And is upgrading the laptop with a new graphics card undoable or something?

Its much more difficult to upgrade laptops than PC's. Usually you're better off just getting a new laptop.

Steepie: Case with extra fan ,

Power supply (don't skimp!) - know requirements of rest of components:
Motherboard,

match CPU to motherboard <socket>- investigate needs and match cpu to needs,

Good, quiet fan for CPU -'make sure fan is designed for your CPU!

Memory - in ways mre important than CPU - load up on Memory <4 Gig min>,

Graphics card, must fit slot on motherboard - again, more important than CPU in many ways, so do your research!!! You don't need a $1000 top end end, but spend more than $100, too

Hard drive - solid state if you can afford it, but not necessary. Size 500 gig+ depending on how much media you will store on it and how many games will be loaded on it

DVD drive

Operating system

stuff like usb slots, is part of motherboard and case. You may need to buy a wireless adapter as well. Makesure your slots on everything match whats on the motherboard's availability.

It is a lot of fun to build a PC - educational, plus you know what you have and can start to tweak. Highly recommend you undertake this adventure.

@steephie

Start reading sites like Tom's Hardware and AnandTech. That will give you some really good tips and pointers.

For a Gaming PC, most of your $$$ should go into Graphics and RAM, but the rest of the machine can't be shit or you'll have wasted your money on good Graphics/RAM.

Go to Newegg.com, but a machine, and post it here; people can give you their thoughts. Here's the order in which I PCs:


CPU: Get a mid range i5. That will be more than enough processing power to run your games and use your computer and a normal computer.

Motherboard: Buy a Mobo that fits the CPU you picked out. I personally recommend ASUS, although I've heard good things about Gigabyte. Make sure you have at least 4 DIMM (RAM) slots. The more slots, the more DIMM sticks you can buy, which means the same amount of RAM will be cheaper (2x1GB is less than 1x2GB). More slots will often offer some performance increases. Try to avoid a Mobo that has an integrated Graphics card, as you won't be using it and it sometimes fucks things up.

RAM: 8GB (4x2GB) is more than sufficient. Some people like to go RAM crazy, but when you bump up to 16GB (4x4GB), you're spending much more money and you have to ask yourself if the rest of your machine is going to cause bottlenecks, wasting the RAM. I say stick to 8 unless you know it's not enough. All 4 DIMMs must be *IDENTICAL*.

Graphics Card: Buy the most expensive Graphics Card you can while still having enough $$$$ to buy the other components you need. Graphics card should be your biggest investment. Do not buy two Cards and try to connect them via SLI. It's too complicated for your first box. Do not buy "bleeding edge" cards, ie one that *just* came out. Read reviews and find one that many people have said works well.

Storage: If you can afford it, buy a small SSD drive (512GB or less) for your OS and a few high-performance games. Get a enormous HDD for pennies on the dollar compared to SSD. I'm personally a fan of the Seagate Barracuda. 1TB should be fine.

Power Supply: Don't skimp on the Power Supply. Brownouts will fuck your computer up. Google Newegg's Power Supply Calculator to figure out how much Wattage you need. Get something a bit higher so you don't need to worry about power when you upgrade your box.

Case: Absolutely get a full sized tower. It's pretty much a must considering the size of high-end graphics cards. Don't buy a case with doors and flashy lights. That money should be spent on your Graphics Card. Get a simple, sturdy case that has plenty of room for fans. There should be exhaust ports on the front, top, back (not including power supply exhaust), and both sides.


I may have forgotten some things, but that should get you started.

It's really not that hard. As long as you aren't covered in peanut butter while assembling your box and you have a little guidance, you should be fine.

"but a machine,"

*build a machine, but don't actually buy it until you receive feedback...

Oh, and buy an OEM copy of Win7x64. It'll be much cheaper than the standard retail version.

How much would I save building myself as opposed to buying something roughly as good?

I mean, it sounds like a rather small investment in time (if everything is just plugged in), but isn't the amount you save rather small then too?

And now we're talking about a fullsize PC, right?

I have a rather small room so that might complicate things a bit... Would it be possible to have it taking up about as much space as a laptop, so it's only less portable?

There's also not really a rush, by the way.

Re: upgrading laptop video... Next to impossible as laptops don't have traditional slots and not all laptops can have their integrated video disabled.

Re: Build it yourself sizes... There are low profile cases as well and some sit sideways under the monitor. But there are certain minimums based on the cards going inside and the need for airflow to keep the CPU and GPU cool. Fans only work if there is cool air to blow across the heat sink.

Upfront, you probably won't save that much money. Computers are such a commodity now that it may even be cheaper to just buy one from HP.

The reasons for building your own would be:

1) It's fun.
2) It's educational. Computers = Power in the modern world.
3) You can get exactly what you want.
4) It's easier to upgrade, which, over the life of the computer, will probably end up saving you money.

I'd recommend a full-size tower for a gaming PC. I find it hard to believe your room is so small you couldn't wedge a tower in somewhere. Bigger = Cheaper & More Powerful. A tower the size of a laptop will be as expensive and and powerful as a laptop.

So if I look for small I might actually be down-grading in performance?

And thanks everyone, as always.

"So if I look for small I might actually be down-grading in performance?"

For the same price, certainly.

Small components are more expensive and harder to keep cool, which limits their performance.

A good example is the processor. A small system uses a socket oriented around the low power processors. A Core i7 for a full size tower is a true quad core processor. The Core i7 ULP (low power) in my Sony Touch is dual core with hyper threading that looks to the OS as quad core but loses slices to the hyper threading process and is a bit slower as a result.

Build it from the inside out then pick a case that will fit.

If size is of great concern, you're better off just getting a laptop, such as this: http://www.asus.com/ROG_ROG/G75VW/.

It's much too hard to compete in size when building your own. You lose all the advantages when you try to shrink components yourself.

I meant compared to a laptop. We're cross-posting a bit.

So if I find a good second-hand PC, that will possibly be better in about every single way compared to building my own, right?

"So if I find a good second-hand PC, that will possibly be better in about every single way compared to building my own, right?"

No absolutely not. I'm afraid we're not understanding each other.

Can you please reask your question in more detail?

Steephie - The second hand PC will have to have the processor and hard rive and motherboard and probably memory all upgraded, possibly requiring a new power supply and mother board. So you could find yourself with a nice case and all used DVD drive. Remember, electronics do wear out. That includes basically every functional part of a PC.

Well, when I said a good one, I meant a properly functioning one :)
I mean this: if I figure out exactly what I want and I find a second-hand PC which is pretty close to what I had in mind and of course cheaper, is that a good idea? Surely the fact that it has been used doesn't mean it's bad?

I don't have much experience with used PCs, but I suspect they're much like anything else that has been used: some are a good deal and dome are lemons.

Absolutely no reason to have a desktop today unless you need the performance for work or need ultracrisp source graphics for your home cinema-style gaming crib. Buy an upper mid-range laptop, use it wherever you want; for full enjoyment just go home home and plug in all your peripherals - good monitor and speakers are a better long-term investment anyways. Buy a new one every 3-4 years, donate the old one - the rest of your family will probably never have to buy a laptop again. Rinse and repeat.

LAptop's are significantly more expensive than a desktop. There is absolutely no need for a laptop for gaming - waste of money, when for the price of one upper-mid-range laptop, I can buy gaming upper-mid-range desktop parts to build a gaming rig, and still have money left to buy a low-end laptop for school/business (i.e. Internet, Word and Excel, etc)

So instead of enjoying your upper mid laptop all the time, you will split your time between a comparable desktop and useless laptop.

I rather have a gaming laptop because you can move it around when u have to. ( note im not a adult ) yes desktops are cheaper but they are much bigger and take up more space. And its not that hard to upgrade a laptop, you just need to know were the parts are ( graphics card. CPU, ect )

Useless? Learn to read. In-ter-net.....Word.....Ex-cel.....three functions which cover 90%+ of most use of computers by average people. I may take my laptop on vacation for backing up photos from my camera, check mail if I feel compelled. I may take my laptop to the library is I want to find a quiet place to work/write, etc. But I have never, not even once, had the desire to take my laptop anywhere to game. It is simply not anywhere in my realm of possible needs.

If your entire existence is taken up by high-end gaming....I kind of feel bad for you.

Ironically, contrary to your assertion that a high-end laptop is a must, you spend a great amount of your time on *THIS* website, which can be run on a sub-$100 tablet.

@kirito - I understand. When you are older and can control your space, then: Gaming rig --> on gaming desk --> with high-end speaker set-up --> in "computer room" ---> with comfy chair I purchased for the purpose --> etc. I don't need move my gaming computer anywhere, because it is in the household space that is designed for it.

If I get a desktop PC I'm essentially forced to do my homework downstairs, which, admittedly, is where I pretty much always do it, but still...
Or I could move the monitor and keyboard every time I make homework upstairs I suppose...
I tend to like to game downstairs though, probably because it sits better, so I could get a new desk and chair to compensate, and while I'm at it maybe a bigger desk so it works out with homework, or I just stick to laptops...

As I see it right now, a laptop would be easy and work out fine but would be outdated relatively quick and be relatively expensive, while a PC would be more of a project, getting new desk, chair and building or buying a desktop PC.
There's also the fact that I'll be studying and possibly living somewhere else in 2 and a half years or something, and I can't predict what would and what wouldn't fit in the dedicated room if there even will be one, so that's a potential plus for the laptop I think...

@steephie

How much money do you have to spend? That would help a lot in determining if a desktop or laptop would be better.

@steephine
Laptops only outdate if you dont upgrade them, I just upgraded my graphics card from a GTX 680 to a 780. You just need to know how to do it

Advising someone to upgrade the graphics card of a laptop when they've never even changed out RAM on a desktop is suspect at best.