@Tr bad wording sorry, but the point stands. I was 1 of 4 on a vote, and as I have said, and which I feel ND is saying, we want to make sure that BB did not die in vain. Do you have a better argument because this seems lackluster coming from you.

I frankly don't trust you enough to do that. Feel free to copy mine and make your own, but if you take out the bo vote I'm stabbing you.

@DL go back to where I quoted the vote for bo. I very clearly typed [REDACTED] and have quoted my typing that redacted. You are rehashing an argument that should have never taken place and trying to shift the comments onto me and away from you. I have also advised others on posting [REDACTED] on their votes, including BB who quoted a vote before I did, and whose quoting of a vote you have not yet counted. What is up with you DL?

Nvm, appears that was Balki. My bad.

>inb4 Espi tries to kill me

Off to go now, I thought I was onto something there

Page 11, bottom of the page, this is something I have quoted atleast 2 times before.

""Wow, this is much busier than where I usually play. Should have no trouble posting five times a day. I think it's important yup vote to kill on the first day. The more people who vote to abstain, the less information we have. Of course we have no real information the first day, so my vote is effectively random, but I'll say [redacted]VOTE Jeff.

Jeff is mafia. This is the truth! This is my belief! ...At least for now."

to which Tr says "Glad to see SS has made an appearance. Though, his first post is mostly reiterated stuff and a bit of a joke vote.""

That is what I posted, does that show a vote at all? Just above that in my summary, on the page 10 read I posted "Also BB, you quotes a vote on bo, I am not sure if that might accidentally be registered as you voting."

BBs post back on page 10, in the paragraph under FIRST POST he writes "(page 2), “[REDACTED]vote bo, I'm cop and I scanned him on Night Zero and it said he was mafia /s” (page 3)" except he doesn't put a redacted by the vote, I replaced that in this quote so it doesn't count against me. I also quoted this to you before.

Lucland posted this on page 31 "TrPrado:[REDACTED]VOTE guak
He seemed to be starting to make an actual contribution, but his vote on bo is somewhat disconcerting." and "TrPrado:
[REDACTED]unvote
guak: Thank you for explaining your position, but I must ask why you persist so heavily on bo."

both without the redacted, I posted to him 3 of my posts down on the same page "@Lucland your post is just quotes and doesn't really mention what you thought about guak, also be careful when quoting votes, you might want to type (redacted) or [redacted] where the vote is so you don't accidentally change your vote. Also, are you really busy in RL or something? You appear then disappear, saying you will answer questions and do other stuff but you never really do. You and slacker are 2 people I wish we could have killed yesterday, if only to begin work on those actually around to question."

I also mentioned doing redacted in any vote quotes earlier but can't recall where.

Now, with all of that said, please tell me where I voted for bo because this is pissing me off right now.

Great, wasted all of that effort for the third time and just after DL admits to his mistake. *face palm* Now I am behind work again. Thanks a lot DL.

And guak says I'm a reactive poster. Sheesh.

@Tr, this conversation has been ongoing between DL and I since he posted his tracker and I mentioned the fact. This is the third time I have had to inform him that he is incorrect, and I think the 5th time I have mentioned his inaccuracy. I really hope he stops bringing it up and can fix it, else wise I am going to vote for him and not change my vote, just for being so stupid. He even votes for me for this ohh so serious tell.

@Espi … you said straight up that ND and I "decided" the vote against Balki while you stayed on Tr, which is blatantly false - you voted for Balki around the same time that ND and I did. You said that you did so once you were confident that you were going to survive, which you shouldn't have been, because you were right there in the vote tally with the rest of the lynch candidates. Unless I'm misunderstanding you, you are clearly separating yourself from the lynch, and you wrote back to me with something that I don't even see the relevance of in this situation. I also see you focusing on yourself, because you're separating yourself, rather than focusing on what other people did, which is something you said is "counterproductive."

You settled on this vote because you felt it was a decent shot at surviving but also because you felt that Balki's slip was scummy, which is actually fairly impressive since you jumped from a weak wagon to what was, at that point, also a fairly weak wagon - you were only the third on it. Unless I'm misreading you here, you had, at least to a degree, pure intentions; otherwise, you probably wouldn't have jumped ship until after you saw my vote. That would have made 4, which would have topped the 3 against you. Still, the fact that you keep skirting around explaining that decision is really, really suspect.

bo, since you asked here are reasons for changes to my reads. The changes are in large part due to my unease with how the D1 lynch went down. Not much more reading into what has been said at night.

guak: neutral (downgrade from slight town)
I think guak's recognition of the 'gotcha moment' got the better of him. Maybe he wanted another wagon because he felt the heat? I just really dislike those late day swings, and he started it.

ND: slight scum (downgrade from slight town)
One of the BB brigade.

Yoyoyozo: neutral (upgrade from slight scum)
I think Yoyo was legitimately in a bad state last night so he just bailed on contributing. Not a town-clear, but he didn't want to make a mistake.

SaladinSmith: slight scum (downgrade from neutral)
I just don't trust his late switch to Espi. Still seems suspicious to me.

So why doesn't the fact that I am also "one of the BB brigade" make me scummier? How about Espi?

Jeff, I think you and I are also slightly responsible for that lynch. We both were considering switching to Espi, but our lack of taking action kept each other from forcing that lynch. I also was somewhat uninspired later in the day due to phil threatening to switch to Balki.

@bo I was on Tr shortly after guak, guak hopped onto BB and then back onto Tr after no one joined him, I didnt join him on BB as I wanted to keep pressure on Tr. Then ND goes on BB and guak and I quickly follow, at this point the lynch vote is tied, you came in and made BB the actual lynch, while ND was what brought guak and I over. Didn't I say this before?

Around 3pm (pg 22)
the vote count I posted is "Unofficial vote count.

Espi (4): phil_a_s, Balki Bartokomous, ND, SaladinSmith
guak (3): Lucland, , americaslacker, Trprado
TrPrado (3): Jeff Kuta, guak, Espi
SaladinSmith (1): Yoyoyozo,
Lucland (1): DeathLlama9,

Not voted: bo_sox48"

guak switches to BB shortly after 4 pm on page 23 and the vote count is

"Espi (4): phil_a_s, Balki Bartokomous, ND, SaladinSmith
guak (3): Lucland, , americaslacker, Trprado
TrPrado (2): Jeff Kuta, Espi
SaladinSmith (1): Yoyoyozo,
Lucland (1): DeathLlama9,
Balki Bartokomous (1): guak,

Not voted: bo_sox48"

On page 25 shortly after 5, ND unvotes me, at the same time guak switches his vote to Tr after saying "No one is willing to switch to Balki after his scumslip. That is quite odd. "

2 posts down guak votes BB, and as I had been waiting for him to switch and thus bring the vote count up to 3, vote BB as well.

The vote count becomes "Espi (3): phil_a_s, Balki Bartokomous, DeathLlama9
guak (3): Lucland, americaslacker, Trprado
Balki Bartokomous (3): ND, guak, Espi
TrPrado (2): Jeff Kuta, SaladinSmith
SaladinSmith (1): Yoyoyozo


No Vote(1): bo_sox48"

and then the next post you join in.

I was part of the lynch, yes, but I can't do as good of a case just focusing on my part of the lynch. I know I am innocent and have to focus on the others. You guys can focus on my part of it. At this point I was part of 3 votes of 3, I felt fairly safe it would be a no lynch or someone else would swap votes.

Also, didn't ND do a very similar thing to me in his comments on the lynch?

@DL: Thanks for pointing that out. Here is the correction to my research:

Jeff Kuta (11): bo_sox48, stupidfighter, tvrocks (MAFIA), VashtaNeurotic, y2kjbk (MAFIA), Maniac, Yoyoyozo, Fluminator, ALEXEXTREME333 (MAFIA), thdfrance, phil_a_s

11 votes 3 mafia = 27% of players on vote were mafia.

@Espi “you and I both made arguments for not focusing on ourselves in the vote at about the same time, awkward”

-What?-

@All: Comments/Questions on my analysis or was it TL;DR for all of you?

@bo, Tr, nd sorry i am very tired right now amd wasn't really reading your posts.

On what I said bo you are correct. I thought you joined us after half an hour or so but that was wrong, you joined in at the same time. I have been stubborn on that. Sorry again.

@TrPrado: I bear responsibility for it? You were my strongest scum read from D1. There it no way I was going to jump off of you, when you were in the lead with 4 votes, to lynch either of my two strongest town reads (at the time).

The TrPrado wagon was totally in play, but the guak wagon was dead with Lucland and slacker slacking. I wonder why you didn't jump on the BB wagon yourself to save your own skin, scum.

@bo:
Downgrading bo to "scum" from "slight scum" for asking to be downgraded.

You misread my post, Jeff. We bear equal responsibility for not stopping it when we were both only held back from getting the Espi lynch out of fear of forcing a tie and lack of communication of that desire. I told DL before the lynch that I would if the shot for a tie weren't there, and you stated in your EOD1 post that you were waiting for someone else to jump Espi because you also didn't want to force a tie.

I didn't jump on the BB wagon because I thought BB was just new and that ND, guak, and bo were exaggerating Balki's town cred position.

@Espi … my issue is that you say that others "decided" the lynch when your vote was of equal value to ours. I could make the excuse that when I began making my short case against Balki, guak had already unvoted and I hadn't seen that the wagon was beginning again; I thought I would be leading the wagon back to life. But that's irrelevant, because my vote counted as an equal part to his death to the other three on him. You can argue whatever you want, but the same goes for you, and as such, you should do the same. Your word choice was poor at best in that statement and that reflects on the fact that you do, in fact, separate yourself from the lynch by delegating responsibility elsewhere.

You can cast your suspicions around that group of players freely, but when you do so without acknowledging your own equal role in the mislynch, you're hedging your case and separating yourself, both of which are scummy things to do. If anyone of the four of us is scum, you'll be able to make a case on them without doing either of those things.

Point out what part of ND's comments you are referencing if you will. Admittedly, I skimmed over much of what he said. I was planning on returning to it for my reads before EON.

Are you going to be around for the EON? Post some updated reads if you are.

@Jeff … thanks for letting me know where your priorities are. I asked about two people, not just me, but I can tell you're only worried about the people attacking you right now. That's about the scummiest thing you have said all game. More to come.

@bo, looking back on it more now that is what my words said, and once again I apologize for that matter. You are completely correct.

TrPrado, that's now how I see it. And right now I feel you trying to rub off some of your scum-scent on me. Ick.

There was no way I was going to join the BB wagon. I *HATE* those late day emotional whiplashes.

There was also no way I was going to leave my top scum read to join what appeared to be a random wagon out of nowhere, even to protect my top town read who had just dropped a massive potential scumtell which I disbelieved.

It was very uncomfortable to watch Balki get strung up, but losing a lynch would have been worse. If I didn't feel as strongly as I did about you, I would have done what Llama tried to do and guaranteed Balki's lynch.

@bo: Hm. Could be. I'm just a bit pissed right now in general about stuff external to the game. Maybe I'm OMGUSing. I need to check that and settle down.

Jeff, that's not what I was suggesting.

@Tr: how about you stop mentioning me in 80% of your posts? This is getting old, and your obsession is boring me already

ND, yes, I investigated the wagon that I myself encouraged. You are proposing investigation of the wagon you were part of. This is because Balki is currently the only person who has been the target of a wagon whose identity we know. Yes, I was involved in the wagon - I called Balki out on the slip at the time, and was supportive of the lynch later, as his defense revealed goals aligned with scum more than with town. Nonetheless, this does not mean he could not have been a vehicle for a save.

In fact, you yourself mention there's probably a scum between the four of you on that lynch, and say we should try to find them, and then you attack me for trying to do precisely that. I will continue to look around to see who on that list may have been scum (hello Espi), and I suggest you do the same.

DL, mass softclaiming cop will tell scum who isn't cop, so I don't think it's a great idea.

Finally, slacker, Lucland. You know the rest.

Hi phil!

I read and I read and I reread. I'm sticking with my gut on guak. I think it sucks that balki went down. And all the tosseled word salad doesn't justify it. I'm trying to keep eyes on everyone, but for sure: guak, ND, bo and epsi. Evidence: two of those guys were under heavy suspicion and one by the very guy lynched. So for me, epsi and guak, who are your picks, again?