I also want to point out one more thing.

What china makes for us is not something we can not bring back if it became economically 'viable' At this point, it is not, but as the unemployment numbers continue to hover so high, Americans will accept lower wages, and the chance to return back becomes higher.

Also, as the US congress continues to toy with the idea of tariffs on China if they do not stop undervaluing their currency, which is a large help to their ability to export so 'cheaply'.

Where did you get your 20% of all chinese exports are to the US number also? Wal mart alone is Wal marts 7th largest export partner...lol

So I jsut took a peak at the list of '15 largest export natinos for China" to see. where US stands. They are probably higher than your 20 (i cant seem to find an exact % anywhere) but no greater than 30% it appears. However, if you take Hong Kong out (which is on that list, and is almost equal to the US, yes part of China?) us sky rockets to well over 40%.

That was actually just this year (starting from January ending in July). US imported approximately 220 billion dollars worth. US imports from China totaled at just over 210 billion dollars. I suppose that's slighly over 95%.

You're kidding when you say that Americans will take lower pay right? The minimum wage has done nothing but go up for the past several years. First, US doesn't have the infrastructure or the manpower to even come close to what China produces. Secondly, again, manpower is significantly cheaper in China. Americans can't even come close to matching them.
The 20% came from a mistaken calculation. In 2010, US imported 365 billion. China exported a total of 1.2 trillion euros. That roughly converts to about 1.6 trillion dollars. That's actually about 22%. I thought it was a bit lower, but there's the actual numbers for you.

Situation again what are you talking about?
Boats to the S. Coast?
Thanks for the laugh about the US economy on its way down to the bottom.
No economy in the world has the entrepreneurial activity that the US does.
Please name me an invention you use every day invented by a non-US entrepreneur.
Not some government program that overspent billions upon billions of taxpayer money to do what an entrepreneur could do in their garage either.

The United States exports
I can tell you are not associated with the business world at all Situation reading the stupid statements you post.

You have no grasp whatsoever of how import that Chinese market is to US exports.
China was the seventh largest U.S. export market last year, ranking after South Korea and ahead of France, and is the six largest destination for our exports this year through August. Exports to China have risen over 55 percent since 2000, to $27 billion
in 2003 (through August at an annual rate). Among the products that the United States exports to China are: $1 billion in oilseeds and grain (roughly 14 percent of all U.S. exports in this category), $1.3 billion in semiconductors and other electronic components, and $1.5 billion in transportation products (with statistics for this year through June).

The truth of the matter is that American trade in the Pacific is growing and its Atlantic trade is falling.
Economically the Pacific is the growing region and the Atlantic is the declining region.
Where the US economy goes there is growth where it leaves there is decline.
Europe's socialist models are crumbling because they can't compete with the US and haven't done so successfully in decades. It's too bad Europe forgot Germany's example for the 70's.

The South coast was an error I made from misinterpreted information.
You seriously think the US economy isn't on its way down to the bottom? Well, I'll give you this, you've got nerve contradicting even the most obviously true statements.
"No economy in the world has the entrepreneurial activity that the US does.
Please name me an invention you use every day invented by a non-US entrepreneur.
Not some government program that overspent billions upon billions of taxpayer money to do what an entrepreneur could do in their garage either. " <<<< completely irrelevant to economic growth. Keyword: growth. Learn to understand the language?
"The United States exports
I can tell you are not associated with the business world at all Situation reading the stupid statements you post. " <<<<< Wow, that was a profound response. I'd bet that almost 50% of third graders might be surpassed by this. Not bad at all ^.^
Again, look at the numbers. US imported 210 billion from China and exported 27 billion? Rofl. Case and point, thank you for siding with me. To put this in perspective, China imported approximately 966 billion euros in 2010. That's equivalent to over 1.3 trillion dollars. And here you are trying to make 27 billion sound significant.
American trade in the Pacific is indeed growing. I won't deny that. But you don't seem to understand the significance of that statement. You're under the impression that growth occurs where US goes? Lawl, then I suppose the US just chooses at random where it wants the economy to grow. Funny. Try this: the US goes where economic growth is present. There is economic growth in Asia, and US wants in so it goes. This, again, is third grader reasoning. Europe is crumbling because a select few countries, namely Germany, is attempting to carry the rest of Europe including Greece, Spain, Italy, and so on. Again, completely irrelevant to the topic at hand as the US really isn't involved.

@ the rest of webDip
Don't get me wrong, I'm not anti-American. I just like arguing... and watching TC struggle with third grade logic/reasoning. ^.^

Situation, I understand your frustration and lack of confidence in your viewpoint.
If you would master the facts and reality and quick arguing fallacies you wouldn't feel this way.
Thank you for recognizing the utter idiocy of your repeated statements about the US Navy and "the border."
It a sign that you can be taught if you recognize your own mistakes.

Entrepreneurial activity is now "completely irrelevant to economic growth."
LOL!
Thank you for posting such lunacy Situation.
It saves anyone with common sense the time of taking you seriously at all.

The ad-hominem based points you're making are severely damaging to your credit, my friend. I know when I'm wrong. You don't. You've simply stopped using what little reasoning skills you had.
When you find facts, use them. When I have facts, and you have name-calling, even the simplests of simpletons can figure out who to listen to. (might I still point out that you haven't answered a majority of the points?)
Your second post shows a clear lack of logic. What about present standing shows growth? Try this example. A mathematical function is known to be a certain value given the independent variable (in this case, time). If only the value of the function is known, it is impossible to determine the rate of change. Actually, the value of the function is completely irrelevant to the rate of change.
Ah, you probably won't understand that so here it is in actual formulas. You are given that F(2010) = "y" where "y" is a value representing the value of the US economy, and F(x) is an unknown function. In this case, the growth of the economy would be represented by the slope. With this information, you simply cannot find the growth. In fact, what I'm saying is, knowing the value "y" isn't relevant to finding the slope. Understand?

Situation, you post about ad-hominem?
What a hypocrite.
Just read your own posts moron for ad hominem.

What facts? Please point them out.
You make a statement of opinion "the US goes where economic growth is present," and think it is a fact?
I'm searching all your posts for "facts."
I see tons of unsubstantiated opinion.
Now you want to reduce the economy to an equation.
Keynesian macroeconomic fools have been attempting this for decades.
We've had three Keynesians in the oval office, FDR-LBJ-Obama.
If want to use math on something then use it on the economic failure of those gentleman.
You seem to have no grasp of entrepreneurship at all.
I ask you to name a significant every day invention of a European entrepreneur and you are so frustrated you make the idiotic statement that entrepreneurial activity is now "completely irrelevant to economic growth."
Then you retreat to the functions and slopes of failed macroeconomic projections.
What do you know about the economy Situation that didn't come from a blog?
What do you know about the day-to-day operations of a business?
What do you know about job creation?
What do you know about the fiscal and monetary policies that led to economic growth in the past?

Here is a statement regarding entrepreneurial activity in the United States and in the economy that I agree with completely.

The argument put forth in this statement is exactly why I treat Situation and anyone else that does not realize the critical nature of entrepreneurship to economic growth as the imbeciles that they are.

For the United States to survive and continue its economic and political leadership in the world, we must see entrepreneurship as our central comparative advantage. Nothing else can give us the necessary leverage to remain an economic superpower. Nothing else will allow us to continue to enjoy our standard of living. We either support and nurture increasingly entrepreneurial activities in all aspects of our society and around the globe, or run the very real risk that we will become progressively irrelevant on the world stage and suffer economically at home. In short, entrepreneurship in our businesses and universities; in our approach to both government and foreign policy; and in our personal lives is the only answer if we hope to continue to thrive.

Technology isn't the answer, since everyone now either has the same technology or can easily obtain it. By definition, when everyone has access to the same asset, the asset itself can't supply an edge. Only innovative, entrepreneurial ways of employing that technology can provide a comparative advantage.

Education will not keep us out in front. Many parts of the world surpass the United States in teaching skills needed for the future. While we must pay more attention to education, especially in math and the sciences, simply drawing even with countries now leading, such as Japan and South Korea, will not be enough—we won't be ahead. We must learn new entrepreneurial ways to employ what we learn.

It is imperative that we do so: For example, we have largely given up when it comes to basic manufacturing because we simply can't compete globally on price. Instead of running these factories, we need to exploit the advanced skills, niche opportunities, and geographic advantages that will allow American manufacturers to succeed. In a word, when it comes to manufacturing, we must become entrepreneurial.

Could our financial skills keep us ahead? It is true we possess a substantial edge in finaance. We have huge sums of money to invest, and our capital markets are, indeed, the envy of the world, attracting money to our shores thanks to their efficiency and safety. But the fact is that all capital markets are now global and other parts of the world are beginning to enjoy or adopt our safeguards, so whatever sustainable advantage we have is bound to be fleeting. The only way to gain an edge is to back entrepreneurs and share in their success.

The only uniquely American resource at our disposal is entrepreneurial capitalism, and it is imperative that we nurture it. We must make sure that developing entrepreneurial systems reward risk takers who set out to be creative and innovative, who produce a product or service that allows us to do something better, faster, cheaper.

It is the resulting efficiency of their efforts that permits wealth to be redeployed in ways that produce more wealth.

Again, try to read my point before responding. I'm saying your points are based on criticizing me. While I am guilty of ad hominem, my points aren't based on that.
My facts are the numbers stated a few posts above.
"You make a statement of opinion "the US goes where economic growth is present," and think it is a fact? "<<<<< I never claimed all my statements are facts. I merely claimed that I have facts in my posts. Again, read carefully. For the record, that's a correlation, not a fact.
"Now you want to reduce the economy to an equation"<<< No, I'm using the equation to demonstrate an example. Again and again, read carefully. You seem not to be able to understand. Current entrepreneurial activity is just that, a current standing. To be able to understand growth, you need the change in standing. Change is only able to be measured when there data points taken at different points in time. Let me dumb it down for you. The US has a GDP of approximately 14 trillion dollars. From that, can you tell me the growth or decay of US GDP? Does the 14 trillion dollars even help you find the growth? No. Apply the same reasoning, and you realize that knowing current entrepreneurial activity really is irrelevant to knowing the growth.
Speaking of GDP growth, go find the growth rates, and perhaps you'll finally realize how wrong you are. For the record, US GDP growth is ranked over 100. (Meaning there are over 100 countries with higher GDP growth).
"Then you retreat to the functions and slopes of failed macroeconomic projections. "<<< Tell me, where is my "failed macroeconomic projections"?? If you even have the slightest grasp of mathematics, you'll realize that projections can always be represented by equations. The difficulty is finding that equation, which conveniently, I'm not trying to do.
I'm not even going to dignify the rest of your post with a response.

Rofl, do you even know what your posted statement says? Read through it carefully, and try to realize what is says. I wish I would have found that statement first, because it actually supports my point that US economic standing is falling.

Situation, Try to make a point that has meaning instead of meandering aimlessly down a path of argumentation that leads aboslutely no where.

Keep trying.

Rofl. Great response. Employing fallacies without support. Let me clarify for you. My main point is that the US economic ranking is falling. Realize this, and respond accordingly.

Let's destroy some of your basic misconceptions Sitty.
You keep posting numbers and percentages regarding China, importing, exporting, etc as if they explain themselves, and more importantly as if you understand their meaning.

You have a number of basic misconceptions regarding imports/exports between China and the US.

Number one, China and the US do not trade with one another.
Chinese companies and US companies trade with one another.
Individual Chinese and individual Americans trade with one another.
This might seem trivial, but it certainly isn't.
The reason it isn't trivial is because the $1.5 trillion dollars in trade represents tens of thousands of decisions by individuals and companies to voluntarily trade.

This leads to a definition of "deficits."
Now someone like Sitty thinks that a deficit is a bad thing.
Wal-Mart has a nearly 100% trade deficit with Chinese companies.
Does Wal-Mart export anything to Chinense companies.
So according to Sitty's lack of understand Wal-Mart is going to go bankrupt and fail because it doesn't export as much to Chinense companies as it imports.
Sitty of course doesn't understand commerce at all.
Wal-Mart sells everything it imports from Chinese companies at a higher price than it paid and makes a huge profit.

This is how trade works Sitty, so keep post about your macroeconomic functions and slopes and keep yourself ignorant of how the world really works.

Not bad. Let me clarify, the trade deficit that I'm mentioning represents total import vs export. Trade deficit with a single source is difficult to interpret. But when a country (Such as, conveniently, the US) exports a significant amount less than it imports, this is clearly detrimental. In very simplistic terms, the US is using more than it's earning. So, yes, if Walmart's trade deficit (I guess I should specify total since TC seems unable to grasp this) is nearly 100%, it will go bankrupt. But obviously this isn't the case. The selling of its products to citizens clearly surpasses its trade deficits. Hence Walmart isn't about to go bankrupt.
You still have yet to address the issue of GDP growth. Last year, Germany was at 3.5, Russia was at 4.0, and Japan was at 3.9. For perspective, US was sitting on a substantial... 2.9%. Shall we compare this to China's 10.3? Or Taiwan's 10.8? Or Hong Kong's 6.8? Or Singapore's at 14.4? I suppose 1 year is difficult to interpret. Let's try GDP growth since 1990. US was sitting on a solid 60%. Not bad. Hong Kong had just over 90% growth. Korea had about 135% growth. Singapore broke 150%. China is almost at 330%.

I'll give you this, your last post was probably your best post. Yet, sadly, still lacking in substance.

Trade deficit led to mass acquisitions of reserves by Asian economies led to investment in debt instruments which led to overly cheap credit/housing bubble which led to a financial crisis once liquidity dried up.

Sitty, you are talking about a macroeconomic illusion.
Looking at individual cases is easy to interpret.
Creating a macroeconomic illusion of "total export/import" is what is difficult to understand.

You also don't understand productivity.
According to your mind if I import more than I export this is bad.
So I am sitting here on my butt with $2,000.
I import a computer from China for $2,000.
I think use that computer to day trade on the NYSE and make $2,000 a day.
According to you I'm a loser because I imported but didn't export.
People who don't understand business, like you, always forget that the majority of what is being imported has continuing value, not one time use like a gallon of gas.
Even it is is a gallon of gas with one time use importing the gas makes sense if that gallon drives me to a location where I can make much more than I spent on the gas.

This is what separates business people from individuals who do not understand business.
Business is not a theoretically world. It is reality.
You can try to understand all the theory you want, but it is useless if you don't understand the reality of business.

Import and export statistics are useless.
Profit and loss on an individual firms balance sheet is the only crucial data in the whole wide world.
If a country doesn't have enough profitable companies it will decay.
Kind of like Europe.

Your statement about Walmart doesn't make any sense. I guess now you are calling cash register sales "exports to customers" since your pea brain is stuck in some textbook you read in Macro 1 last week.
Wal-Mart runs a 100% trade deficit with all of its suppliers no matter where they are in the world you idiot.
Wal-Mart doesn't sell back to its suppliers. How stupid are you?
As far as GDP growth, I'm not worried about Germany at all because an economy is not defined by its GDP growth.
And economy, and hopefully you covered this in your classes this semester, had a production frontier.
The production frontier of the United States is greater than every single economy you mentioned except maybe China and Russia, and I could argue it is greater than China's.
The US has more land available for population and economic growth than Germany, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Singapore, etc. etc. etc.

When you factor in all of the "variables" no economy on earth has the advantages of the United States.

The main advantage we have is exactly what you ignored completely, the entrepreneurship in the American economy.
Of course undergraduate theorist don't understand entrepreneurship at all, or they wouldn't be in college they would be out making money, like me for example.

My substance is in my bank account Situation, and no doubt in my mind that my business knowledge has quite a bit more substance to it than yours based on the elementary theory you rely on.

You really don't get it do you. No wonder so many people have you muted. Pretty thick and unable to grasp simple concepts.

"Profit and loss on an individual firms balance sheet is the only crucial data in the whole wide world"
Yeah ok. Take Walmart for example again. It pays "x" amount to China for goods. Then US citizens pay Walmart for those goods. In turn, Walmart uses that money to buy more goods... from China. The company is making money. But the benefits aren't for the US.

I'll assume that even with your inferior intelligence, you know what GDP is. If you don't, google it. That being said, GDP is a fairly accurate representative of standard of living. When your GDP rank drops, suddenly not everyone wants to come to the US anymore. Why is this significant? Because the brightest minds aren't American. Innovative? maybe. Brightest, no. What is the US without the bright minds? Nothing. Like your little statement said, entrepreneurship is your only chance. As GDP of other countries grows, so does their production frontier. Meanwhile, the US stays next to constant.

As of now, yes the US economy is fairly large. That's not the point. The point is, the economic advantages are slipping from your grasp. US has a lot of land, but land isn't the resource in question when entrepreneurship is what you're looking for. It is a resource, but it's far from the limiting factor. What you need is a high GDP, which you have now, but not for long (relatively speaking). China's not the only place projected to surpass the US.

A completely separate point addressing entrepreneurship is the rich-poor gap. When a country relies on entrepreneurship, that gap grows. The rich become richer, but the poor become poorer. Even you should possess enough intelligence to realize the downfalls of this.

Sitty, as far as who gets and who doesn't I'm sure I do because I'm an old man whose raised a family, owns a business, and is set for retirement.
The world view I operate on is tried and true.
Not theoretical mumbo jumbo from another teenage graduate who doesn't know his ass from a hole in the ground about how economics works in both theory and practice.
So you keep rattling on about your model of how world trade works.
I need a good laugh.

I especially got a chuckle out of this line in your post "...the US economy is fairly large."
LOL!
The US economy is larger than the next four largest combined, and never in the history of the world has an economy been that dominant on a global scale.

Reading "failry large" was great. Thanks for the humor.

Here is something for you to think about Sitty.

Wal-Mart existed and grew at a phenomenal rate long before China began its current growth.
Wal-Mart-Target-K-mart can all exist without China.
Can China exist without its economic dependence on the sales of its goods through Wal-Mart-Target-K-Mart.
Don't go into business Sitty. You don't have the mind for it.

Long before? What? Chinese growth began in the 1980s, same time when Wal Mart started becoming a significant player.

Evidently in TC's alternative universe foreign exchange reserves play no role in the economy. It doesn't matter that China has large reserves due to heavy imports by Wal Mart from Chinese suppliers.

Sit, I pulled my numbers from the a US government site. Where did you pull yours? No way, 95% of all our imports come from China. We dont get a single drop of oil from them, and I am scared to ask what % of our imports THAT is.

We are one of Germany and Japanes largest customers also, and they large exporters also.

There is no way we are importing 96%. Find a site, and show it to me,/

Speaking of Germany and Japan.
I just read an article comparing the rail systems of Germany and Japan.
The press lauds the passenger rail of both countries as being vastly superior to that of the United States.
This article dealt with another kind of rail that the United States is vastly superior to Germany and Japan in, Freight Rail.
Where Germany and Japan haul people America hauls freight.
You'd never know it though, unless of course you read something besides the main stream media, like a business publication you'd have to spend money on.
Why spend the money though, the MSM tells the whole, accurate story for free minus commercials.

Bait and.... SWITCH!!

I'm talking with the craftsman who builds our office furniture in his shop yesterday. While we are talking about a piece he tells me a story a man told him years ago.

Never work about your prices. Build quality that sells. The only thing you need to worry about is your spending.

This is the way the world really works. If you keep a handle on your spending no matter what you are making you will do well.

Too bad progressives, statists, socialists, positive rights fools, and marxists never learned this simple lesson.
I guess only people with common sense posses this knowledge.

"no matter what you are making you will do well"

Really?? This as a guide to business, I can make a heap of shit, but as long as it didn't cost me anything its well worth it?!?

(Yes, I know sucked in again, I'm sorry TC, what was it I said about bread again??)

Goods and services from China accounted for only 2.7% of U.S. personal consumption expenditures in 2010, of which less than half reflected the actual costs of Chinese imports. The rest went to U.S. businesses and workers transporting, selling, and marketing goods carrying the "Made in China" label. Although the fraction is higher when the imported content of goods made in the United States is considered, Chinese imports still make up only a small share of total U.S. consumer spending.

And yet again - source?