grncton,
although i agree you point of driving high should be illegal, truth is that it is pendent on the individual basis. drinking and driving is illegal, yet some people still do it, while others refuse to (such as myself... i have never, and never will drink and drive)

unless you do and then the above post is no longer true.

No, the point still stands. You shouldn't punish responsible drinkers for the actions of the irresponsible ones, and the same argument goes for cannabis. Driving while under the influence of either substance would be highly irresponsible and should be punished, but you can't make either substance illegal on the assumption that people will start driving while under the influence.

that is true and just look how well it went when the U.S. tried to ban alcohol. I would guess something similar would happen if we now tried it with marijuana.

It's already happening. America and Mexico are paying in green and red.

I love being gone and seeing thing said that should have been. (Toby and Chrisp get credit for having the fun of articulating why this can't be what you want)

I have no reason to respond to DJ's silly "I find it sad you can't participate in an intellectual pursuit like this. " Especially when I said TWICE you illiterate bastage that I didn't want to not that I am not able to waste time.

I smoked a lot as a kid and still do to this day, and for a layman have looked at this quite a bit.

For me marijuana was always cheaper and easier to obtain than alcohol or other drugs, which is why I used it as a kid. The problem is studies on mice have clearly shown that marijuana is by far at its most harmful when children smoke it. I think making it legal could help keep it away from kids, so long as there are very strict rules about reselling it

I have absolutely no problem with adults using it, but it really has to be kept out of the hands of kids

(Still do very occasionally to this day, I should say)

i belive it is safer then alcohol....way safer..i belive weed should be legalized and alcohol should be illegal it is the worst drug

Yeah legalize it. Let the grown-ups decide what they want to.

...to do

You believe it's safer than alcohol? You're gonna need proof because I'm not convinced.

Addiction of any kind can be harmful. Being addicted to work can be as bad as a drug.
My feeling is though that if your inclined that way alcohol addiction can kill you much faster that pot. Recently a twenty-two year old man died of cirrhosis of the liver in the UK caused by alcohol. I can't imagine anyone has died that quickly from a disease caused by mary-jane (sorry can't spell right now I am too drunk).

"Perhaps we should have threads arguing for .... the revocation of women's suffrage."

Ah, umm... I've kinda already done this.

My school (all boys) is next door to an all-girls school. We have an annual inter-school debate, and this year (atmysuggestionnowshush) the motion was "This house regrets the emancipation of women". There were relatively few women in the audience (read about a dozen) and well over 100 boys. We won by above 100 (we couldn't be bothered to count) to about 30.

@Sayjo "I have no reason to respond to DJ's silly "I find it sad you can't participate in an intellectual pursuit like this. " Especially when I said TWICE you illiterate bastage that I didn't want to"

Actually, you said you didn't want to. You said you couldn't. Twice. "I can't. Those who think they can for me.... **ROFL** " "I said I couldn't partake in the opposition"

You DIDN'T say you didn't want to. You said you couldn't.

I think that a lot of people here could probably give this side of the argument a better treatment if they really tried but aren't putting in the effort. I'm going out of town and probably won't be able to follow up, but here's an attempt to keep things moving.

1) To anyone using the "safety" argument (i.e., THC is less harmful and less addicting than alcohol): I found this chart very interesting - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Rational_scale_to_assess_the_harm_of_drugs_(mean_physical_harm_and_mean_dependence).svg. Apparently, GHB (the date rape drug) is both less harmful and less addicting than THC, so anyone arguing that THC should be legalized should also support the legalization of GHB.

2) Back to the driving argument: This was shrugged off with the claim that overly wide bans on a substance for the purpose of improving road safety aren't justified. But look at alcohol. In the US, you get full legal rights at 18 - except drinking, which happens at 21. This is due to a campaign against young drunk driving in the 1980s - the drinking age is set by federal highway laws. The result is a full ban against anyone under age 20 drinking, even though some may be able to do it responsibly, and yet it has had a significant impact in reducing drunk driving incidents. With current marijuana laws, the same effect happens - there are very few high driving incidents. The fact that a statute is overbroad does not mean that it can't be extremely effective at achieving its goals.

1) No-one wants to be able to buy GHB. If more than 50% of people want a drug legalized (and at the moment it's not too much less for marijuana if you can believe polls) then you'd expect in a democracy it'd be legalized. Since no-one wants GHB there's no risk of that. Also anesthetics are safe if used correctly, but anesthetics and GHB can have harmful applications

2) Haven't been following the "driving argument", but it doesn't sound too important

I find it hard to believe that GHB is less harmful than THC. GHB (in Australia this is often referred to as Fantasy) is really is to OD on. Their is a fine line between a safe level and a dangerous level resulting in coma and even death (mainly when combinded with alcohol or other drugs such as ecstasy). I have never heard of anyone falling into a coma because of marijuana.

typo... really easy to OD on [GHB]

@DJ Gasp you're a prescriptivist!!!

Sayjo, no, you've said you COULD participate. That's a big difference from WILL not. But you got snide at me saying 'I won't respond to you because I've already told you twice...' No, you hadn't told me at all, but whatever. Can't, won't. Fine, stop posting then.

I would say that most arguments against legalization are rooted in basic moralistic notions that drugs are "wrong." As I understand the science, studies, and literature, marijuana is not really a "gateway drug", nor is it more "unsafe" "addictive" than alcohol, and it's pretty clear that minors can get their hands on drugs as easier, if not easier, than alcohol.

So, if I were to argue the view that marijuana should remain illegal, it seems the primary arguments must be economic. Here in California, medical marijuana is legal. In my East Bay neighbor of Oakland, the city just raised a tax on the sales made by the handful of marijuana dispensaries that act legally. One of the arguments that was bandied about was that if the government legalizes weed and regulates and taxes it, you then have a situation where there can be a black market to buy untaxed and unregulated weed on the cheap. The comparison, I guess, was to buying moonshine from your local hillbilly rather than the stuff at the liquor store which is highly taxed. Or the fact that people really do drive to North Carolina to buy untaxed cigarettes and then sell them in states like California where the taxes are high. The concern was that if this black market remained, then you still have the risk for a criminal syndicate to grow around that black market, just like the current gang violence which is based in large part around the drug trade.

I would say this is a weak claim and the risks are minor. Also, once a culture of legalized and regulated marijuana is accepted, people are likely to simply buy the taxed stuff rather than their black market dealer--just like the vast majority of people buy their smokes and booze from legitimate retailers, rather than the black market. But at least the logic of this argument is more or less sound.

The other arguments I have heard are about reduced productivity--that people are going to become stoners, and go to work high or not go to work at all, and the ease of access to drugs will increase this. I'm largely unconvinced, but then again I have many friends who are huge stoners and really don't do much with their lives. Of course, I don't think legalization would change their lack of motivation.

Finally, I have heard arguments about the health-care costs of marijuana, and that legalization could increase the incidence of lung or mouth cancer, or things like that. Once again, the increased costs would seem marginal to me, and certainly pale in comparison to cigarettes which remain legal.

So, I'm not sure I actually did what DJ wanted--trying to present the arguments in favor of prohibition--rather than simply discredited additional arguments. Oh well.

Although I can hardly give an opinion on how safe marijuana is, I can tell you this:

I am a rising senior in high school with a couple of friends who recently (1 year ago) started smoking pot. Since then, I have watched their lives deteriorate.

And the thing is this: These kids weren't fuck ups. They were intelligent human beings with a future ahead of each one them.
And with college on the horizon, you'd think intelligence would be something of value in their lives.

Here is the flaw in your logic, the US is legalizing marijuana to help those with legitimate medical need. Pharmacies are not going to just give out these drugs to ant "intelligent human beings" who want them. I actually think we are going to see a decline in the amount of people using marijuana illegally due to the fact the government is now actually concerned with controlling the substance.
On another note, the legalization of marijuana is not going to impact those people who are addicted to the substance already. If a person is truly set on the idea of using drugs marijuana is a convenient substance, for the reasons kestasjk gave, but not the only one, a person can crush common drugs and OD for a similar effect. After weighing all the arguments I honestly think that legal marijuana will help those with legitimate medical need more then it will harm any potential or current drug addicts.

DJ is a bitch

Enough with the fighting. This post is about marijuana legalization.

No it isn't!!! It's about keeping it illegal everyone is just posting the opposite of what DJ wanted.

my cousin and aunt died on marijuana so yes that crap needs to be illegal to over counter dealing and crap but medically its debatibal