@goldfinger I really like your system. It's very thorough but leaves you room for a favorite.

Final: ROM 6 v KSN 2

ROM progresses to GB3 to face Carthage
KSN joins the Olmecs in GB4

We will now enter a July 4th break. When we return Group A and B will send their first qualifier to the quarterfinals

GA3: Maya v Neo-Assyria
Will Maya hold out for the New World or will NEO battle on!

GB3: Rome v Carthage It's the Punic wars all over again, likely one of the biggest tickets of this tournament.

We will return July 6th for GA3 and I am looking forward to finishing off these group brackets throughout July.

(While we are in break start thinking about our fall tournament. Which begins September 1st. Here is a poll to determine which of the categories we most want to bracket next. https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1xgLvzlMWjezKENucrk_rFzwEITuaRElYxooCRNAjm9s/prefill )

"Rome endured through ages, almost a millennium longer than the Kushan, and the Empire alone also lasted longer."

Hold up. You first dismiss the eastern Empire as not "really Rome" and now you include the millennia it existed after Ravenna/Milan/Rome fell to say it lasted much longer than the Kushan?

Plus isn't eastern Rome/Byzantine its own entry? If eastern Rome is a separate category its achievements should not included for western Rome.

Putin is right anything that occurred after 395AD in the East should be an Eastern Roman achievement.

ALMOST a millennium longer. It existed several centuries more than the Kushan Empire did.

315 years compared to 793.

So less than half a millennium longer.

Only 793? When do you cut off?

From foundation of the city-really early empire is 793.

I cut it off when Diocletian moved the capital from Rome to Milan.

Let's be fair then and say the empire ceased to effectively exist as western Rome in 330, when the capital moved to Constantinople, as logically it makes sense to say that eastern Rome is different than western Rome otherwise.That adds 50 years.So 843 to 315. A bit more than half a millennium.

Is there any reason in particular why you chose the start of the Republic as opposed to any earlier time in Roman history as the start date?

Rome's early achievements should not be ignored. I'm thinking of how they rose while fighting for survival among many other Italian peoples. In my opinion what made them unique was their ability to treat each rival differently.

Pre-republican "history" of Rome is all legendary.

Even the architecture that was definitely built. It also features heavily in the culture of the Republic, with the fear of monarchical rulership and all that.

Bump to keep it unlocked

Rome was pretty much just an efficient war machine that stole and altered other cultures to its purpose of conquest, most notably the Greeks.

Not knocking them they were very good at it..

And we return with GA3 MYA (Maya) v NEO (Neo-Assyria) winner progresses to the quarter finals loser joins the aboriginals and celts in the sudden death match.

May the battle begin

This'll be a tough one.

I am on the fence. Anyone have any compelling arguments?

Personally I'd have to side Maya on this one. I just am more impressed by their achievements than any western civ.

##Vote Neo-Assyria

##vote maya

Neo assyrya is cool there are a lot of interesting civilizations like Assyrian Babylonian Hittite Israel mitamni Phoenician Egyptian ecc but is a region without sea, only around. On the other and in ancient america you have only 3 civilizations the others can compete and was divided. You can put Maya Aztecs and Incas but for others regions you have to put, for example, nord america natives and amazzonia s tribes.

##VOTE MAYA
Assyrians were great, but the Classical Mayans had a much more impressive culture, and building program (especially since the had no beasts of burden) However, we should probably take into account the Mayans were a few hundred years latter.

I not excited for the Macedonian vs Han match up. Why does one of the most impressive civilizations in this tournament have to get eliminated in the first round?

@Hall of Mandos - loser of the SHU v MAC match will still progress to GD4 where they will face the losers of GD2 and GD3. No civ can be flat out eliminated after one match. The goal of you as a supporter is to show why X is your pick over Y and convince the forum likewise. I'm personally excited for GD1 and GD4 now knowing you have such a vested interest in one of the civs. If I may ask, which one is your personal pick.

##vote MAYA