you put 10% of the pot in it for NMR and 100% for CD. agreed

It already costs you to go into CD or miss a turn, and a factor on playing an online game is that people do miss turns. I recently missed a turn due to bad traffic (I'd been away overnight). NMRs are often completely accidental, and thus it seems rather harsh to penalise people for this.
CDs: I don't mind penalising for CD, but before this is done a 'withdraw' option should be added. There's a long thread about that somewhere, but I guess it's dropped down by now

Hmmm... there are strategic reasons to have NMR... not that I have ever done it. But I would agree to the penalty for CD.

Sorry for being ignorant, but what exactly does NMR stand for?

Disagree.
1. This is a problem if you want it to be. If you want serious games play in the leagues and play in high-pot/private games.
2. CDs and NMRs are generally and 'Act of God' even as far as the game is concerned. Some times it's in your favor, some times it's not. This brings another, alternative, game variation and experience.

I mean, I like the option to be able to join a 5-pot game with 2 complete newbies, a CD Italy, a crazy guy, one other good player who's sole goal from the beginning is to kill me, and a some other spineless creature you enjoy killing. Why do you want to deprive me of such fun? :)

Sigh, Edi there are two types of NMR/CD problems. 1) The type that Figle mentions being completely accidental. People don't WANT to miss moves, but sometimes it happens.
2) The vast majority of CDs are from uncommitted players, mostly 13 year olds with low attention spans, that see the site, think its kindof cool but move on pretty quickly.

Neither of these problems can be solved by point penalties. They will also not be solved by a lack of ranking system, the use of real names or a point cap on games. They are realities of free online gaming.

If this was site you paid for and points were money, maybe it would make difference. But those that care enough about the game are punished enough for moving and if they didn't really care about their game position why would they give a rats ass about how many dip points they lose?

NMR? Let's see, maybe No Move Recorded? Negotiated Mutual Retreat? Non-violent Motive Response? Neo-Marxist Robbery?

You're missing a contributing factor for CDs. If you're in a losing position and go into CD and some poor chap takes over your position, it doesn't go on your won/drawn/survived/lost record. "Left" only records those games that ended with a player in CD.

If you're into rankings based on win/draw/survive/lose, then going into CD is a valid strategy to raise that ranking. I wish it were otherwise.

NMR=No Moves Received

Did not think of the idea of going into CD as a way to avoid being tagged with a lose record. That could suddenly explain why there are single new accounts whose only effort is to take over a one center position. This way the single account takes the image hit and not the original nickname of record. Interesting but disgraceful technique.

It makes me want to have 'no rank' games even more since the point system seems to be sort of soiled by things. Then again it has been a while since I was a youngster and driven by the recognition of achievement so maybe its just an ole guy thing at this stage of life.

Hmm that is actually a very good point positron/edi. I had never thought of that as a potential reason why new accounts pick up impossible positions.

You get a "left" ranking if noone picks it up but if someone does it is like you never were in the game. This is made a ton worse because your name was stricken from the record which makes this form of cheating difficult to track.

I don't think no rank games are the answer though. Possible solutions to this problem are:
1) Kestas email confirmation system. I don't know much about it but I assume it makes it a hassle to create a bunch of accounts
2) Make "left" a ranking you get whether or not someone picks up your country. This is dangerous because of some accidental missings of double moves (it happened to me at a cottage once) and then your country is stolen away and you are stuck with a left, but its not too terrible.
3) List all past owners of all countries. This helps keep it clear when someone took over a country when you are looking for games etc. There should be a third second under active and finished games for left games to make it easier to track possible cheating.

Just some ideas

I LOVE the idea of point penalties for NMR and CD, that kind of thing can completely ruin a game, in my opinion, regardless of who gets the unfair advantage... I know life gets busy and there are more important things than playing a game, but if we increase the penalty we would likely reduce the number of offenses...

PS - This is one of the main reasons I like high point games, to minimize people (sometimes repeatedly) flaking out...

I support this - as I said in another thread, I've got clear cases where people are NMRing simply because they're no longer winning, and so they just stop filing orders. They keep checking in, which means the country goes into CD and never gets replaced. This has happened in at least two of my very few games here so far. It's pathetic.

I don't buy the "NMR means life is busy" thing, too. Two comments to that: first, my life is busy. If I can't finish a game, then don't commit to it in the time allotted. Secondly, it takes just a moment during an average DAY long cycle to file "just in case" orders, and if negotiations change those orders or something interrupts, at least the units aren't just sitting there. This is basic courtesy, and if you can't even meet basic courtesy, no one is forcing you to play here.

Sorry, typo in my last post: meant to write "which means the country NEVER goes into CD and so never gets replaced."

Yes your life might be busy- but it appears to be a structured busy. Lots of things come up in people's lives. For example half the state i was in a couple weeks ago lost power. In a couple of games i had a NMR. Once in a while i'm traveling. I try to avoid it but odd flight times and the fact it essentially takes 12 hours to travel home to school or vice versa can make it difficult. Other things come up...

However, it would be nice to have a statistic that gives say, %games with no NMRs. Let people know etc...

I agree, one should be able to withdraw. However if you start in a game, it should enter into your statistics, especially if you CD or frequent NRMs.

The not playing for ranking thing is definitely and old people thing, sorry :P

Yes, things happen... But the penalty should fit the crime. First offense gets a pass (like a "warning" from a cop), second offense gets a small fine (1/3 the buy in), third and future offenses, it doubles each time. So, by the third NMR, you are already out your buy-in. Then the CD could be double whatever the current NMR that triggered it is. So, if you miss two in a row as your first two, then the penalty is the same as the present (1/3 for the 2nd NMR and 2/3 for the CD), but if you had NMRd even once prior, then you 2 extra NMRs cost you a total of you buyin and the CD cost you 133% of your buyin, meaning you lose more than double what you put into the game, and the penalties just keep going up.

Just a rambling thought...

I do believe that some sort of punishment is in order as it can often ruin a highly competitive game.... as a minimum should be available as a stat. but would also sponsor some sort of points fine too.

I agree with Centurian and others who said something similar: At the very least, if you leave a game it should be recorded, regardless of whether someone took it over or not. That's one of the things I look at when joining a game, and if the numbers aren't accurate, then my information is incomplete.