Today's Bible reading is Luke Chapter 11
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Luk&c=11&v=1&t=NLT#1
In verses 1-4 we see the Lord's Prayer, which should really be called 'The Disciples' Prayer' because Jesus is showing them how to pray, in verse 9 Jesus promises that the one who keeps on seeking will find the answers, in verses 21-22 he claims that he has overcome Satan, and in verse 28 he says "...blessed are all who hear the word of God and put it into practice.” He also strongly condemns the Pharisees and the teachers of religious law.

"He explicitly gave the command to convert every nation into devotees of Christ, in conjunction with the statement that thy kingdom come, thy will be done, and the fact that Zealots - who wanted to establish the kingdom of god by force, were the main lieutenants of his among the Apostles, points to the programme of world conquest by force."

Right, but you still have the overwhelming problem that this “programme of world conquest by force” consisted of two swords (and no more at Jesus’s insistence), a whip, and a clenched fist, and a lot of reminders not to be violent. That’s hardly glossing over the verses in which violence is mentioned, I don’t disclaim any of them. I’m simply pointing out how you are misrepresenting them; and that all that is needed is the willingness to read a little further to find out that any claim that Jesus was trying to incite a violent political insurrection is nonsensical. There just isn’t any evidence for it.
Let’s point out that Mark, according to you, is the most reliable Gospel. Yet Mark doesn’t even say that it was a disciple who struck off the man’s ear. In Mark it was just “One who stood by”. Yet to buy you’re interpretation we’ll have to go back to the “unreliable” gospels to pin the crime on Peter, and then turn around and doubt that Jesus healed the man (it’s from Luke “unreliable” even though that’s the one you quoted to begin with). Look this is all very inconsistent. My take is this, I don’t doubt any of them. When I read them all together I get this.
“Simon Peter, who was standing by, cut off Macheus’s ear. Jesus told him essentially ‘Stop that!, If you go around stabbing people, you’ll get stabbed sooner or later!” Then he heals the Macheus, and says “besides, this is how it’s supposed to happen. Let them take me.” It is an inclusive interpretation that doesn’t reject this one and embrace that one.
If we go with Mark then all we have is “Some guy who was standing around cut another guy’s ear off, and Jesus was busy being arrested and wondering why they didn’t just cart him off at the Temple”. All your conjecture goes away because you can’t even place the sword in a disciple’s hand, there were other people there. One poor guy had to run off buck naked because the authorities grabbed him by the blanket he had wrapped around him. Now there’s an image you can use conjecture on!

“So wait, we're supposed to claim that the 2000 years of violent Christianity (including the actions of the Apostles themselves) have no basis in the scripture but the one or two Christian movements which were non-violent (which you're hijacking, since they were both socialist - the Catholic Worker and SCLC), are proof positive that Jesus's teachings were 'non-violent'? Talk about cherry picking.”
It’s not cherry picking to say “These people are following the teachings of Jesus closer than those people”, when we have the teachings of Jesus as a yardstick. It is simply looking at the evidence and making a judgment. The evidence is just not there to support your interpretation. I have considered every Scriptural reference you have made. Without exception they are vague or further reading shows them to be inaccurate. To insinuate that Jesus was trying to bring about a violent insurrection; you must ignore the many instances where Jesus explicitly and clearly praises non- violence. If you read the entire chapters they are just as strong and clear (Matthew 5). Blessed are the meek, the merciful, and the peacemakers (Matthew 5:5, 7, & 9). He tells Peter to “Put your sword in its place” (Luke 22:49-51) rather than let him use violence to prevent His arrest. He says to love your enemies and pray for them (Matthew 5:41). These are hard passages to reconcile with the type of violent revolutionary or terrorist that you suggest. I’m not saying that Jesus was an outright pacifist, but there isn’t a command to violently conquer the world. The Great Commission was a challenge to the apostles to convert many people (nations), but it was in no way a commandment to institute a “programme for world domination”. Even if it were, there is nothing in it that calls for violence. In fact, as semck stated, quite the opposite. If a town rejected the apostles they were to “shake the dust off their feet” and leave. That’s hardly instructions one would give to people being sent out to conquer the world.

Don't confuse religion with morality.

Morality is about doing what is right regardless of what you are told.

Religion is about doing what you are told regardless of what is right.

Yebellz, don't confuse morality, religion, or even spirituality with a saving relationship with the One God through his son, Jesus Christ, or Yeshua the Messiah, depending on how you translate/transliterate from the Hebrew and Aramaic.

Morality is subjective, yebellz.

Is he here yet?

Today's Bible reading is Luke Chapter 12
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Luk&c=12&v=1&t=NLT#1
Full text: http://www.blueletterbible.org/tools/printerFriendly.cfm?b=Luk&c=12&t=NLTP&x=9&y=8
A Warning against Hypocrisy
1 Meanwhile, the crowds grew until thousands were milling about and stepping on each other. Jesus turned first to his disciples and warned them, “Beware of the yeast of the Pharisees—their hypocrisy. 2 The time is coming when everything that is covered up will be revealed, and all that is secret will be made known to all. 3 Whatever you have said in the dark will be heard in the light, and what you have whispered behind closed doors will be shouted from the housetops for all to hear!
4 “Dear friends, don’t be afraid of those who want to kill your body; they cannot do any more to you after that. 5 But I’ll tell you whom to fear. Fear God, who has the power to kill you and then throw you into hell. [fn1] Yes, he’s the one to fear.
6 “What is the price of five sparrows—two copper coins [fn2] ? Yet God does not forget a single one of them. 7 And the very hairs on your head are all numbered. So don’t be afraid; you are more valuable to God than a whole flock of sparrows.
8 “I tell you the truth, everyone who acknowledges me publicly here on earth, the Son of Man [fn3] will also acknowledge in the presence of God’s angels. 9 But anyone who denies me here on earth will be denied before God’s angels. 10 Anyone who speaks against the Son of Man can be forgiven, but anyone who blasphemes the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.
11 “And when you are brought to trial in the synagogues and before rulers and authorities, don’t worry about how to defend yourself or what to say, 12 for the Holy Spirit will teach you at that time what needs to be said.”
Parable of the Rich Fool
13 Then someone called from the crowd, “Teacher, please tell my brother to divide our father’s estate with me.”
14 Jesus replied, “Friend, who made me a judge over you to decide such things as that?” 15 Then he said, “Beware! Guard against every kind of greed. Life is not measured by how much you own.”
16 Then he told them a story: “A rich man had a fertile farm that produced fine crops. 17 He said to himself, ‘What should I do? I don’t have room for all my crops.’ 18 Then he said, ‘I know! I’ll tear down my barns and build bigger ones. Then I’ll have room enough to store all my wheat and other goods. 19 And I’ll sit back and say to myself, “My friend, you have enough stored away for years to come. Now take it easy! Eat, drink, and be merry!”’
20 “But God said to him, ‘You fool! You will die this very night. Then who will get everything you worked for?’
21 “Yes, a person is a fool to store up earthly wealth but not have a rich relationship with God.”
Teaching about Money and Possessions
22 Then, turning to his disciples, Jesus said, “That is why I tell you not to worry about everyday life—whether you have enough food to eat or enough clothes to wear. 23 For life is more than food, and your body more than clothing. 24 Look at the ravens. They don’t plant or harvest or store food in barns, for God feeds them. And you are far more valuable to him than any birds! 25 Can all your worries add a single moment to your life? 26 And if worry can’t accomplish a little thing like that, what’s the use of worrying over bigger things?
27 “Look at the lilies and how they grow. They don’t work or make their clothing, yet Solomon in all his glory was not dressed as beautifully as they are. 28 And if God cares so wonderfully for flowers that are here today and thrown into the fire tomorrow, he will certainly care for you. Why do you have so little faith?
29 “And don’t be concerned about what to eat and what to drink. Don’t worry about such things. 30 These things dominate the thoughts of unbelievers all over the world, but your Father already knows your needs. 31 Seek the Kingdom of God above all else, and he will give you everything you need.
32 “So don’t be afraid, little flock. For it gives your Father great happiness to give you the Kingdom.
33 “Sell your possessions and give to those in need. This will store up treasure for you in heaven! And the purses of heaven never get old or develop holes. Your treasure will be safe; no thief can steal it and no moth can destroy it. 34 Wherever your treasure is, there the desires of your heart will also be.
Be Ready for the Lord’s Coming
35 “Be dressed for service and keep your lamps burning, 36 as though you were waiting for your master to return from the wedding feast. Then you will be ready to open the door and let him in the moment he arrives and knocks. 37 The servants who are ready and waiting for his return will be rewarded. I tell you the truth, he himself will seat them, put on an apron, and serve them as they sit and eat! 38 He may come in the middle of the night or just before dawn. [fn4] But whenever he comes, he will reward the servants who are ready.
39 “Understand this: If a homeowner knew exactly when a burglar was coming, he would not permit his house to be broken into. 40 You also must be ready all the time, for the Son of Man will come when least expected.”
41 Peter asked, “Lord, is that illustration just for us or for everyone?”
42 And the Lord replied, “A faithful, sensible servant is one to whom the master can give the responsibility of managing his other household servants and feeding them. 43 If the master returns and finds that the servant has done a good job, there will be a reward. 44 I tell you the truth, the master will put that servant in charge of all he owns. 45 But what if the servant thinks, ‘My master won’t be back for a while,’ and he begins beating the other servants, partying, and getting drunk? 46 The master will return unannounced and unexpected, and he will cut the servant in pieces and banish him with the unfaithful.
47 “And a servant who knows what the master wants, but isn’t prepared and doesn’t carry out those instructions, will be severely punished. 48 But someone who does not know, and then does something wrong, will be punished only lightly. When someone has been given much, much will be required in return; and when someone has been entrusted with much, even more will be required.
Jesus Causes Division
49 “I have come to set the world on fire, and I wish it were already burning! 50 I have a terrible baptism of suffering ahead of me, and I am under a heavy burden until it is accomplished. 51 Do you think I have come to bring peace to the earth? No, I have come to divide people against each other! 52 From now on families will be split apart, three in favor of me, and two against—or two in favor and three against.
53 ‘Father will be divided against son
and son against father;
mother against daughter
and daughter against mother;
and mother-in-law against daughter-in-law
and daughter-in-law against mother-in-law.’ [fn5] ”
54 Then Jesus turned to the crowd and said, “When you see clouds beginning to form in the west, you say, ‘Here comes a shower.’ And you are right. 55 When the south wind blows, you say, ‘Today will be a scorcher.’ And it is. 56 You fools! You know how to interpret the weather signs of the earth and sky, but you don’t know how to interpret the present times.
57 “Why can’t you decide for yourselves what is right? 58 When you are on the way to court with your accuser, try to settle the matter before you get there. Otherwise, your accuser may drag you before the judge, who will hand you over to an officer, who will throw you into prison. 59 And if that happens, you won’t be free again until you have paid the very last penny. [fn6] ”

Footnotes:
12:5 Greek Gehenna.
12:6 Greek two assaria [Roman coins equal to 1/16 of a denarius].
12:8 “Son of Man” is a title Jesus used for himself.
12:38 Greek in the second or third watch.
12:53 Mic 7:6.
12:59 Greek last lepton [the smallest Jewish coin].
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tools/printerFriendly.cfm?b=Luk&c=12&t=NLTP&x=9&y=8

Wow there's a lot in that one Mujus.

I'm not sure where to go with it. There is the part about Jesus dividing people, and coming on the heels of his admonition against hypocrisy that makes sense. He's creating a new paradigm, and some will accept the shift while others will not. Unless we think that Jesus really came to set fire to the world physically, or that he was telling his followers to burn this place to the ground (which I find suspect, as we've gone into). However if we do take this as a metaphor along the lines of "The boss really lit a fire under Bob, he hasn't been late all month", we'd think it a bit silly for someone to ask "Did the boss really burn him? Is he in the hospital?". It's pretty obvious at that time that jesus was about to light a fire under the world, and that the fire is still burning. It burns in this thread, the Holy Spirit himself was seen as "tongues of fire" (Acts2:1-6).

"2 When the day of Pentecost came, they were all together in one place. 2 Suddenly a sound like the blowing of a violent wind came from heaven and filled the whole house where they were sitting. 3 They saw what seemed to be tongues of fire that separated and came to rest on each of them. 4 All of them were filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues[a] as the Spirit enabled them."

It's obvious that we're talking about being on fire with enthusiasm for the Holy Spirit. The apostles did go out to the world and preach as if they were on fire. The word did spread like a fire. It did eventually transform pagan Rome.

Hey we're in the 700 Club, Lol. Never really watched the show myself.

Today's Bible Reading is Luke Chapter 12
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Luk&c=13&v=1&t=NLT
Full Text:
A Call to Repentance
1 About this time Jesus was informed that Pilate had murdered some people from Galilee as they were offering sacrifices at the Temple. 2 “Do you think those Galileans were worse sinners than all the other people from Galilee?” Jesus asked. “Is that why they suffered? 3 Not at all! And you will perish, too, unless you repent of your sins and turn to God. 4 And what about the eighteen people who died when the tower in Siloam fell on them? Were they the worst sinners in Jerusalem? 5 No, and I tell you again that unless you repent, you will perish, too.”
Parable of the Barren Fig Tree
6 Then Jesus told this story: “A man planted a fig tree in his garden and came again and again to see if there was any fruit on it, but he was always disappointed. 7 Finally, he said to his gardener, ‘I’ve waited three years, and there hasn’t been a single fig! Cut it down. It’s just taking up space in the garden.’
8 “The gardener answered, ‘Sir, give it one more chance. Leave it another year, and I’ll give it special attention and plenty of fertilizer. 9 If we get figs next year, fine. If not, then you can cut it down.’”
Jesus Heals on the Sabbath
10 One Sabbath day as Jesus was teaching in a synagogue, 11 he saw a woman who had been crippled by an evil spirit. She had been bent double for eighteen years and was unable to stand up straight. 12 When Jesus saw her, he called her over and said, “Dear woman, you are healed of your sickness!” 13 Then he touched her, and instantly she could stand straight. How she praised God!
14 But the leader in charge of the synagogue was indignant that Jesus had healed her on the Sabbath day. “There are six days of the week for working,” he said to the crowd. “Come on those days to be healed, not on the Sabbath.”
15 But the Lord replied, “You hypocrites! Each of you works on the Sabbath day! Don’t you untie your ox or your donkey from its stall on the Sabbath and lead it out for water? 16 This dear woman, a daughter of Abraham, has been held in bondage by Satan for eighteen years. Isn’t it right that she be released, even on the Sabbath?”
17 This shamed his enemies, but all the people rejoiced at the wonderful things he did.
Parable of the Mustard Seed
18 Then Jesus said, “What is the Kingdom of God like? How can I illustrate it? 19 It is like a tiny mustard seed that a man planted in a garden; it grows and becomes a tree, and the birds make nests in its branches.”
Parable of the Yeast
20 He also asked, “What else is the Kingdom of God like? 21 It is like the yeast a woman used in making bread. Even though she put only a little yeast in three measures of flour, it permeated every part of the dough.”
The Narrow Door
22 Jesus went through the towns and villages, teaching as he went, always pressing on toward Jerusalem. 23 Someone asked him, “Lord, will only a few be saved?”
He replied, 24 “Work hard to enter the narrow door to God’s Kingdom, for many will try to enter but will fail. 25 When the master of the house has locked the door, it will be too late. You will stand outside knocking and pleading, ‘Lord, open the door for us!’ But he will reply, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from.’ 26 Then you will say, ‘But we ate and drank with you, and you taught in our streets.’ 27 And he will reply, ‘I tell you, I don’t know you or where you come from. Get away from me, all you who do evil.’
28 “There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, for you will see Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and all the prophets in the Kingdom of God, but you will be thrown out. 29 And people will come from all over the world—from east and west, north and south—to take their places in the Kingdom of God. 30 And note this: Some who seem least important now will be the greatest then, and some who are the greatest now will be least important then. [fn1] ”
Jesus Grieves over Jerusalem
31 At that time some Pharisees said to him, “Get away from here if you want to live! Herod Antipas wants to kill you!”
32 Jesus replied, “Go tell that fox that I will keep on casting out demons and healing people today and tomorrow; and the third day I will accomplish my purpose. 33 Yes, today, tomorrow, and the next day I must proceed on my way. For it wouldn’t do for a prophet of God to be killed except in Jerusalem!
34 “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones God’s messengers! How often I have wanted to gather your children together as a hen protects her chicks beneath her wings, but you wouldn’t let me. 35 And now, look, your house is abandoned. And you will never see me again until you say, ‘Blessings on the one who comes in the name of the LORD!’ [fn2] ”


Footnotes:
13:30 Greek Some are last who will be first, and some are first who will be last.
13:35 Ps 118:26.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tools/printerFriendly.cfm?b=Luk&c=13&t=NLTP&x=6&y=9

This is one of my favorite verses: 30 And note this: Some who seem least important now will be the greatest then, and some who are the greatest now will be least important then.

Yeah we did an entire youth retreat weekend along the lines of servant leadership. It was quite a great weekend. I loved Camp Mikell growing up, beautiful place.

Looks like a nice place--I saw the Youtube video!

It is, I wonder if they still have the carvings in the old dining hall.

Luke Chapter 14 tells of Jesus once again healing on the sabbath. Jesus compares God's kingdom to a feast that many are invited to but choose not to attend, and advises those who would follow him to count the cost.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Luk&c=14&v=1&t=NLT

Today's Bible reading is Luke Chapter 15, with the stories of "The Lost Sheep," The Lost Coin," and "The Prodigal Son."
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Luk&c=15&v=1&t=NLT#1
My favorite section is the first part:
Parable of the Lost Sheep
1 Tax collectors and other notorious sinners often came to listen to Jesus teach. 2 This made the Pharisees and teachers of religious law complain that he was associating with such sinful people—even eating with them!
3 So Jesus told them this story: 4 “If a man has a hundred sheep and one of them gets lost, what will he do? Won’t he leave the ninety-nine others in the wilderness and go to search for the one that is lost until he finds it? 5 And when he has found it, he will joyfully carry it home on his shoulders. 6 When he arrives, he will call together his friends and neighbors, saying, ‘Rejoice with me because I have found my lost sheep.’ 7 In the same way, there is more joy in heaven over one lost sinner who repents and returns to God than over ninety-nine others who are righteous and haven’t strayed away!"

bump

Whats the difference between Jesus and a painting of Jesus?

I'm waiting for the punchline.

It only takes one nail to hang the painting.

That reminds me of a passage from Vonnegut:

A man built a time machine so he could go back and see Jesus. It worked, and he saw Jesus when Jesus was only twelve years old. Jesus was learning the carpentry trade from his father.

Two Roman soldiers came into the shop with a mechanical drawing on papyrus of a device they wanted built by sunrise the next morning. It was a cross to be used in the execution of a rabble-rouser.

Jesus and his father built it. They were glad to have the work. And the rabble-rouser was executed on it... So it goes.

Today's Bible reading is Luke Chapter 16, with Jesus teaching his disciples through stories. http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Luk&c=16&v=1&t=NLT#1
Two especially strong verses are as follows:
Luke 16:15 Then he said to them, "You like to appear righteous in public, but God knows your hearts. What this world honors is detestable in the sight of God."
Luke 16:31 "But Abraham said, 'If they won't listen to Moses and the prophets, they won't listen even if someone rises from the dead.'"

Paragraph form/red letter edition of Luke 16:
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tools/printerFriendly.cfm?b=Luk&c=16&t=NLTP&x=7&y=6

Santa, I don't see how that is remotely funny. Or do you just mean to be offensive?

Its ironic Mujus because Modern day Christians don't listen to moses either!
________________________________

Todays Jesus joke comes from some funny (probably Jewish) dude.

Jesus and Moses are laying on a beach watching some hot girls splashing around in the water. While the lifeguard is on break the two notice one of the girls has a cramp and is in immediate need of assistance. Moses looks at Jesus and goes "I got this one Jesus." So Moses picks up his staff and parts the waters. He walks out on dry land and picks up the girl and brings her ashore to loud applause.

Now when Moses puts the girl down the water crashes back together, and in the rush of the tide one of the other girls bumps her head. Moses is ready to go out again but Jesus puts his hand on Moses shoulder and cockily says "I got this one Mo." Jesus gingerly takes a step and finds his balance on the surface of the water and makes his way out to the distressed girl. But as Jesus gets to deeper water his slowly starts to sink into the blue, soon he becomes fully submerged and starts splashing around and calling for help. As he is about to pass out, the waters part and Moses rushes out to save the girl and Jesus. He carries them both ashore as Jesus hacks and coughs up water.

When Jesus finally collects himself he looks sheepishly at Moses and says "Listen Mo, I have no idea what happened, I have never sank like that before!"

"Relax Josh" says Moses, "last time you didn't have those holes in your feet."

(This religion, Timurism, will replace the previous tedious, pedantic religious threads, so let's continue the conversation in this one instead of the previous ones.)

I guess you answered my questions. You just intend to be offensive.

question, not questions.