Mafia 41 - Sid Meiers Civilizaton Mafia - Official Game Thread

[Nephthys]

Can you detail a bit what you mean here? Should be free in a bout 10 to have a look

they both popped in and voted foxcastle one after the other
that's the thing that maybe not want to vote foxcastle the most

flash had more kinda goofy popins there and later
darg mostly not.

darg felt VERY savable there. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that this wolf team is not the most coordinated one

and flash hasn't really done much at all, no matter what alignment he is

Flash has posted no reads but claims FOx has been his top scumread the entire game.

@flash, please post a reads list, and dont give us I'm waiting til EON.

[Jamiet99uk]

Scum 3 Jamie RHK + 1 other?

Holy shit you're just obsessed with me.

Why am I scum, please?

You can't prove I'm scum BECAUSE I AM NOT.

[CrimsonFox]

lol

[LordQuas]

lol

[CrimsonFox]

quas we should give these two kids some space

[bozotheclown]

Before EOD:

does bozo's switch onto darg feel like a ditching bus attempt to anyone else?

I really want to lynch damo or bozo now but I think it's too late

After EOD:

bozo and damo are next on the chopping block for me

it was a 6 to 4 lynch whaddya mean

also if durga is scum (which I could totally see) that only leaves one vote to move

scum mighta been trying to bus as well with bozo's swap

Before EOD you want to lynch me because my switch from Foxcastle to dargorygel was an abandoned bus attempt on Foxcastle, after EOD you want to lynch me because my switch was a bus of dargorygel. This is the kind of inconsistency you typically see from scum.

[bozotheclown]

I think it was scum vs. scum.

My feeling is the remaining 3 scum will be found in Foxcastle, flash, Jamie, and LordQuas.

[Nephthys]

I think it was scum vs. scum.

My feeling is the remaining 3 scum will be found in Foxcastle, flash, Jamie, and LordQuas.

What are your thoughts on rhk's last minute vote on me?

[bozotheclown]

I think it was scum vs. scum.

My feeling is the remaining 3 scum will be found in Foxcastle, flash, Jamie, and LordQuas.

What are your thoughts on rhk's last minute vote on me?

I think he was unaware you were referring to you plan to try to get the SK to kill Foxcastle.

[LordQuas]

Before EOD:

does bozo's switch onto darg feel like a ditching bus attempt to anyone else?

I really want to lynch damo or bozo now but I think it's too late

After EOD:

bozo and damo are next on the chopping block for me

it was a 6 to 4 lynch whaddya mean

also if durga is scum (which I could totally see) that only leaves one vote to move

scum mighta been trying to bus as well with bozo's swap

Before EOD you want to lynch me because my switch from Foxcastle to dargorygel was an abandoned bus attempt on Foxcastle, after EOD you want to lynch me because my switch was a bus of dargorygel. This is the kind of inconsistency you typically see from scum.

no I meant like you're trying to bus darg

you're ditching your ML on fox and swapping to your scumbuddy lol

[bozotheclown]

This post shows the scum team were faking not knowing about the mafia day chat:

LordQuas makes a bland statement here... and later responds to bozo's questioning with a 'coz I said so.'

I know he's a newbie... but it felt like a build up against bozo, without a willingness to engage. Which sounds like a scum thing... and a newbie (on our site anyway) without the benefit yet of a QT might just act like that.

I'd like to see him interact with bozo's question for more explanation.

##vote LordQuas

This post look like it could be fake:

GM NOTE: There is mafia chat at all times

Woah, that is important information that I missed somewhere.

Whhaaaatttt?

##CALL GM

Where is this stated in the rules or setup information,.please?

Jamie is the first to point out dargorygel indicated he did not know there was a mafia day chat and town reads him for it. Maybe he did this because no one else noticed dargorygel's attempt at looking unaware of the day chat:

Since we're now almost at EoN for real, here are my updated reads. Those which have been updated since my last reads post are highlighted.


1. doubtingthomas - 70% town. Missing the start appears genuine. He has been earnest and involved since then.

2. Nephthys - 70% town. He's active and asking questions whereas as scum I recall he sat back more and tried to blend in.

3. Squigs44 - Dead scum.

4. ND / Flash - 55% scum. ND was lurking hard which he does as scum, and Flash hasn't done anything to change my view.

5. xorxes - Dead town. RIP.

6. worcej - 50% null. Seriously, I cannot get a read on him and I don't see any mistakes or slips or contradictions. He's cold and composed at all times, and only betrays a shred of personality when he's waffling about American football. I just can't tell.

7. DrCJG - Dead town. RIP.

8. Jamiet99uk - 100% town.

9. damo666 - 90% town.

10. bozotheclown - 66% scum. Looks like he was saved EoD1.

11. Ghug - Dead town. What a shame, how sad, never mind.

12. rdrivera2005 - Dead town. Heroic. RIP.

13. Ezio - Dead town. RIP.

14. Vecna - 65% town. Seems his usual aggravating town self. If not town, I'd lean SK.

15. DemonRHK - 50% null. Really not certain now.

16. Foxcastle - 55% scum. Maybe he was saved? Possible bussing involving Squigs.

17. Raging Garden Gnome - 50% Null. Shot was NAI although I think giving scum a Vig would be unbalanced. On the other hand, Ike asked people who he should shoot, and then totally ignored the opnions offered, which is weird, like he'd already decided to shoot Ezio regardless, and hoped town would also back an Ezio shot, thus reducing the pressure on him if (when?) he flipped town. That didn't happen, but he pulled the trigger anyway. Hmm.

18. dargorygel - 55% town. I didn't like him advocating a mass-claim, but it would be a risky thing for scum to propose as one of their roles is scum-only. On the other hand, on page 23 he very organically made reference to the scum QT in a manner that showed he didn't realise it was open during the day. Re-reading that I think if that was faked, it was faked superbly. It feels genuine.

19. lord quas - 70% town. I don't know his meta but he is actively hunting and I like his efforts so far. Seems earnest and investigative.

20. crimsonfox - 60% scum. Foxes are a bit like wolves, and he's been doing a lot of irrelevant shit, and now he's trying to out PRs.

[bozotheclown]

Before EOD:

does bozo's switch onto darg feel like a ditching bus attempt to anyone else?

I really want to lynch damo or bozo now but I think it's too late

After EOD:

bozo and damo are next on the chopping block for me

it was a 6 to 4 lynch whaddya mean

also if durga is scum (which I could totally see) that only leaves one vote to move

scum mighta been trying to bus as well with bozo's swap

Before EOD you want to lynch me because my switch from Foxcastle to dargorygel was an abandoned bus attempt on Foxcastle, after EOD you want to lynch me because my switch was a bus of dargorygel. This is the kind of inconsistency you typically see from scum.

no I meant like you're trying to bus darg

you're ditching your ML on fox and swapping to your scumbuddy lol

I read that like you were saying I was ditching a bus attempt on Foxcastle.

[LordQuas]

Before EOD:





After EOD:





Before EOD you want to lynch me because my switch from Foxcastle to dargorygel was an abandoned bus attempt on Foxcastle, after EOD you want to lynch me because my switch was a bus of dargorygel. This is the kind of inconsistency you typically see from scum.

no I meant like you're trying to bus darg

you're ditching your ML on fox and swapping to your scumbuddy lol

I read that like you were saying I was ditching a bus attempt on Foxcastle.

nope

[LordQuas]

and I think there was more talk abt darg trying to derpclear himself without day chat knowledge, but most ppl prolly just didn't put stock into it either way and I think that's the best approach as town

jamie also only called darg 55% town that's not really a resounding endorsement

[bozotheclown]

and I think there was more talk abt darg trying to derpclear himself without day chat knowledge, but most ppl prolly just didn't put stock into it either way and I think that's the best approach as town

jamie also only called darg 55% town that's not really a resounding endorsement

Why is it best to ignore it now that we know dargorygel was scum?

[bozotheclown]

Here is Jamie answering a question I had before I read the sign-up thread for missing information:

The rules are posted in Brainbomb's first post.
[/quote]

I mean besides the general rules. For instance, where does it say how many mafia there are?
[/quote]

In the sign-up thread he said it was 14 Town, 5 Mafia, 1 Third Party.

##CALL GM - is this correct?
[/quote]


Here is Jamie claiming he did not read about the mafia day chat in the sign up thread:

I agree it was easy to miss, but there were a number of things only in the sign up thread, and you seemed to know everything else about the setup.

I took no information from the sign-up sheet.
I read the rules post in detail, I read the roles document in detail. There were lots of gaps, so I asked lots of questions on page 1. In none of that was there any information about a Mafia daychat. You are focussing on the wrong thing. That is all.

[bozotheclown]

Let me try that again.

Here is Jamie answering a question I had before I read the sign-up thread for missing information:

The rules are posted in Brainbomb's first post.

I mean besides the general rules. For instance, where does it say how many mafia there are?

In the sign-up thread he said it was 14 Town, 5 Mafia, 1 Third Party.

##CALL GM - is this correct?

Here is Jamie claiming he did not read about the mafia day chat in the sign up thread:

I agree it was easy to miss, but there were a number of things only in the sign up thread, and you seemed to know everything else about the setup.

I took no information from the sign-up sheet.
I read the rules post in detail, I read the roles document in detail. There were lots of gaps, so I asked lots of questions on page 1. In none of that was there any information about a Mafia daychat. You are focussing on the wrong thing. That is all.

[bozotheclown]

Okay then, some very interesting thoughts and discussions overnight.

@CrimsonFox: I asked you to give us some specific details of your chats in your QT with Ghug. Please could you do that? Even a few cut and paste lines of conversation would be interesting.

I no longer think CrimsonFox is Mafia, and his play today has been very investigative and useful.

I now understand what the Mafia massclaim crib-sheet is for. It gives them a list of roles *not* in the game - which therefore cannot be counter-claimed by a townie who actually drew that role, right? That makes massclaiming a really poor strategy for town, as people will just be outing their actual roles to help Mafia and the SK decide who to kill off. Bad shit.

However, it is very interesting that Dargorygel was an early advocate of a massclaim, at a time when town did not know this Mafia-aiding document existed. If the document didn't exist, massclaiming might help town. In this setup, however, it's in Mafia's interests to get a massclaim going. This makes Dargorygel look highly suspect for advocating a massclaim so early.

##VOTE DARGORYGEL

I think these three wagons, Foxcastle, Bozo, and Darg, are what we need today. I'm inclined to bet two of them are scum.

I still want an answer from CrimsonFox, however.

There is a logic error here. Jamie says a mass claim might help town without the mafia fake claim list, then scum reads dargorygel for advocating a mass claim before town was aware of the list. If dargorygel was town he would not be aware of the list and be trying to do something helpful based on Jamie's own opinion. (I do not agree mass claiming would have been helpful for town even without the list.)

[LordQuas]

and I think there was more talk abt darg trying to derpclear himself without day chat knowledge, but most ppl prolly just didn't put stock into it either way and I think that's the best approach as town

jamie also only called darg 55% town that's not really a resounding endorsement

Why is it best to ignore it now that we know dargorygel was scum?

I was referring to before darg had flipped, like at the time, but I also don't know if we can extrapolate anything from that? I doubt the entire scum team, or even multiple of them, would go in on that derp clearing strat

[LordQuas]

Okay then, some very interesting thoughts and discussions overnight.

@CrimsonFox: I asked you to give us some specific details of your chats in your QT with Ghug. Please could you do that? Even a few cut and paste lines of conversation would be interesting.

I no longer think CrimsonFox is Mafia, and his play today has been very investigative and useful.

I now understand what the Mafia massclaim crib-sheet is for. It gives them a list of roles *not* in the game - which therefore cannot be counter-claimed by a townie who actually drew that role, right? That makes massclaiming a really poor strategy for town, as people will just be outing their actual roles to help Mafia and the SK decide who to kill off. Bad shit.

However, it is very interesting that Dargorygel was an early advocate of a massclaim, at a time when town did not know this Mafia-aiding document existed. If the document didn't exist, massclaiming might help town. In this setup, however, it's in Mafia's interests to get a massclaim going. This makes Dargorygel look highly suspect for advocating a massclaim so early.

##VOTE DARGORYGEL

I think these three wagons, Foxcastle, Bozo, and Darg, are what we need today. I'm inclined to bet two of them are scum.

I still want an answer from CrimsonFox, however.

There is a logic error here. Jamie says a mass claim might help town without the mafia fake claim list, then scum reads dargorygel for advocating a mass claim before town was aware of the list. If dargorygel was town he would not be aware of the list and be trying to do something helpful based on Jamie's own opinion. (I do not agree mass claiming would have been helpful for town even without the list.)

I'm willing to chalk that down to a loljamie since as scum it'd be dumb to do that anyways