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A place to discuss topics/games with other webDiplomacy players.
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nudge (284 D)
03 Mar 13 UTC
The Ancient Med - not year 1
What year is the Ancient Mediterranean set? Definitely not year 1AD, by then the Med was a Roman Lake. Carthage was destroyed in 146BC, Egypt fell to Rome in 47BC, Greece had been Roman for centuries. Only Persia can claim some independence on that map.
5 replies
Open
Thucydides (864 D(B))
02 Mar 13 UTC
(+3)
HAPPY TEXAS INDEPENDENCE DAY
177 years of independence
22 replies
Open
Draugnar (0 DX)
02 Aug 12 UTC
And now for a truly original thread topic!
Last Person to Post Wins!!!!!

And we can play some Ankara Crescent while we are at it.
2400 replies
Open
`ZaZaMaRaNDaBo` (1922 D)
01 Jun 10 UTC
ADVERTISE YOUR LIVE GAMES HERE
Utilize this thread by posting new live games here and only here.
49645 replies
Open
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
27 Feb 13 UTC
(+2)
It's my webDip Birthday!
I'm 5 years old and about to play my 100th game! I would like to invite friends, new and old, to play. To be eligible, I'd ask you make a donation to the site (of any amount). WTA 36 Hours non-anon. Express your interest below. And, of course, thanks to Kestas, the mods, and the peanut gallery for making this the best site on the Internet.
46 replies
Open
dubmdell (556 D)
07 Nov 12 UTC
17 games, 17 players
Who's in? 17 world gunboats, one game as each nation, 50 hour phases, WTA, anon, ready-up preferred (but no means required), only prearranged pauses (example, if someone insists on a winter break pause, we will ask the mods to unpause at an agreed time if we don't unpause ourselves by then), 5 D bets for a total of 85 D buy-in. Who's in?
442 replies
Open
cteno4 (100 D)
24 Feb 13 UTC
Balancing the map
Has anyone tried seeing what would happen if Albania was made into a supply center and Serbia was turned into an ordinary neutral? I would expect stronger wars between A/I and between R/T. Thoughts, please.
15 replies
Open
DJEcc24 (246 D)
17 Jan 12 UTC
Webdiplomacy World Cup
Some of you may remember me. its been a while but i got an email saying i should put together another webdiplomacy world cup. This forum is to see if there is indeed any interest in another one happening. Keep in mind i have not been on here in a while and honestly forget how i organized this before. Ghost, could you send me the information on the rules and etc?
1914 replies
Open
Legilimens (110 D)
02 Mar 13 UTC
Unpause help
We paused a game (http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=111554), and now it will not unpause, despite if anybody pushes the unpause button.

Thoughts?
4 replies
Open
yebellz (729 D(G))
10 Dec 12 UTC
The CD Takeover Challenge
Just an informal challenge
See more inside...
271 replies
Open
obiwanobiwan (248 D)
02 Mar 13 UTC
One Post, Two Post, I Post, You Post (Happy Birthday Dr. Seuss!)
Today's the day! March 2nd, Hooray! Doctor Seuss was born in Springfield, USA
(Not the Springfield of Simpson, Homer Jay--Same name as some OTHER poet...anyway)--
He gave us a Grinch, Green Eggs, and some Cat--Keep up this rhyming tribute and tip your Hat! :D
6 replies
Open
krellin (80 DX)
28 Feb 13 UTC
(+1)
Strudy: Feminism Killing Women
http://www.clickondetroit.com/lifestyle/health/Study-Modern-women-heavier-due-to-lack-of-housework/-/2300442/19125728/-/9i98ar/-/index.html
74 replies
Open
bo_sox48 (5202 DMod(G))
28 Feb 13 UTC
Quotes
What are some of the best quotes in literature that you've read? Create your own criteria and post away...
43 replies
Open
nudge (284 D)
02 Mar 13 UTC
Declaration of Singularity
I, user nudge, declare that I have never played this game with any other account, user name or identity other than that in my user profile, and I condemn all who have done so as cheats and liars.

I invite all here to make the same declaration.
40 replies
Open
bo_sox48 (5202 DMod(G))
02 Mar 13 UTC
Draws
Sifting through 10 pages of open positions, I am noticing that it's increasingly uncommon that people actually draw for a CD. In a few games, people have pushed for it, and others have seemed to have no understanding as to why they'd draw for a CD. Did this etiquette just disappear like magic? Pre-1903 CDs should *always* constitute a draw and post-1903 CDs should constitute a draw if they result in a loss of a line that would otherwise be present. When did this stop?
18 replies
Open
SantaClausowitz (360 D)
01 Mar 13 UTC
Dennis Rodman the Great Statesman
Is anyone else loving this Rodman to North Korea thing? Obviously its a publicity stunt, but something in me thinks perhaps Dennis Rodman is the man to bring peace across to 38th Parallel
3 replies
Open
y77 (241 D)
02 Mar 13 UTC
serious LIVE-game (1h + READY button)
*** 1h/turn, but 'ready' when finished. Pause possible, players agree when to continue. Bet 25, winner-takes-all, anonymous.
*** Only serious players please - no missed moves and resigns!
*** gameID=111543
4 replies
Open
erist (228 D(B))
05 Feb 13 UTC
Semi-Anon Classic Game with a twist
Semi-Anon WTA classic game, 24hphases, 30-50 buyin?
81 replies
Open
fortknox (2059 D)
27 Feb 13 UTC
(+12)
Allan B Calhamer (1931-2013)
I just got an email today from Edi Birsan. Allan Calhamer, creator of the board game diplomacy, has passed away. His daughter said her mother "would welcome any memories/stories about Allan or thoughts on what Diplomacy has meant to you."
So please put in thoughts and memories about diplomacy and I'll collect them and send them to her.
34 replies
Open
y77 (241 D)
02 Mar 13 UTC
NEW GAME: 1h live (with use of 'ready'-button)
rules: 1h/turn, but everyone uses 'ready' when finished. Pause possible, players agree when to continue. Bet 25, winner-takes-all, anonymous.
Only serious players please - no missed moves and resigns!
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=111535
3 replies
Open
Fasces349 (0 DX)
14 Feb 13 UTC
Zombie Apocalypse is almost here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ueBZuZAoglE
The fact that our elected officials are talking about ways to stop the outbreak is proof that we should be concerned. So stock pile food ammo and guns, cause your going to need them in the coming months.
If anyone has advice for surviving the Apocalypse, feel free to post below.
196 replies
Open
Mujus (1495 D(B))
20 Aug 12 UTC
Daily Bible Reading
Wherein the ancient tale of sin and evil, repentance and forgiveness, and an eternal relationship with the living God of the universe is presented.
532 replies
Open
Sbyvl36 (439 D)
02 Mar 13 UTC
There isn't enough money in the world....
There is $2 Trillion in American money of all world currencies in circulation combined. The U.S. National debt is $16 Trillion. So there is literally not enough money in the world to pay it back.
4 replies
Open
Chaqa (3971 D(B))
02 Mar 13 UTC
Need players for a live game at VDIP
http://vdiplomacy.com/board.php?gameID=12900

Need some players
0 replies
Open
SantaClausowitz (360 D)
27 Feb 13 UTC
(+1)
Fractured Republican Party and the End of Compromise
Discussing the GOP's current state and its relation to the sequester
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semck83 (229 D(B))
28 Feb 13 UTC
(+1)
Well, that's complicated -- it depends exactly who feels it has been broken. Congress occasionally could redress such a situation through legislation, for example.

But I'll forego further hairs-splitting and agree with that premise. As you seem to admit, though, that's irrelevant in determining whether the court is _right_. Simply because there is no practical recourse when they get it wrong does not make citing them a good argument against somebody who disagrees.

If you want to make the argument, "The Supreme Court justices are eminent legal scholars, so I find their opinion more convincing than yours," that is one thing; but you were making the argument, "Nobody has power to overturn the Supreme Court, so you can't disagree with them," which is just fallacious.

"I think my point still stands though, that when one random person claims the Feds are breaking the constitution and the majority of judges disagree, it's not unreasonable to side with the judges."

Maybe, but that doesn't really describe the situation. There were dissenting judges in the first place, after all -- some of these decisions were 5-4, and there are plenty of scholarly arguments on both sides as to whether they were or weren't right. The "one random person" might be well-read in those arguments and have an actual reason he believes the court got it wrong.

I almost certainly don't go as far as GF or krellin in thinking the Court has gotten these issues wrong, but I do think they have gotten some very big ones wrong, and there are good arguments for that, some of which have even been laid out carefully in dissents and concurrences. If you don't want to get into all those details, that's absolutely fine -- but don't make a weak appeal to authority in the face of an actual argument.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
28 Feb 13 UTC
I would argue that being appointed for life helps with some corruption, but I take your point.

*My* point is why are you defending the sanctity of the constitution so strongly when it clearly has this enormous vulnerability in it?
Tolstoy (1962 D)
28 Feb 13 UTC
"when one random person claims the Feds are breaking the constitution and the majority of judges disagree, it's not unreasonable to side with the judges.... if judges are a "rubber stamp" for the executive branch, as Tolstoy suggests, then we don't have a particularly good constitution anyway."

The problem here is not particularly with the constitution but with the selection of Supreme Court Justices. Nearly all of them on the court today had been government prosecutors and/or attorneys for the executive branch. Very few had legal careers in the private sector before getting benched, and NONE of them has had any criminal defense experience since Thurgood Marshall retired back in the early nineties. The result is predictable: a court which instinctively identifies with the point of view of the government as the result of decades of legal experience representing the government's interests.

"If it's so blatant, then why don't *you* sue the Federal Government."

Because I don't have the hundreds of thousands of dollars that costs... to say nothing of the government permission I would need.
krellin (80 DX)
28 Feb 13 UTC
abge -- much better men than i have sued the Fed...and, as I have said, the court is as imperfect and tainted with humanity than any other branch of government.

But forget past decisions....step up...read the constition on your own. first and foremost, I will bet that if YOU read the constitution, you will probably be ahead of more than 50% of the congress, most of whom demonstrate no practical knowledge.

It will also put you ahead of 99% of the voting public.

Read it....and then tell me....WHERE exactly does the Dept of Education exist in the Constitution.

You take the typical half-ass out...."Oh...it exists...so it must be legal..." argument.

I used to be able to own a black man, too...
semck83 (229 D(B))
28 Feb 13 UTC
"Because I don't have the hundreds of thousands of dollars that costs... to say nothing of the government permission I would need. "

If you think your civil rights have been violated, you always have the requisite government position -- section 1983.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
28 Feb 13 UTC
@semck

No, I'm not trying to appeal to authority, I'm trying to point out that:

There is no recourse, so you either need to accept their decision, or accept the fact that constitution has a serious problem.
semck83 (229 D(B))
28 Feb 13 UTC
(+1)
"No, I'm not trying to appeal to authority, I'm trying to point out that: ...."

You WERE -- this argument is completely new and different from the one that I objected to in the first place. Shall I quote it for you? Here it is:

"The Constitution says that the Judicial Branch decides what's constitutional and what's not. Not you or I. You can't complain about the Feds not following the Constitution despite having approval of the Constitutionally-sanctioned review system."

This remains incorrect. You can complain all you want. Nothing in the Constitution says that it is magically self-enforcing and will self-execute without argument or hitch.

"There is no recourse, so you either need to accept their decision, or accept the fact that constitution has a serious problem. "

The Constitution has the serious problem that the Founders knew it had going into Philadelphia: it is administered by people, who are fallible and corrupt. They tried to set up a system that would have maximal chance at working even as that went on. Certainly they did not believe that they had come up with a way to make anybody lose those qualities altogether.

An important part of the system they came up with, and a factor they relied on implicitly throughout, is the squawking and furore that would result if and when the system was misused -- the very furore that you are now trying to say is logically incompatible with their vision.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
28 Feb 13 UTC
@krellin

I've read the constitution. I still believe that "provide for the general Welfare" is a get-out-of-jail-free card for Congress. I'd also like to point out that the Constitution views arts and sciences important enough to directly mention patents, which is why I don't think it's unreasonable at all to include education in "general welfare".
semck83 (229 D(B))
28 Feb 13 UTC
I think that's a pretty good case, *vis-a-vis spending*. It's all the requirements, regulations, and criminal laws that have been let through that I think are extremely dubious. (None of those can claim cover under the "general welfare" clause, except those that are enforced only through conditional spending. Interestingly, in a not-very-noticed portion of the Obamacare case, the Supreme Court for the first time put a limit on their ability to do even that).
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
28 Feb 13 UTC
Semck

I've already admitted that my initial argument was poorly worded and wrong. Shall we move on?

I understand no legal document will be perfect. The problem is that it is so complicated, partially do to its age, that no one can really agree on what it means. Furthermore, as you point out, there isn't really a clear system for what to do when it's been breached, which I find rather disconcerting.

I'm not saying we should just fuck the constitution, but there really isn't anywhere to go if I say the constitution means one thing and you say it means another.
semck83 (229 D(B))
28 Feb 13 UTC
"The problem is that it is so complicated, partially do to its age, that no one can really agree on what it means."

That's not really fair. It's actually very UN-complicated. Almost all the disagreements come about from philosophical disagreements about whether it should still be followed textually, or in some other fashion. Those would exist no matter the document.

"Furthermore, as you point out, there isn't really a clear system for what to do when it's been breached, which I find rather disconcerting."

It's as clear as it can be. Any complications come from the very checks and balances that make it work. The only simpler system is to give all the power to a single person. That system is beautifully simple: everybody unhappily does what he says. If you disagree, you go to jail.

"I'm not saying we should just fuck the constitution, but there really isn't anywhere to go if I say the constitution means one thing and you say it means another. "

Sure there is. We go to court and litigate. One of us wins, and that's what happens. The other of us complains and keeps arguing. Maybe over time that person convinces enough people to get change. Maybe he doesn't. It's called democracy. It's messy. Welcome.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
28 Feb 13 UTC
I don't think that's completely true.

For instance, why does the President appoint Judges? That seems like it's bound to cause trouble.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
28 Feb 13 UTC
With Congress's approval, I know, but still...
Fasces349 (0 DX)
28 Feb 13 UTC
lets go over the sequester, it doesn't cut enough, but its a start.

As a member of congress I would vote nay to any compromise that doesn't address entitlement reform.
semck83 (229 D(B))
28 Feb 13 UTC
I'm not sure what you're saying isn't true, exactly, but to get to your question -- it's not a perfect system, but the problem is, none of the systems is. This was a reasonable compromise. He needs the advice of the Senate, so he can't go out on a limb by himself and (for example) put somebody there who will help him beat up on Congress; or at least he can't without the Senate's permission. But it's the President, and not some committee or Congress. I don't know about you, but I'd hate that much worse.

But I'm not really sure which system you're saying would be better.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
28 Feb 13 UTC
Well, I certainly don't have a better suggestion.
semck83 (229 D(B))
28 Feb 13 UTC
Ah, but that's the whole point you see? The framers were having to sit down and actually write something -- to be realistic and put down an option on paper. It's easy to criticize all kinds of things about what they did, and they did plenty of that at the convention (more than of anything else, maybe); but you have to choose the *best* system, which will almost certainly not be the system that can't be criticized at all.

For most of the decisions they made, there are pretty good arguments for why it was the better decision than any of the alternatives.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
28 Feb 13 UTC
Sure, and maybe this is the best system. I don't know, mostly because I've only thought about this problem for the last half hour. I wouldn't dare claim I could do better in such a short period of time.

Veers (544 D)
28 Feb 13 UTC
Just let the federal government go bankrupt and rebuild the country from the ground up, problem solved.
semck83 (229 D(B))
28 Feb 13 UTC
Cool, abge.

Of course, just to be clear, I do think there are certainly some big mistakes that were made. By far the biggest was the 3/5 compromise, which has now been corrected, arguably at the expense of a war.

So I'm not saying it's absolutely the best possible system, but I do think it's surprisingly close to it, and that many or most of the changes people suggest would actually make it worse.
krellin (80 DX)
28 Feb 13 UTC
(+1)
The Federal government ***IS**** bankrupt! ALREADY!!!! They just haven't realized it yet.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
28 Feb 13 UTC
@semck

Sure. I believe this all started by Gun requesting us to reduce the Federal Government until it no longer breaks the constitution. I maintain that's a silly position, as many people don't even think the constitution's been broken.

@krellin

Does that Dept. of Education argument work for you?
bo_sox48 (5202 DMod(G))
28 Feb 13 UTC
^ since the magical failed election of 2000
semck83 (229 D(B))
28 Feb 13 UTC
Right.

And I still disagree with that position -- just because "many" people don't think the constitution has been broken does not mean that it has not. Many people did not think the constitution had been broken by school segregation.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
28 Feb 13 UTC
@semck

Sure, but just saying that, without mentioning *what* is unconstitutional or *why* is what I find silly.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
28 Feb 13 UTC
In other words, to assume that everyone agrees the same things are unconstitutional, especially when legally they aren't, is silly.
semck83 (229 D(B))
28 Feb 13 UTC
Ah! Well, I can agree that positions such as the claim of unconstitutionality should be supported, at least if asked.

As I briefly indicated before, I would probably be a split between the two of you if this argument played out. I agree with you about 80% of spending (which includes a lot of the things GF presumably objects to), but I think that most things that aren't spending are highly dubious, including a huge proportion of the things that find cover under the commerce clause.
semck83 (229 D(B))
28 Feb 13 UTC
Well, I suppose GF was assuming we knew he was a libertarian, so he found the usual libertarian things unconstitutional. I'm not sure I think he should have to list them all every time. But I get what you're saying.
Gunfighter06 (224 D)
28 Feb 13 UTC
I would argue that under the Tenth Amendment to the United States Constitution that the federal government can do little more than organize a national defense and settle interstate disputes.

Before 1913, there was no federal income tax. The federal government ran on *next to nothing* for a budget. During that time, we had roads, schools, law enforcement, a kickass military, et cetera. As a broad generalization, the federal government fucks up everything it touches except for the military.
Gunfighter06 (224 D)
28 Feb 13 UTC
I would concede and even argue that "national defense" would include certain infrastructure investments, such as maintenance of the Interstate Highway System and airports that are usable for military operations, especially infrastructure investments that have secondary military utility/purpose.

But education, welfare, "entitlements"... no. The federal government does not have the authority.

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159 replies
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
01 Mar 13 UTC
Chief Justice Roberts Slanders the Commonwealth of Mass
Incompetent mistake or willful slander? Either way, it is unbecoming of a Chief Justice.

http://tinyurl.com/anzaerl
20 replies
Open
Colonel Saloh Cin (100 D)
28 Feb 13 UTC
Are you the one who will rule the world?
For the easy payment of 15 D, you can enjoy the chance to rule the
world with The World Wide Schlieffen Plan. ( http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=111246 ) . If you can take 10 minutes out of you day for possible world domination, than this deal is for you. In fact this deal is just to good. I'm gonna have to put a time limit
of 7 days for this. I would wait that long though. there's only 13 spaces
left.
3 replies
Open
redhouse1938 (429 D)
01 Mar 13 UTC
Facts
So, ckroberts just pointed out that in a newspaper article on something US supreme court judge Roberts said about Massachusetts, whereas the debate could have possibly been resolved by providing data, they treated it as a "he-said he-said thing". I actually see that a lot.
5 replies
Open
RaymondNordahl (1132 D)
01 Mar 13 UTC
Parameter 'fromTerrID' set to invalid value 14 - error message
I got the error message above in the game "fast g" gameID=111432
What does it mean and why did it show?
(I won the game anyway, so it didn't really make an impact on gameplay...)
I can email a screenshot if neccesary
1 reply
Open
SYnapse (0 DX)
01 Mar 13 UTC
Why do we fight?
A list to contribute towards:
8 replies
Open
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