MAFIA 52: You Can't Take The Sky From Me [HIDDEN]

[Jamiet99uk]

See, @Xorxes, @Bozozo, @Tom?

We have two people, at least, who explicitly will not claim their PR / NonPR status until Xorxes verifies his role.

Xorxes is now actively preventing a full massclaim.

That is exactly the kind of thing you would want get out of a reaction test.

We already have 9 PR claims, we should just lynch those refusing to claim, regardless of their reason.

I'm just as happy to lynch the person who chose to claim the only GM-verifiable role, and who is refusing to have the GM verify him. It's very anti-town.

[BunnyGo]

##vote BunnyGo

Why?

[bozotheclown]

##vote goldfinger

Why?

I am voting people who are not claiming

We should consolidate on one non-claimer.

[Jamiet99uk]

##vote BunnyGo

Why?

He is voting people who will not claim.

[Tom Bombadil]

##vote BunnyGo

Why?

Because you haven't claimed

[ND]

See, @Xorxes, @Bozozo, @Tom?

We have two people, at least, who explicitly will not claim their PR / NonPR status until Xorxes verifies his role.

Xorxes is now actively preventing a full massclaim.

That is exactly the kind of thing you would want get out of a reaction test.

We already have 9 PR claims, we should just lynch those refusing to claim, regardless of their reason.

I'm just as happy to lynch the person who chose to claim the only GM-verifiable role, and who is refusing to have the GM verify him. It's very anti-town.

exactly

[Tom Bombadil]

That is exactly the kind of thing you would want get out of a reaction test.

We already have 9 PR claims, we should just lynch those refusing to claim, regardless of their reason.

I'm just as happy to lynch the person who chose to claim the only GM-verifiable role, and who is refusing to have the GM verify him. It's very anti-town.

exactly

There is a clear reason xorx is not claming. And it is not anti-town.

[Tom Bombadil]

I'm just as happy to lynch the person who chose to claim the only GM-verifiable role, and who is refusing to have the GM verify him. It's very anti-town.

exactly

There is a clear reason xorx is not claming. And it is not anti-town.

Clear reason xorx is not *confirming*

[BunnyGo]

Five players have reacted in an anti-town way by voting for an uncced PR instead of someone likely to be scum.

If he’d claimed any other role then this would be an “unCCd claim” but his claim is designed to be mechanically confirmable. tiānxiǎode why he hasn’t cleared this up yet. The longer it drags, the more I think this is all a trap.

It is still uncced because if he was not the Captain, there would be a real Captain out there who could claim. On the off chance that xorxes is not the Captain, he is already caught, so why is it necessary to force the reveal today? Also, why should it affect anyone's willingness to claim?

BECAUSE CLAIMING IS ANTI-TOWN IN THIS SETUP YOU liú kǒushuǐ de biǎozǐ hé hóuzǐ de bèn érzǐ。We as a group never agreed it wasn’t. Hell by the time the claiming started we were barely past joke phase and a half dozen players hasn’t posted more than “hello”.

You can take your gǒushǐ policy vote, Tom, and put it back where it came from.

[BunnyGo]

I'm just as happy to lynch the person who chose to claim the only GM-verifiable role, and who is refusing to have the GM verify him. It's very anti-town.

exactly

There is a clear reason xorx is not claming. And it is not anti-town.

Oh? He doesn’t want extra votes today? He doesn’t want several of us to claim?

[Tom Bombadil]

"BECAUSE CLAIMING IS ANTI-TOWN IN THIS SETUP YOU "

incorrect. It forces scum to commit to lies and creates town clears. Nothing about it anti-town and Im glad xorx is forcing everyone to do it.

[bozotheclown]

If he’d claimed any other role then this would be an “unCCd claim” but his claim is designed to be mechanically confirmable. tiānxiǎode why he hasn’t cleared this up yet. The longer it drags, the more I think this is all a trap.

It is still uncced because if he was not the Captain, there would be a real Captain out there who could claim. On the off chance that xorxes is not the Captain, he is already caught, so why is it necessary to force the reveal today? Also, why should it affect anyone's willingness to claim?

BECAUSE CLAIMING IS ANTI-TOWN IN THIS SETUP YOU liú kǒushuǐ de biǎozǐ hé hóuzǐ de bèn érzǐ。We as a group never agreed it wasn’t. Hell by the time the claiming started we were barely past joke phase and a half dozen players hasn’t posted more than “hello”.

You can take your gǒushǐ policy vote, Tom, and put it back where it came from.

Can you explain to me why claiming is anti-town in this setup? I see little down side to getting 10 town clears when there are only 15 town.

[xorxes]

If he’d claimed any other role then this would be an “unCCd claim” but his claim is designed to be mechanically confirmable. tiānxiǎode why he hasn’t cleared this up yet. The longer it drags, the more I think this is all a trap.

It is still uncced because if he was not the Captain, there would be a real Captain out there who could claim. On the off chance that xorxes is not the Captain, he is already caught, so why is it necessary to force the reveal today? Also, why should it affect anyone's willingness to claim?

BECAUSE CLAIMING IS ANTI-TOWN IN THIS SETUP YOU liú kǒushuǐ de biǎozǐ hé hóuzǐ de bèn érzǐ。We as a group never agreed it wasn’t. Hell by the time the claiming started we were barely past joke phase and a half dozen players hasn’t posted more than “hello”.

You can take your gǒushǐ policy vote, Tom, and put it back where it came from.

If you think claiming is anti-town, why are you saying that you will claim if I reveal? Why would my reveal cause you to act in an anti-town manner?

[Jamiet99uk]

There is a clear reason xorx is not confirming. And it is not anti-town.

And just what is that?

Educate us, O Mighty and Learned Tombo.

[BunnyGo]

It is still uncced because if he was not the Captain, there would be a real Captain out there who could claim. On the off chance that xorxes is not the Captain, he is already caught, so why is it necessary to force the reveal today? Also, why should it affect anyone's willingness to claim?

BECAUSE CLAIMING IS ANTI-TOWN IN THIS SETUP YOU liú kǒushuǐ de biǎozǐ hé hóuzǐ de bèn érzǐ。We as a group never agreed it wasn’t. Hell by the time the claiming started we were barely past joke phase and a half dozen players hasn’t posted more than “hello”.

You can take your gǒushǐ policy vote, Tom, and put it back where it came from.

If you think claiming is anti-town, why are you saying that you will claim if I reveal? Why would my reveal cause you to act in an anti-town manner?

Because we are past the point of no return. Not claiming at all was not anti-town. Not participating is also anti-town. But the reaver is really a deterrent to claiming. A strong one that I don’t think people appreciated enough.

[goldfinger0303]

Also, I did mention yesterday that I would give xorxes some more time to do his reaction hunting. But we're approaching End of Day now, and I think everyone would benefit immensely from having his role confirmed.

Also, there's this

My reveal has zero relevance to the claims. People who make it contingent on that are looking for excuses.

Likewise, what is the danger in you revealing your claim now? You can prove it and alleviate any possible concerns, yet choose not to?

No danger. I just think forcing people to read me instead of bludgeoning them with a GM reveal is much more informative.

You admit there's no danger to getting GM verification. You have your reads on people. Its time to claim. How would you feel about a different town PR who voluntarily chose not to use their powers? A claimed Doc who didn't save anyone? A claimed cop who didn't scan anyone? You're in the same boat. I want your extra votes today, where it counts.

[xorxes]

exactly

There is a clear reason xorx is not claming. And it is not anti-town.

Oh? He doesn’t want extra votes today? He doesn’t want several of us to claim?

I don't want the extra votes.
I don't want to be a mechanical clear yet.
I want the freedom to use the reveal to prove I have not been recruited (this was not one of my original reasons, but the way the roleblock works it might actually be useful to have this way of proving I was not recruited available).

[goldfinger0303]

##VOTE XORXES

[BunnyGo]

BECAUSE CLAIMING IS ANTI-TOWN IN THIS SETUP YOU liú kǒushuǐ de biǎozǐ hé hóuzǐ de bèn érzǐ。We as a group never agreed it wasn’t. Hell by the time the claiming started we were barely past joke phase and a half dozen players hasn’t posted more than “hello”.

You can take your gǒushǐ policy vote, Tom, and put it back where it came from.

If you think claiming is anti-town, why are you saying that you will claim if I reveal? Why would my reveal cause you to act in an anti-town manner?

Because we are past the point of no return. Not claiming at all was not anti-town. Not participating is also anti-town. But the reaver is really a deterrent to claiming. A strong one that I don’t think people appreciated enough.

I’m on my phone so hard to say much. It to summarize the following are all anti-town actions;

1) mass claiming (because of reaver this does help against alliance)
2) starting mass claim by ones self
3) not clearing PRs that are clearable
4) not participating in a mass claim once it’s going (then the alliance doesn’t get caught even if we’re helping reavers...might as well get something)

[BunnyGo]

There is a clear reason xorx is not claming. And it is not anti-town.

Oh? He doesn’t want extra votes today? He doesn’t want several of us to claim?

I don't want the extra votes.
I don't want to be a mechanical clear yet.
I want the freedom to use the reveal to prove I have not been recruited (this was not one of my original reasons, but the way the roleblock works it might actually be useful to have this way of proving I was not recruited available).

If alliance roleblocked you then all the other more useful PRs are clear to work. And if it messes us up deciding if you’re a reaver, oh well. I’m sure there are several ways to be pretty sure you aren’t turned in the first few nights. Reveal.