for Smy. So i supported Smy into Con from Arm and i got Con back, giving me 2 units in a decent position and proving that my tactical genius was better than Itlay. Again the Russian did nothing and i finally had a positive response from Russia. With a few wonky moves from Italy and some poor tactical play, i had the Russians support. I might survive this....i might not, but at least i had diplomed myself into an ally. (Diplomed isnt really a word, but it fits nicely here).

Spring 1906

This year i had the Russian supporting me at Con, an overt move but one which i knew was a short lived thing. I was in no position to bargain so i continued to point out how rubbish i thought Italy was. Over the previous moves, Italy had reduced in size and didnt really have much of a plan. I was left with only 2 Italian units to face before i was finished and one disappeared off to deal with an English fleet coming his way. I couldnt take Smy back and Russia was heading for me again. I was doomed and goodnight.

Autumn 1906

Russia struck with Italian help and Con was gone. So was Italy. In an amazing tactical blunder, Italy left the Aegean giving me room to retreat my displaced fleet. So i chose to blow up the army at Ank and leave the fleet in the Aegean with a choice of Gre and Bul to take. I had no other option that would result in me having a pick of 2 SC's. Ank would be taken by the greedy Russian and i still had hope and one shiny unit left. I filled the Russian inbox again. England had by this time taken Tunis from under the Italians nose, again showing how rubbish Italy is...i told the Russian exactly what i thought of course.

Spring 1907

Woo Hoo. An NMR from Italy gave me Greece and an SC to call home. As was obvious, Russia took Ank and England was poised in Tunis. Another appalling Italian blunder let everyone on the board in with a free move. Russia wasnt happy, so i poked her with every tactical option i had and Italy was in the bad books. By this time Russia was quite freely talking away and this was only because if she had not, i would have filled her inbox again.

Autumn 1907

Greece was officially mine and i had decided to support England into the Ionian making Italy retreat to the Adriatic. This wasnt quite what Russia wanted but gave me another friend to play with and proved i was still useful. It annoyed Russia enough to promise that i could survive the game if i helped Russia and Italy and stopped helping the enemies. I thought about it for a while and due to the fact that Germany, France and England took so long to get together and were so far away, i had to play with the Russian. So my next move i switched sides like a dirty sea dog.

Spring 1908

I supported Italy back into the Ionian and England took Apu on the retreat. It wasent planned that way but England had suggested that retreats were useful, so i fulfilled his wish. England was not happy, but did well out of it.

Then the game was drawn.

How on earth i ever managed to get anything from this game i will never know. I constantly pressed my neighbour until i was promised a survive at least but when the option came up i was more than happy.

I have to say that i have never worked so hard at a game, i was constantly on the Russians case and never let up and i think that this alone saved me. It would have been very easy to smash me up but i was allowed to survive and i did what i could to be a nuisance and it worked.

It was obvious that i was about to regain my homeland and win, but i was happy with a draw. Thanks to djbent for making the time i spent retreating so enjoyable our conversations were fun and you kept talking even though you were my enemy, it makes it some much more refreshing to actually talk during the game than just get on with beating me up....

That will do...and id very much like to join another SOW to start from the beginning. I though the commentary was brilliant and being involved in a game that has every angle covered was very helpful indeed, so well done to all those that spent their time writing up the commentary.

BZD

Damn. I'm disappointed I was wrong about you not actually switching sides.

It might not have been clear on the EoG, but i did switch sides and my intention was to help England with Italy, but it lasted for one move when Russia moved fleets into the Aegean behind me and rendered my help useless, so i had to switch back and assist Italy.

You were right....

No no, I thought the last support was designed to help England, by giving him the favourable retreat. But as you said, in the last turn, you were on Italy and Russia's side.

it would still be great to hear from italy and germany....

bump

i'm sad neither wooooo nor farmerboy has posted =(

anyone in a game with farmerboy? can you ask him? i'll ask wooooo again.

I've asked Farmerboy to post.

My messages won't be a year to year kind of discussion. Just specifics for each country.

England: From the onset, I had the feeling I could get England to do what I wanted. His determination to attack France was there from the start, and his moves were always the one's that I suggested (at least at first). I was sad that I was unable to maintain that alliance, but I could not allow him to sit in Bel and mass fleets. He was always iffy about leaving the North Sea, which is crucial for a German/English alliance. When the early attack on France failed, and France messed up his moves, it was clear that I would have an even better "weak" ally than England, so France was my obvious choice.

France: So you won me over by messing up. However, I didn't expect an additional screw up the next year, followed by NMRS and such. I think we would have been the dominant power, eliminating England by 1903 and securing our waters. However, NMRS did cost us, and we had to switch to the defensive the whole game. My suggestion to you is to always enter orders, even before talking to people. That way you always have a back up. A single screw up when it comes to falty orders or missing them completely will not be recoverable in any but the lowest level games.

Russia: So I was glad you attacked North, as my intention was going to be to get rid of England. I bounced you in Sweden not because of ill will, but because I don't like seeing 2 build Russias. It also looked like at first, you and Turkey might be allied. You took my bounce=attack, which I would suggest you reconsider in the future, as Germany and Russia can actually be good allies if Russia does not control Sweden. I still am under the impression you should have stabbed Italy that turn you went towards him, and think that a solo may have been possible. Worst case scenario is that you don't get the solo. You were going to be part of the draw regardless, so why not go for the win when you can, and draw if/when it doesn't succeed.

Italy: To be honost, I didn't like your stab on Austria. First thing is first, Italy does not need 3 builds. If you were going to go ahead with the stab, a bounce in Greece would have been much more useful, giving you control of the Ionian to convoy to Alb and take tunis in the Spring of the next year. Secondly, I don't like seeing early attacks on Austria, as it provokes a Russia/Turkey alliance. However, your diplomacy must have been good afterwards, as you were able to secure your postion and maintain a strong alliance.

Austria: I can't say much. I wouldn't ever want to take place in a Key Lepanto though, and that kind of bit you in the ass. Hope to play with you again some time.

Turkey: So for the first Turkey, I put the cone of shame on you (can anyone get that reference). For Turkey 2. I don't think you should have been part of the draw, but to be honost, I didn't care. I think it was on Italy and Russia to organize your elimination. (Russia especially). You played solidly but you were under the effects of CD syndrom, and you were attacked endlessly from the moment you came into the game. Maybe try to offer yourself as a puppet to one of the powers next time. I think both Italy and Russia could have achieved more with you as an ally instead of being allied with eachother.

I enjoyed the game, and pushed for a draw towards the end because I knew that was what it would come to. Russia and Italy would not stab eachother, and the Western alliance could not afford a stab, since it would break the stalemate. The only one that I think lost from the draw is Russia, who could have attempted a solo, and if it would have failed, could have been part of the draw regardless.

Well, happy hunting.

Thanks for the insight Woooo. This was something that I had some sense of duirng the game - that my ineptness actually affected the balance of power in such away that I came out of it with a draw. I felt that I had the pick of the alliances too - you or England as both perceived the other to be the threat. Then when it was clear that Russia and Italy had to be stopped I was saved yet again by the western triple. It was a strange game for me - I was like a reed blowing in the wind.
Possibly one of the worst games I have ever played but not the worst outcome.

There was no stalemate. Not even close. The marauders made it likely that there would not have been a stalemate for a long time. I would have given the upperhand to the I-R alliance at the point of draw, but there have been enough mistakes in the game that it could have easily swung the other way.

SOV IV
If you were in my position would you have accepted the draw or would you have played on? So what would you have suggested France's next move should have been, Chrispminis.

I accepted the draw because I had lost Turkish support and knew that the war in the South was lost.

bump

damn i hoped we'd hear from farmerboy.

I took a hiatus from diplomacy after i got grounded from playing too much, which is why I didnt enter orders on the last turn, although i think it is likely that i would have been eliminated anyway.

well, not a good game for me. i had friendly conversation with everyone, and i was excited to get the game going. i did not have a key lepanto planned in Spring 1901. I had talked extensively to farmerboy, as we tended to be logged on at the same time. He seemed very open to learn and we had great conversation about the game. we discussed that he had stabbed austria in his previous game, and it sounded like he was looking to try something new. (whoops) all the signs were positive, and for that, I commend him.
When he stabbed me in the spring, I was definitely surprised, but I thought that we could turn it into something more positive, ie turn it into a key-esque move. I impressed upon him the perils of continuing his stab, namely that it would force a juggernaut or, even if russia was on board, the fact that they opened northernly meant that turkey would not be wiped out quickly enough to effectively combat the western triple that would undoubtedly form. (i was essentially right about this, i believe) Anyway, I meanwhile tried to find a way to get me into rumania, but it soon became relatively clear that turkey was in russia's pocket, so i backed out of the idea and took the "safer" move to greece.

Obviously, italy stabbed me, and two things became clear:
1. italy wasnt as open as he was pretending. as far as i could tell, he had a predetermined italy-russia alliance from the moment he learned he was italy. or maybe i am just being bitter. :)
2. i wasnt going to survive unless i got behind someone's lines. the obvious choice was the moscow area.

So, I aimed to grab a Russian sc as this is how i could survive. I got Moscow, and, as the austrian area became to be demilitarized, I saw my angle: convince Russia to let me back in that area to slow down italy's growth without pissing italy off, and of course i told italy the opposite. with this angle, i decided to be completely honest with everyone about all of my moves. when i got turkey to support me into sevastopol, I told them that i was doing so. I hoped that this would gain Russia's trust that I would in fact work as their pawn (i had little other choice). I got promised into rumania maybe three times, but never got it. but i think that they may have let me in had i not gone silent.

so basically, my main mistake was assuming that italy wouldnt attack me, which i made largely because i personally hate a first turn stab of austria by italy, and thought that after hearing my rationale, italy would share this opinion. so really, i was the one who was close minded. bummer.

i actually had a lot of fun with this game, though, and would love to redeem myself in another SoW game.

and i also would love to read an EOG from farmerboy