Do you have FBI Statistics or are you just going to post some media hack from NBC's story?

People have a right not to be ruled by a foreign government. To most Californians, the government (and a substantial portion of the US population) is more foreign than the average person in Germany, France or Canada.

There are legal avenues to secession. But if that fails, Trump can go down as the president that drone strikes Sacramento.

1. There is violence all around. If you don't see that you're an idiot.

2. There is not near enough specific data to say one side is being more violent than the other.

3. Trump ran, and said a few things on Islam:
a. ban all muslims from entering the US
- he did change this, but only to allow his Muslim friends in. He stayed firm for a long time on ban all muslims, even Muslim Americans who were only temporarily but of the country, thus he is discriminating upon Americans based upon their religion. this is a no-no

b. we should go after the families of terrorists
- this is horrifying. this is immoral. they have done nothing wrong. not all families to terrorists support their family member's actions, and while there may be some that do, one of the rites in ISIS is killing your Shia family members. Yes: keep an eye on the family. kill the family: you need to burn in hell now.

c. he claimed there were muslims in new jersey cheering when the towers fell.
- this has been proven to be completely unsubstantiated. there is no reason to say this, other than to vilify american muslims to consolidate a vote from right-wing anti islamic activists, OR a complete delusional belief in what he is saying. Either way, not a strong point.

(PS when he said that Mexico wasn't sending their best, they're sending criminals and rapists, he got shit for that, but literally the VERY NEXT words out of his mouth were "not all of them, many of them are great" jsyk on that media splicing. I'm fine with that statement, b/c 80% of women and girls crossing the border are sexually assaulted on their journey. the crowd coming in, has ALL KINDS

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwj4gcjCmp_QAhUL5mMKHVnkA7AQFggpMAI&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.huffingtonpost.com%2F2014%2F09%2F12%2Fcentral-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html&usg=AFQjCNFsWWWxEC4Og68q2ZvKZ_1yuiRciQ&sig2=d8rAjX-1M5uLB1qMsDj-CQ )

Right back at you, ND. Unless you found those records of post-election violence against Trump supporters in the FBI's databases, you have no business inflicting that standard of evidence on Prado's comments about post-election violence against Trump's opponents.

@Condescension

"There are legal avenues to secession."

bull-fucking-shit. some hack journalist is probably putting this out in some liberal newspaper, but the Constitution has ZERO STATUTES on secession.

The only possible case to make is Texas, as it used to be it's own country, so it has a foundation. All other states after the original 13 were authorized as they came in as states, and their borders were DRAWN by the US gov't.

Other than that, no. Stop with the divisive language. - splitting up the country into little bits and pieces: is divisive.

but let's look at legal precedents! The last people to secede, we went to war with, killing more Americans than ever before. Happy times!

@Lethologica

he can't. The FBI has had no time compile statistics from every county and from every police precinct. it is DELUSIONAL to think you know the dominant violence group right now. talk when you got numbers (not you you, but him you. not you. him.)

Constitutional amendments would allow it.

I don't care about divisiveness. People should not be governed by foreign ideologies.

They should, at the very least, stop paying federal taxes.

Fuck secession. Think about how much political will you'd have to generate *nationwide* to make secession feasible as anything other than a bloodbath. That amount of political will could get you all the benefits you're hoping to get from secession, and then some, if you just skip the secession part.

I am definitely in the not terribly happy or irate about Trump's victory camp. It was surprising, I thought Hillary had it locked up. Still the bitching and moaning on both sides is irritating. It was an election. That's how we have peaceful transition of power in this country. The country took a big swing toward the left in the past 8 years and now the pendulum is swinging back toward the right. Before long it will be back to the left again. I still wish we had some viable third parties.

@James
"he can't. The FBI has had no time compile statistics from every county and from every police precinct. it is DELUSIONAL to think you know the dominant violence group right now. talk when you got numbers (not you you, but him you. not you. him.)"

Nobody is arguing for a 'dominant violence group' right now except ND. Prado simply wants ND to acknowledge that the violence *exists*, not that it's dominant. Meanwhile, ND wants to believe the only violence ever committed is against Trump supporters.

@Condescension

"They should, at the very least, stop paying federal taxes."

So people against Trump should not be paying taxes, like Wall St....?

@Lethologica

I'm right there with you on that one

The reason the civil war happened was because it could be driven by an ideological difference (repealing slavery). Have fun drafting people, especially liberals, to go die by the million in California.

The government wouldn't do shit if there was a unanimous political drive to secede.

"if there was a unanimous political drive to secede."

Again--look at what an incredible movement you're having to build here to make your proposal feasible. Why is secession the best use of that movement? Or even a *good* use of that movement?

@Condescension

Hahahaha TRUMP'S gov't????

oh yes they would. oh yes they fucking would. But this doesn't matter. All the liberal bitches in California are only about 2:1 up on The Trump supporters. There's no unified force in Cali pushing for secession. just a bunch of whiny people, who are making the problem worse.

Umm, yes. Trump advocated a large number of servious legal and constitutional violations. I just hope he goes through with them so we can impeach his ass and get on with it. Remember, he is coming in without majority support, without a mandate, with legitimacy and as the least popular president elect ever by a HUGE margin. He is set to also have lost the most seats of any incoming president for his party. He hates the leadership in Washington and they hate him. He's going to be for the most part completely ineffectual because he has precious few allies.

Not saying it could happen, but there is something to be said for letting the west coast, east coast and northern border separate from the middle and the south. We have very different philosophies in the different regions of the country.

The reason why you should be so afraid of Trump:

Obama made the President's powers expand MUCH FURTHER than in years prior. Now we handed it over to Trump.

Some part of Obama, knows he fucked up. Now when you say Trump is a tyrant: Obama built the throne

@SuperSteve

this isn't at all true. 33% support for Trump in California, and 43% support for Clinton is Texas. Imagine THOSE people, if they decided to split.

States aren't Red, or Blue. They're purple. We live together, and separating would not solve our problems.

@JY But we don't live together. MA isn't purple. And those purple states like Texas are deeply divided in Rural vs Urban. Not purple throughout.

@Valis

34% support for Trump is Massachusetts.

And yes, those states are rural vs urban. but if the STATE secedes: how the Hell are we going to redraw everything?

Take northern Ireland and Ireland. industries there have weird trade laws, and it's costing a LOT in terms of efficiency. There ARE many reasons for NI to stay with Britain, but I'm still waiting for the day we're reunited with Ireland

We need to build walls around our cities, start vertical farming, and then just neglect the shit out of rural communities until they emigrate or die out.

"We need to build walls around our cities"

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Also you have no idea how inefficient vertical farming is, Japan is huge on imports for food they're so desperate, plus how much energy from natural gas, coal, oil is produced in rural areas and how necessary it is, unless you want to go full Nuclear, in which case ONE BREAK, or one earthquake and you're all done for

i'm dying after that wall comment you XENOPHOBIC bastard

If you were born in a town with less than 100,000 people, you shouldn't be allowed to vote, hold public office or enter any city limits.

There was a reason the founding fathers only wanted elites to vote.

You fear rednecks like damned rednecks fear job-stealun mexicans!!! HAHAHAHA I'm loving this hypocritical bullshit

"If you were born in a town with less than 100,000 people, you shouldn't be allowed to vote, hold public office or enter any city limits."

HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA



Oh... oh... wow.

HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA

ok. seriously fuck you. peace out guys i'm done for today

The midwest is the Afghanistan of North America. They have poisonous ideas about government, religion and women, are poor as shit, and love their guns.