M62: PEOPLE'S DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC OF REVOLUTIONARY MAFIA GAME THREAD!

[worcej]

It's in the opening set up message IN CAPITALS. I remember it from when I read it. It is after all a fundamental piece of game information.

@Balki - this is my opinion too. For people to not at least know the team compositions on D1 is very concerning.

Concerning how?

Like, you think it means we are scum?

I see two possibilities: (1) Durga is town who did not recall the part of the OP that said how many scum there were, or (2) Durga is scum who purposefully wrote in the thread that she didn’t know how many scum there were in an effort to look like she must be town.

Do you agree that those are the two possibilities? That is — if she’s scum, she knows how many teammates she has for sure, right?

So, the key question is — do you think it’s plausible that Scum!Durga would post that she doesn’t know how many scum players there are in an effort to get people to think she is Town? I don’t see her doing that. I don’t see her thinking that would be an effective strategy to get town credit.

Would you respond to that?

Certainly. In order of questionmarks:

1. Any player who doesn’t read the setup is a concern of mine. They come in with intentionally limiting information and are operating and making opinions based of player’s actions without having a full understanding of the landscape.

2. Not inherently, but I differ from ghug in that I don’t believe Durga is that bad or lazy, and if she actually is then ND isn’t actually in the wrong for calling her out for that behavior. His method is crude, but the message is true - if you’re too lazy to read the basic setup information to know the team sizes, then that’s a problem.

3. The issue is Durga has been both 1 and 2, but most recently the 2. Thus my recency biased kicks in and I am concerned. And we also know Durga can do a good theater, so it isn’t beyond her ability to fake the lack of information.

4. Yes, yes I do see her doing that for the exact reason your describing. But this is all speculation currently. My needle on her is still tilted towards town, but it has gone done over time this phase.

[worcej]

Loool I just genuinely didn't see the number. This reaction is hilarious

Dislike this post.

That's ok

I’ve seen this shit before between Durga and ghug. I am okay confirming my theory with a ghug flip well before a Durga flip.

[kgray]

I always reference Brainbomb as BB and I think most vet people also do it.

celaph isn't a vet though. When he posted that, brain had referred to himself as "bb" and worcej had called brain "BB," but it wasn't a recurring thing in this thread. Seems like a quick jump for a new player to start using that shorthand when it's not been used widely in the game.

kgray - what are you hoping to get from this interaction?

lol what kind of question is this? I'm trying to figure out if celaph knows more about brain than a new town player would.

[ghug]

I'm not sure I agree with this. I get where y'all are coming off, but I distinctly remember one game where I was sooooo sure Neph was scum and then they just weren't. This is probably that kind of situation.

What about their suspicion do you agree with? What do you think scum Neph would look like?

@ghug: reminder to reply to Balki's post from last night questioning my reads of ND and Neph.

Yes thank you. I'm finally caught up now, I'll go find it.

[worcej]

Bb is brain, balki is balki

Stop. Ffs make clear statements. Don’t be Damo. You know better.

what about this isn’t clear? If I say ‘bb’, ‘Bb’, ‘bB’, or ‘BB’, I mean brain. If I say ‘Balki’, I mean balki.

[BunnyGo]

Hmm. I've never played with scum durga, but last game when I reread her stuff as I took over she felt hesitant to me. I don't see that here.

Flum I don't think I've ever played with scum Flum either. But based on what I do know of him, I expect to see a slip that he knows too much and is bored. Sort of like scum damo.

Flum was scum in M59 and Durga was scum in M60. You were in both those games.

M59 was a false start. And I didn’t do any research after it. I was pleased to nail Goldie that game and left it there.

M60 I would rather forget. And I didn’t read any of it after screwing up.

[worcej]

celaph isn't a vet though. When he posted that, brain had referred to himself as "bb" and worcej had called brain "BB," but it wasn't a recurring thing in this thread. Seems like a quick jump for a new player to start using that shorthand when it's not been used widely in the game.

kgray - what are you hoping to get from this interaction?

lol what kind of question is this? I'm trying to figure out if celaph knows more about brain than a new town player would.

teacon is smarter than this...

[Nephthys]

So just did a quick catch up by searching my name, much other stuff still to read.

I find this situation rather comical though. The three reasons that people seem to be voting me are that I said "triggers", I defended ND and that I thought he was being natural.

As for my wagon, everyone on it town reads ND which I find odd especially when shading me for defending my own town read?

@damo theres nothing to respond to here, this wagon is a joke

[worcej]

##vote ghug

I am less interested in the lurkers who may get subbed out and more curious about people I find doing nothing. This fits ghug for me, so here my vote goes for now.

Will be back in a bit - my 1 year old is having a bad day so far...

I would too if I had you as my father.

Luckily my father is more like HB.

Durga is my daddy.

Ouch, my one feeling got bothered by the wannabe-ND.

[Vecna]

Everyone on your wagon townreads ND?

[Durga]

@Balki - this is my opinion too. For people to not at least know the team compositions on D1 is very concerning.

Concerning how?

Like, you think it means we are scum?

I see two possibilities: (1) Durga is town who did not recall the part of the OP that said how many scum there were, or (2) Durga is scum who purposefully wrote in the thread that she didn’t know how many scum there were in an effort to look like she must be town.

Do you agree that those are the two possibilities? That is — if she’s scum, she knows how many teammates she has for sure, right?

So, the key question is — do you think it’s plausible that Scum!Durga would post that she doesn’t know how many scum players there are in an effort to get people to think she is Town? I don’t see her doing that. I don’t see her thinking that would be an effective strategy to get town credit.

Would you respond to that?

Certainly. In order of questionmarks:

1. Any player who doesn’t read the setup is a concern of mine. They come in with intentionally limiting information and are operating and making opinions based of player’s actions without having a full understanding of the landscape.

2. Not inherently, but I differ from ghug in that I don’t believe Durga is that bad or lazy, and if she actually is then ND isn’t actually in the wrong for calling her out for that behavior. His method is crude, but the message is true - if you’re too lazy to read the basic setup information to know the team sizes, then that’s a problem.

3. The issue is Durga has been both 1 and 2, but most recently the 2. Thus my recency biased kicks in and I am concerned. And we also know Durga can do a good theater, so it isn’t beyond her ability to fake the lack of information.

4. Yes, yes I do see her doing that for the exact reason your describing. But this is all speculation currently. My needle on her is still tilted towards town, but it has gone done over time this phase.

I don't need to read a set up to distinguish scummy from townie. I'm not PR hunting or whatever. So yeah if you wanna agree with ND be my guest and screw off worcej. I don't have patience for this in this game. We're literally getting on so well now I don't know why you need to shoot that in the foot like this. You know what kind of player I am and nothing has changed. And to assume ND has read anything is bold, I've seen no evidence of it. Many other people are also admitting they didn't know how many scum there were in this game.

[BunnyGo]

Nothing. I was commenting on ND.

Her Neph vote was then based on that. It’s one big tunnel.

No it's not. It's based on my thinking Neph doesn't need to figure out ND's alignment.

Hmm. I’ll go reread then. It felt like one big path. I’ve had to put all time into staying caught up.

[ghug]

Sure, but you don't have to patronize me to get me to talk to you.

Not my intended tone at all. Sorry about that.

I think ND not having townreads when he's throwing around so many scumreads is suspicious. Like he's more interested in stirring up things than figuring out alignments. His personality is probably artificially reinforcing that opinion, though.

I do agree that he is being super confrontational. And he is flinging a lot of shade while not defending anyone. I could see how you could construe that as scum-indicative because scumbuckets are anxious to get other people daykilled.

On the other hand, (1) “stirring things up” and seeking conflict seems to me to be generally town-indicative, (2) ND’a general style seems to be quite confrontational, which suggests NAI, and (3) I think it’s generally easier for scum to throw out town reads because they know so many people are town.

I find the “other hand” points to be a bit stronger than your reasons for scum reading ND. Can you talk about how you weigh all this and how strong your convictions are here?

Neph's defense of ND (a response to HR) doesn't seem organic at all. He cited "triggers" that set him off, and said those triggers were disagreements he was having with some undisclosed people. I didn't see any triggers or disagreements that caused ND to start attacking people, let alone HR, and Neph later clarified that ND's tone changed when the topic of censorship came up, but that has nothing to do with what HR was talking about. Neph didn't seem to actually care what motivated ND's actions at all, which tells me he's not trying to figure out ND's alignment.

Your explanation here sounds like you disagree with Neph’s description of what’s in the thread. That is — whether or not there were triggers that may have set off ND, and whether ND’s reaction to censorship fits into the “triggers” category.

I am not convinced by your reasoning here. First, I think the stuff you disagree with Neph on is pretty subjective. I don’t think Neph’s descriptions of the thread that you highlight are obviously wrong. Second, weak reasons and shifting explanations are not necessarily scum-indicative. Townies are flailing around. Their reasons can shift. Their articulations of their reasons can shift even more. You conclude that inaccurate or shifting descriptions of the thread seem “inorganic,” but I’m not sure the things you point to are more likely to come from a manufactured process (scum) rather than a sincere but flailing-around-in-the-dark process (town).

Thoughts?

Alright I don't remember what I wanted to get at, but here goes.

-Stirring things up is only town-indicative if you use it to read people. ND is not doing this.
-Townreading people is incredibly confining as scum, because you have to justify a change in opinions if they make themselves juicy targets later.
-I agree with Balki's later assessment of kgray's assessment of Neph. She's getting bogged down in their thinking differently, and conflating it with scummyness. This is a thing I expect more from a townie, especially a town kgray.

[Nephthys]

I lowkey town read bunny, just off of general nice vibes, talking with celaph, and posting the game guide; ND, for trying to figure things out, even if he comes off as abrasive; teacon, almost entirely based off of post 941; and ghug/brainbomb, for asking about noobs' experience.

I think somethings up with Nep, although the fact that 3 people went after them within 2 minutes weirds me out (posts 111-113). Their explanation didn't sit right with me, but it's too early to call scum or just trying to screw with people.

Jamie's self imposed low posting also doesn't seem right to me - wouldn't it be better to get your thoughts out more? I call this soft scum, since it looks like he's trying to fly under the radar here.

Aarodaytal seems to be eager to get himself proven town, although I'd put that down to being new.

Celaph is trying to avoid pissing anyone off imo, but I think he's solid.

Everyone's sus of kgray seems to be off of meta knowledge, so I have no comment.

Yoyo, bozo, and Chaqa done jack after 2 days, although I would put this as slightly town, cause mafia are the ones who need to prove their non-scumminess, and they need a solid track record to come out on top against actual townies.

Damn, this might be up there with the most solid newby posts ive ever seen on this site. Very nice

And yet you havent looked into his claims. Posts 111-113 have absolutely nothing to do with me.

Unsure whether scummy or just low effort cause its convenient

[Durga]

Dislike this post.

That's ok

I’ve seen this shit before between Durga and ghug. I am okay confirming my theory with a ghug flip well before a Durga flip.

Oh this happens everytime. When we were scum together we tried hard to replicate it.

[BunnyGo]

I konw you were not asking me, but I think your theory is worth considering.

Also, no one listened to me last game when I said Durga was more likely to sub out D1 as scum, and I think that is probably true of bo_sox as well.

##VOTE Jamiet99uk

What do you think of ghug’s response to my theory?

But sure. ##vote JamieT

8. Are you voting me because you think Bo_Sox would be more likely to sub out of the game as scum, than as town? This is the argument that Bozo has made, which you are now appearing to endorse? It is utter bullshit.

No. Still my original theory. I didn’t like ghugs dismissal of it either.

[e.m.c^42]

It's mostly what I just said to Balki - he defended ND's actions in a weird way that wasn't accurate and seemed to assume he knew why ND was doing what he was doing without any reason to back it up.

You think they are scum together? Or that Neph is trying to get credit as scum for defending a town? Would you expect scum Neph to dive into the ND fray like that?

I actually think it's more likely that ND is town and Neph is scum, because I got the feeling that Neph knew ND was being "natural." But I think either is possible. I don't think Neph expected to get so many questions about his comments.

Aha, town points for you. This is the wonderful being kgray has evolved into.

[kgray]

Yeah, not to defend the newby, but BB = brainbomb and Balki = Balki

Would you expect a newby to know that?

I expect him to not be as smooth about QT.

That has nothing to do with this conversation and you bringing up that interaction again makes me think you're scum with him.

[Durga]

You think they are scum together? Or that Neph is trying to get credit as scum for defending a town? Would you expect scum Neph to dive into the ND fray like that?

I actually think it's more likely that ND is town and Neph is scum, because I got the feeling that Neph knew ND was being "natural." But I think either is possible. I don't think Neph expected to get so many questions about his comments.

Aha, town points for you. This is the wonderful being kgray has evolved into.

I somehow missed that kgray post but it's a good one. That's what's sus about the ND defenders I felt, she worded it well.

[e.m.c^42]

Actually, thread is moving way too fast for going back in detail, time to search up my name and respond to just those lmao