To some extent, but WWII was an eye opener for America too

It was, I completely agree. I think we are slowly forgetting the lessons though, and Europe too. I mean.... Look at the state of Muslims there today

Of *some* Muslims there

And Israel should show anyone how it is very easy to become fascist as a reaction to fascism. The USA is a similar story - in order to best the fascists we intern the Japanese and nuke a city. And now we are the savior of the world and the exceptional country, etc etc

Again, yanik, it's not all or nothing. Degrees of fascism is still fascism. I'm sure there were a few Jews who had a nazi buddy and were spared the holocaust. So, it was only *some* Jews....

Fascism is a historical peculiarity coined by Benito mussolini and opposed to communism and liberalism. It is not dictatorship race hate jingoism etc etc. your complete ignorance of that fact continues to expose you as a fool

Basically all you want to do is compare groups to nazis, that's all. That's why you are playing this stupid game of symantic twister.

Fascism is nebulous, it's because the whole fucking concept was created by a sociopathic small fry school teacher in Italy qu

... To justify his anti communist, liberal, intellectual regime. Seeing you talking about people "sliding into fascism" is laughable. You calling liberal democracies, despite their issues in race, class etc, fascist is laughable. You labeling every group you disagree with as fascist is ignorant. Get over yourself and pick up a god damned book

buddy, i hate to be the one to tell you something you were supposed to learn in high school, but words change meaning over time.

I agree that fascism as an ideology is incoherent of course. It is impossible to have a solipsistic social ideology, which fascism attempts to do

This is actually an interesting topic. What is fascism? What qualities define it?

Here's my attempt:

1. Fascism is nationalist - frequently to the point of racism or xenophobia against those of other nationalities.
2. Fascism is authoritarian, emphasising strong, dynamic leadership over democracy.
3. Fascism is militant, aggressive, often directly violent - not simply seeing militancy as a means to an end, but actually a social good in itself - seeking to form a society which takes pride in its military strength.
4. Fascism seeks autarky. Fascist regimes seek to make themselves as self-sufficient as possible - viewing collaboration and co-operation with other nations as a sign of weakness, and a last resort.
5. Fascism is anti-communist and anti-liberal, seeking to attack communism and liberalism wherever it encounters them.

How am I doing? Would everyone agree that the above are central tenets of what we would understand fascism to be?

Presuming I'm on the right track, let's assess the claim that Donald Trump is a fascist.

1. Is Trump a nationalist? Does his nationalism border on racism?

I would say yes on this count. Trump is a jingoistic American nationalist and takes white nationalist positions on many policy issues. He has made racist remarks against Mexicans and other Latin-American people.

2. Is Trump authoritarian? Does he care for democracy or is he more interested in bullish, dictatorial leadership?

Arguable, this one, but if President Trump would conduct himself in the same manner that CEO Trump does, I think you could anticipate him attempting to centralise as much power as possible in his own hands. He's certainly not interested in debate, or in being open to different views. He doesn't come across as much of a democrat.

3. Is Trump militant?

Yes. This one is easy. Donald Trump has said that his "first order of business" as President would be a huge increase in military spending "so nobody messes with us". Case closed.

4. Is Trump interested in American autarky?

Yes. Trump has made speeches supporting trade protectionism and has said it would be his goal to reduce the influence of non-US companies in the US economy.

5. Is Trump anti-communist, anti-socialist, anti-liberal?

Well, he wants to be the Republican Party's candidate...


So in conclusion, in terms of his views and his policy positions, Trump does appear to have quite a lot in common with Fascism.

Like I said, lol

Anyways
What about this Kasich guy? Any thoughts on the forum?

He's one of the few moderates in the running for president.

I know, I know. I mean do we have opinions on him? Is he a good guy?

I mean we've got hardliners on both ends of the spectrum, and Kasich sits center-right. He might be able you convince some independent voters, if nominated.

http://legacy.fordham.edu/halsall/mod/mussolini-fascism.asp

Your welcome

And liberal is not the same as liberalism Jamiet I'm kind of shocked that you dont know that. We are talking about liberalism which the vast majority of conservatives, including trump, fall into

And there's so many other false assumptions and mistakes in that analysis which I will get to later

Kasich is only a moderate compared to the other clowns. He is quickly destroying public education here in Ohio. in 1980 he would have been considered a Right-winger.

That being said, he's actually a reasonable person - he did allow Medicare and Obamacare in this state (which makes sense - he has saved MILLIONS taking advantage of the Federal money)

@ SantaClausowitz: "And there's so many other false assumptions and mistakes in that analysis which I will get to later"

Please do - I'll be interested in your comments. I was only making an attempt to isolate some of the apparently common features of fascism, and then apply those to this debate. If you think I've made errors or unreasonable assumptions, do let me know, happy to have your input.

Has anyone yet tried to simply switch to other words like bigoted, hostile, and ignorant?

I'd like to see the linguistic dancing required to see those terms not stick.

@Jamiet

Santa thinks that you can only be fascist if you were one of Mussolini's allies in the 30s and 40s. He doesn't understand that words take on different meanings through time depending on usage.

Would he rather we call it neo-fascism?

Probably. I don't know. You'll have to ask him. He would probably tell you don't know what fascism means. Only he and Mussolini know.

Bumping for SantaCausowitz. Keen to have your comments, sir.

As shakespeare once said: "A fascist by any other name would small as sweet... Unless you called them a neo-conservative"

No, but I think you have to subscribe to fascist ideology to be fascist and believe that the personal liberties of individuals are subordinate to the state. Trump does not. Jamiet and you believing that "liberalism" and "liberal" are the same is really quite telling. Modern conservatism is a branch of liberalism. A fascist rejects classical liberalism.

On to Jamiet on #2
Trump has in no way suggested he would do away with democracy. With a liberal democracy. It isn't "arguable" it isn't true. Throwing up the smokescreen of "arguable" to pass what is probably the most important point is understandable because you are trying so hard to make an apple an orange. Trump talks all the time about working in constitutional and legal grounds. He has made no suggestion that he would scrap democracy or even looks down on it.

there can be racist politicians in a democracy, being a racist politician doesn't make you a fascist. You can be a protectionist politician in a democracy, it doesn't make you fascist. You can be a pro military politician in a democracy.

The question is whether trump rejects liberalism and democracy for autocratic state rule.

No he doesn't, stop being foolish