Forum
A place to discuss topics/games with other webDiplomacy players.
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joey1 (198 D)
28 Apr 11 UTC
Anyone for a summer game
Hello, as summer is coming I am finding myself reluctant to join in games as we often go away for the weekend with no internet access. Therefore I have a proposal:
gameID=57418
3 replies
Open
gigantor (404 D)
28 Apr 11 UTC
Food for thought.
http://i-beta.crackedcdn.com/phpimages/photoshop/7/9/5/26795_slide.jpg?v=1
Discuss.
0 replies
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SantaClausowitz (360 D)
28 Apr 11 UTC
Does anyone else hate Farheed Zakaria?
inside
16 replies
Open
caesar101dog (0 DX)
28 Apr 11 UTC
We need one more player
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=57374
0 replies
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thatonekid (0 DX)
28 Apr 11 UTC
10 day phase game
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=57373
3 replies
Open
thatonekid (0 DX)
28 Apr 11 UTC
join this game
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=57371
0 replies
Open
SantaClausowitz (360 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
Need a sitter NOW
Hey folks, I started a game 2 hours ago, its gone long, im in a good position, but the other guys wont draw, i need someone to take over
3 replies
Open
idealist (680 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
quick question 2
wow. i did not know we had something like vdiploamcy with all the variants!?
who is registered on that?
are there other similar sites? are these run by the same people?
3 replies
Open
idealist (680 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
quick question
if trieste moves to venice with tyrolia support
and pie moves to venice with tus support. the two will bounce.
but if at the same time, trieste is dislodged by a support move from budapest and vienna. in this case, can the unit in trieste retreat to venice?
11 replies
Open
taos (281 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
i guess this a newbee question
why is it so important for some players to play anonimous?
4 replies
Open
SantaClausowitz (360 D)
20 Apr 11 UTC
Dropping the atom bomb
I haven't really discussed this since College and just taught it in my class. I was wondering peoples thoughts on whether or not the dropping of the bombs were justifiable or not. I have always had a hard time with this question, and would be interested in hearing some thoughts.
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spyman (424 D(G))
27 Apr 11 UTC
"To repeat myself - what is the difference between this and a school bully."

The difference is that communist has a worthy long term goal (that will benefit all people), whereas the bully is interested in only the short term stroking of his own ego (that benefits only him).
While the means might seem harsh, it is sometimes necessary to bear some short term pain in order to achieve a long term benefit.
We have been so indoctrinated in our capitalist system, which affects every aspect of our lives, from our work, our government, our families expectations, our entertainment, our academia, our view of history and so on and so on that we are unable think objectively. Even if we try to free ourselves from these pernicious influences - the power is so strong that it pulls us back.

Human beings are capable of achieving so much, but the present system sets us against each other, instead of working in unison towards a common goal. Look at all the wealth in the world, and yet the vast majority of it is controlled by so few. This wealth gives "the few" extraordinary tools to manipulate and control us - the mass media, the banking system, the police, the military. But it controls us in such as way as to guarantee the wealth can only ever remain in the hands of the few. For the rest of us - there is just a glimmer of hope that we might someday join those exalted ranks. But most of us have no hope. The game is rigged.

The trouble with the above - flawed as our system is, can Communism actually offer a viable alternative? I don't think so. The few always gain the upper-hand, regardless of the system. Except under communism the few can gain even more power. Under communism if you don't like your employer, you can't just quit and work for another company, or even better start your business.

And while the need to suppress freedom of speech in order to protect us from pernicious influences might have a noble goal, to preserve the truth - the costs are greater than the benefits. Especially in the information age that we are now blessed to live in. The idea that we need to suppress free speech in order to preserve the "truth" presupposes that we know what the truth is - but we don't. We are constantly evolving, and we benefit from this evolution. We need to think and speak freely in order to generate the ideas that will drive us forward.

Thus in nutshell, while I think the goals of communism are noble, its methods are ineffective. Or so I think for today.
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
"The difference is that communist has a worthy long term goal (that will benefit all people), whereas the bully is interested in only the short term stroking of his own ego (that benefits only him)."

Yeah, right, if only this "benefit all people" wasn't totally subjective. The way I see it the bully only wants short-term attention, while a communist wants to not only kick your ass right now, but to also make you follow their orders for life.

I'm sorry, but there's nothing noble about communism. Any miserable prick who can't make it by studying and working can pick up some crazy ideology (and they all start with "people are equal") and then decide to force it upon the others. And surely some people will be happy with it - we're naturally jealous and envious. Very noble indeed.

Capitalism is not an ideology - it's an economic system. Democracy is the political system. Comparing communism to capitalism only shows total ignorance. Compare it to Democracy and then tell me how it is any better.
spyman (424 D(G))
27 Apr 11 UTC
"Comparing communism to capitalism only shows total ignorance"

Really? I think it is an obvious dichotomy.
Private ownership vs public ownership
Market economy vs command economy
User pays vs everyone pays
etc
In our own democratic liberal countries (which are really mixed economies) the debate is usually which direction should the pendulum swing and how far.

"Capitalism is not an ideology - it's an economic system"
I can go along with that. But isn't communism an economic system too - just one with different premises?

"Compare it to Democracy and then tell me how it is any better. "
Theoretically it should be possible to have democratic communism? No?
fiedler (1293 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
If anyone has a clear headshot at this thread, please take it.
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
Theoretically it should be possible to have democratic communism? No?

No, it's not. Can you try explain what this would be like? :)

Communism is an ideology which does not tolerate alternatives. That's the opposite of Democracy, not the opposite of Capitalism. You can have capitalism and communism at the same time. That's the Chinese approach.
spyman (424 D(G))
27 Apr 11 UTC
I have difficulty understanding how the Chinese are still considered communist. I always thought that a fundamental principle of commuinism was the abolition of private property. The Chinese have a mixed economy (even if more socialist than capitalist) administrated by a dictatorship which calls itself communist. Or so it seem to me.

This is how I conceive a democratic communist state: pretty much like Australia, except there are no private companies and everyone rents their houses from the government. Apart from the abolition of private property, there would still be plenty of other issues tha the people could vote on: more spending on public transport versus more spending on public health versus defense etc. Their could still be political parties such as the "public transport party" and the "less immigration party" and the "green party" etc. The only topic which parliament could not pass laws for would be the over-throwing of the abolition of private property. That would require a referendum with a two thirds majority.

To be clear, I am not advocating such a system, but you asked me what democratic communism might look like :-)
spyman (424 D(G))
27 Apr 11 UTC
... There could even be a Capitalist Party. But they would be considered a lunatic fringe who no one would take seriously. All hypothetical of course.
fiedler (1293 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
"I have difficulty understanding how the Chinese are still considered communist."

The Communist Party of China (CPC), also known as the Chinese Communist Party (CCP), is the founding and ruling political party of the People's Republic of China (PRC). Although nominally it exists alongside the United Front,[1] in practice, the CPC is also the only party of the PRC,[2] maintaining a unitary government centralising the state, military, and media.[3] The legal power of the Communist Party is guaranteed by the PRC constitution.[3]

sounds pretty communisty to me ;P

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist_Party_of_China

I know, I'm such a big help
spyman (424 D(G))
27 Apr 11 UTC
From Wikipedia: Communism is a sociopolitical movement that aims for a classless and stateless society structured upon common ownership of the means of production, free access to articles of consumption, and the end of wage labour and private property in the means of production and real estate.[1]

The Chinese have private property and the means of production is not owned solely by the government.
steinrokkan (100 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
Actually, "commies" have been winning in regular elections all over he world for the greater part of the past century.

Ivo: Are you insane? The Nazi ideology was based entirely around cleansing their own nation, their own people -and their practices reflected that very well.
steinrokkan (100 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
Ivo: Stalin did not kill more people than Hitler, not that it matters. (In fact, Hitler managed to kill as many Soviet civilians as Stalin - and he had less than three years to do so).
fiedler (1293 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
spyman - key words there are "aims for"
spyman (424 D(G))
27 Apr 11 UTC
The Chinese have shifted their aim - they had a system in which private property was abolished, but they changed their mind. It seems to me they are becoming less communist and more capitalist (which I think is a good thing) - now if only they would become more democratic.
fiedler (1293 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
I don't disagree with ya there. The reason they went communist in the first place is that it is the only system that allowed them to get the western bloodsuckers out of china. If trends continue and china becomes even more prosperous, then they will *probably* become more democratic as well.

I think you are holding them to too stict a standard of 'pure' communism. Although there is now private property and some aspects of a free-market, they are a million miles away from american-style capitalism. Almost all the big companies in china are effectively state-controlled.

Again the important thing is that they use communism because it is a very stable government system that can't be easily manipulated by other richer countries.
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
@steinrokkan
"Actually, "commies" have been winning in regular elections all over he world for the greater part of the past century."

Can you give me an example?

"Ivo: Are you insane? The Nazi ideology was based entirely around cleansing their own nation, their own people -and their practices reflected that very well."

First, this is wrong. The Nazi's ideology was not about killing Germans. Second, what did I say which made you think I approve of Nazi's more that communists. I keep repeating they are the same... Third, not sure how you came to the conclusion I'm crazy when you say things like:

"Ivo: Stalin did not kill more people than Hitler, not that it matters. (In fact, Hitler managed to kill as many Soviet civilians as Stalin - and he had less than three years to do so). "

where the first and the second sentence are the exact opposite. So, which is it? Did Hitler kill "as many Soviet civilians as Stalin" or not?

How about you figure out what you're arguing first...

Plus, I said Stalin killed more because he had more time - so pointing out that Hitler did it in a shorter period of time is actually the same to what I said.
spyman (424 D(G))
27 Apr 11 UTC
According to this article, which was published in 2005 (and thus probably out of date:
http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/05_34/b3948478.htm
"70% share of the GDP is one in private hands".

spyman (424 D(G))
27 Apr 11 UTC
typo... "70% of the GDP is *now in private hands"
spyman (424 D(G))
27 Apr 11 UTC
Apparently the communist party of Brazil is part of a ruling coalition. That is one example. There are many more.
spyman (424 D(G))
27 Apr 11 UTC
That was to Ivo.
steinrokkan (100 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
Ivo: Latin America? Even today, communist parties are often able to create governments. Communism was the main inspiration for many islamist regimes at least for one whole generation. Post-communists were able to win in several former eastern countries. Etc.

And yes, the Nazi ideology is about killing Germans since only the pure, strong Germans are fit to survive. Extensive programs directed towards exterminating millions of weak links of the nation were planned and conducted.

The sentences do not oppose each other - Stalin killed less people than Hitler -> Hitler killed more Soviets than Stalin and in shorter time (so pointing out Stalin had more time is entirely pointless). But whatever.
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
Dude, give me an example. Latin America is not a country, nor a date. When and where did a communist party win elections (excluding situations where no other party was allowed to run, of course).
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
"Apparently the communist party of Brazil is part of a ruling coalition. That is one example. There are many more. "

I am sorry - maybe it's because I'm not a native speaker - but which part of "win elections" is not clear to you? How does some minority party that have put communism on their title and got 5% have anything to do with Stalinist USSR... and even be considered a relevant example.
spyman (424 D(G))
27 Apr 11 UTC
Moldova: 1998 to 2009
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
@steinrokkan

It's very hard to discuss anything with people who change their words all the time. You said: "in fact, Hitler managed to kill as many Soviet civilians as Stalin".

...and Stalin did kill more people than Hitler - and they were his countrymen.
steinrokkan (100 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
Chile, Nicaragua, Bolivia, Venezuela...
Also - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pink_tide - at least some of those are genuinly communist.
In Europe - recent elections in Moldova.
Also see - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_general_election,_1948
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
@spyman
Moldova is correct. The only place to actually have a communist part win an election. Then again, they had 80 years of communism beforehand... so I guess there're valid reasons for them being a little bit brainwashed, don't you think?

My point was that communists never came or stayed in power peacefully. Moldova is a weird exception and I don't really think I need to convince you of it.
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
Nicaragua, Bolivia and Venezuela were/are dictatorships. One-party system. Great achievement to win such elections. Why not add Cuba and North Korea to this list...
steinrokkan (100 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
I don't know why I even try to discuss anything with. You ask something, I give you an objectively correct answer, you dismiss it because you don't like it. All rejoice.
fiedler (1293 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
@spyman

"70% of the GDP is *now in private hands"

Yes but that's a fairly meaningless statistic. That 70% is coming from the vast bulk of the chinese population, so accounts for the income of taxi drivers, food vendors, cleaners, etc. So - the question is, who has more influence - the 70% of GDP that consists largely of ordinary people scraping a living, or the 30% that consists of multi-billion dollar state-controlled companies? The point is the true power lies with the state - the communist system tightly restricts what even the very wealthy can do with their money.

If you go to China you will find you have no privacy. 'They' will have someone watching you 24 hours a day, because they quite rightly fear the subversive power of money. When they become a lot richer, foreign money will no longer be such a threat. However, this may take another century or two :P
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
"I don't know why I even try to discuss anything with. You ask something, I give you an objectively correct answer, you dismiss it because you don't like it. All rejoice. "

I agree with you on that one - discussing something with people who can't make a difference between a left-wing party in Brazil and Stalinist USSR and would come up with any lame and irrelevant example to justify a point is very hard. It's not that I don't like it - it's just that it's too naive and ignorant - and a total waste of time.

I'm happy knowing communism is already an extinct concept which just a few poor souls that still believe in it. Quite similar to fascism actually.

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426 replies
Dpromer (0 DX)
24 Apr 11 UTC
Why is diplomacy the best game ever?
Well diplomacy is obviously the best game in the world.... Right but I want some opinions of why?
43 replies
Open
hthefourth (516 D)
26 Apr 11 UTC
Worlddip bug?
I've got an fleet in Armenia, and I can't move to Moscow or support moves to Moscow, even though it appears that I should be able to move there. Can anybody help?
4 replies
Open
Red Squirrel (856 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
Ancient Med
gameID=57249

100 D buy in
0 replies
Open
IKE (3845 D)
27 Apr 11 UTC
To funny not to share
http://www.roadkilltshirts.com/

Here are some really funny t-shirts. Enjoy.
0 replies
Open
Geofram (130 D(B))
26 Apr 11 UTC
Game Search Filters Not Working
I'll test more but right now the most obvious is finished games -> won.
This filter is showing me games that were a mere survival (which would be fine) but its also showing me plenty of games where the player definitely lost.
1 reply
Open
Sydney City (0 DX)
26 Apr 11 UTC
Outing players in anon game
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=57197
51 replies
Open
Draugnar (0 DX)
22 Apr 11 UTC
I am so proud of the students at NKU.
When Westboro threatened to stage one of their protests at a local soldiers funeral, the students gathered strong enough to show them down. Of coursem the Westboro cowards didn't actually show, but still... Way to go NKU! You make us proud.
100 replies
Open
kaner406 (356 D)
26 Apr 11 UTC
Gunboat - Just Fucking Ready Already!!!
nuf said.
14 replies
Open
thedayofdays (95 D)
24 Apr 11 UTC
Best WD Games?
So. I like to go through the finished games and look to find the best games. Anyone have any particular games they really liked that I might be interested in? They can be games you were a part of, or just games you found at one point, like I do sometimes, that you thought were really good, or very interesting.

Thanks.
29 replies
Open
FatherSnitch (476 D(B))
21 Apr 11 UTC
FTF Diplomacy in Fort Worth, May 21
Anyone who subscribes to the Texas Diplomacy group on yahoo will already know this, but Douglas Kent is running Diplomacy boards at TexiCon in Fort Worth on Saturday May 21st. I'm currently working on getting a day pass from MotherSnitch. Anyone interested should join the texas-diplomacy group on yahoo at http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/texas-diplomacy/ to contact Douglas.
3 replies
Open
ewaldman (167 D)
26 Apr 11 UTC
MODs please help: need to pause a game ASAP
Hello, I am currently playing in "Ontario Diplomacy League Game 4". It is a game me and my friends set up and the first we have played on this site (for most of us). One of us just went camping for a week, and we only now realize that you have to pause the game unanimously for it to work. Since he has no access to a computer, we can't do that. Is it possible for someone to force pause it for us until May 4th? Thanks!
7 replies
Open
hellalt (24 D)
21 Apr 11 UTC
Smartphones and webdiplomacy
What kind of operating system and/or type of device is required to be able to put webdiplomacy orders through a smartphone?
74 replies
Open
idealist (680 D)
25 Apr 11 UTC
quick question
if two units move toward each other, the move is canceled. correct?
as in, if an army in munich moves to tyrolia, and an army in tyrolia moves to munich, then both unit simply bounce. in other words, they do not switch places.
25 replies
Open
ewaldman (167 D)
26 Apr 11 UTC
how do you pause?
I tried to pause a game by pressing the pause button, but nothing seemed to happen. Do you need a majority vote to pause the game? A unanimous vote? Thanks for letting me know.
1 reply
Open
Troodonte (3379 D)
24 Apr 11 UTC
Gunboat again
Who's interested in another Gunboat? A warm up for the next Gunboat tournament :)
36h phase, commitment to FINALIZE
WTA, anonymous
Buy-in: 200 - 700 D
34 replies
Open
gputin (178 D)
26 Apr 11 UTC
Online mods?
Are there any online mods that could intervene in a game, were ONE player refused to pause, causing a player to go into civil disorder (because of a fire alarm)... he is refusing to cooperate with everyone, and we wish to cancel.
43 replies
Open
Graeme01 (100 D)
26 Apr 11 UTC
Replacement game
for people who were in the original flying turds game
http://www.webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=57214
0 replies
Open
taos (281 D)
24 Apr 11 UTC
i want to leave a game
how it is done?i saw a button that says:leave the game
but i think it was in the pre-game
now in the midle of an active game how do i do that?
20 replies
Open
KaiserWilly (664 D)
25 Apr 11 UTC
Eine Kleine Pregunta
What is the email address I need to send a message to if I want a mod to look at a game?
2 replies
Open
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