if it comes down to yoyo and anyone besides balki, yes i will most likely vote yoyo.

I'm on a break and just reading up on the last few pages -- as I said in my reads, I also think there's good reason to suspect Yoyo is not working productively for town in this game; I think damian/DO must have at least one experienced player pulling strings and giving advice in the background, Yoyo and uclabb make the most sense to me for that right now; so I'd consider a yoyo vote as well.

I think the vote split at the moment is very interesting -- I imagine scum are splitting their votes one-by-one at the moment, because they can talk their Day voting pattern through, so will not want to appear to pushy on any one candidate (as they may have appeared to do with the early eagerness to lynch me; this may also be why Yoyo is unable to really get the traction he wants on guak).

can anyone read balki's big post on page 15 and honestly tell me they think his reads look legitimate? am i crazy/tunneling in thinking that i don't see a single hard piece of evidence besides quotes analyzed out of context, lacking all attempts to analyze connections between his reads and other players? balki admits it himself that he's a trial lawyer, to me this looks like the fabricated words of a trial lawyer, not scum-hunting.

Wjessop, is there anything in particular about my town-read on Damian that you disagree with?

@Ghug - having reconsidered you point about vig shooting D1, I concede it has some merit.

I hope people will read my post and come to their own conclusions. I hope that people will not rely on the Cliff's Notes versions that have already been offered by Y2K and Guak.

@BB - I have read your reads and your conclusion upon which you base your Y2K vote. You seem to be suggesting that as Y2K isn't adaptable and that he is tunnelling is indicative of a Mafia Y2K. I disagree - town Y2K is myopic in the extreme. IIRC in MX he would be 100% certain about someone being scum only to see them flip town and then be equally certain that the next townie was scum. I would suggest what you are witnessing about Y2K isn't alignment indicative.

I'd appreciate your thoughts on Yoyo.

Interesting game for me due to circumstances. I'm usually not much of a lurker, but it's been somewhat enlightening. To explain, I am at the AUGS conference in Seattle (google if interested in confirming my claim).

I am getting into the guak/meme camp about D1. I think this is my 5th or 6th game and it always goes down the same way. Someone makes a statement or 2 that gets them in hot water, they get lynched, they usually flip town, then on D2 the real sleuthing starts.

Despite how much I abhor PR talk (BB and DL9, I'm looking at you), I really like ghug's notion of the vig day shot taking out the lead vote-getter late in the day. Can't wait to watch the mafia scramble after that happens.

I will post the notes that I took on my read up though here next. In short, my strongest scum candidates are BB & y2k, followed by SS and Yoyo. The only town-leans I have are ghug, wjessop and DO.

OB MXIII D1 Notes
1. y2kjbk - a bit bull-doggish on DO early on. also makes a lot of reads based on some really thin information (e.g.uclabb). something feels off with this guy. His fight with Balki seems choreographed. Getting a strong scum smell off this one.
2. ghug - feels like town guhg to me. interesting idea of vig killing leading vote getter with 60 min left. Didn’t vote for uclabb immediately - scum buddies fer sher. Rethinking, I fucking love the vig day shot idea. It’s better if fewer people are online when it happens, because scum will intensify their activity to try to get town lynched. Scum will almost certainly put forth the greatest effort to be online at EOD. They have more to lose if they are not.
3. Hellenic Riot - I don’t like protecting new players just b/c they’re new like HR does for toemato. I’ve never been able to get a read on HR (mostly cuz he dies so damn fast)
4. Yoyoyozo - policy lynching lurkers is a great idea if you are scum and know lurker alignment.
5. ND - I am SO glad he decided to make less verbose posts this game O_o
6. Saladinsmith - Bad play is not alignment indicative and bad play sometimes can improve over time. wj may be playing poorly, but that doesn’t make him scum. Getting a player lynched for “bad play” when you’re mafia and know that player is town is “good play”.
7. OB_Gyn_Kenobi - where the F has this guy been?
8. DeathLlama9 - I’m confused as to why that TrPrado incident didn’t result in more fecal hurling than it did. Then again, I can’t figure out if it was such a colossal boner that it’s indicative of town or scum.
9. Balki Bartokomous - VT should fake claim? BAH! lynch all liars! Fucking scum trying to get our players to fake claim so they can out the real PR for the mafia to NK. Die scum!! See reference to y2k fight above. Buddies up to wjessop, which I think is a good buddy target if you’re mafia given how opinionated and vocal s/he is.
10. bo_sox48 - sigh, really bo, policy lynch discussion? IT. NEVER. HAPPENS.
11. captainmeme - I think town right now. lurkish,of course, but helpful when intermittently not lurking.
12. wjessop - maybe he’s just that obnoxious. As scum he was always turning accusations around on his accusers and then asking for explanations from them. Here he’s only defending himself.
13. Maniac - entertaining to the end. Was the sdrawkcab post meant to get someone to out themselves as a power role? Seems an incautious mafia play. Also seems ineffectual play as there are myriad reasons why someone would or wouldn’t post in a certain time frame after his.
14. Espi - not sure why he got attention as potential scum. nothing stands out to me either way.
15. Damian - if he’s scum, he deserves to win. But then again, ah hell, I don’t know. Now he’s tunnelling hard on WJ. Tunnelling =/= wrong, just narrow minded, or scum.
16. guak -
17. Toemato no one likes a noob lynch more than me, but this guy’s posts seem genuine. an OMGUS vote on ghug would be an odd move for someone 1. who read prior game(s) and 2. is trying to hide being mafia.
18. DemonOverlord - townslip “bus” - mafia would never make that mistake. But then she uses a WIFOM argument to justify it’s use.
19. uclabb -

##VOTE Balki

Dammit, I meant to type ##VOTE y2k, I just had balki on my mind because I hate PR talk soooooo much.

...and because I think Balki is also scum

"1. y2kjbk - a bit bull-doggish on DO early on. also makes a lot of reads based on some really thin information (e.g.uclabb). something feels off with this guy. His fight with Balki seems choreographed. Getting a strong scum smell off this one. "

that's all you got? what about my argument with balki seems "choreographed"?

@OB: "maybe he’s just that obnoxious."

Can you explain that, please? It seems irrelevant to your read. It's just a character assault that seems unrelated to the game and, as it's contrary to how we interact outside of this game, makes me think you're trying to malign me to set me up as a lynch target.

I haven't only "defended myself" in this game, I've just been extremely busy, so my involvement so far has been 1) joke posts enjoying the start of the game (a game is supposed to be fun, after all), 2) responses to damian, and then DO, who have criticised and scumread me for my joke posts in the first hour of the game as unhelpful to town (which you yourself call 'tunneling hard'), 3) a full and clear reads lists with questions for players.

Your read of me is judgemental and unkind.

Yeah, I agree with y2, who I cross-posted with.

Something is very odd about OB's reads list above.

OB's reads are *extremely personal* in a way that OB just isn't normally. He's trying to malign people's characters, referring to y2k in animalistic language and that he smells is a very strange and unhelpful way of assessing players.

man i have huge problems with this list OB. i have to read incredibly carefully just to figure out who you think is scum and who you think is town. doesn't even look like you commit to any read at all on many people.

@Maniac ... learn to read. Damian is bussing Balki.

My name appears all across OB's reads list. OB makes a point of saying that I'm "playing poorly", when I've actually contributed a fair bit and one of only a few to post a substantial reads list -- this makes me think I'm on the right lines and he's trying to subtly rubbish my views; look how many times my name appears negatively across his reads list.

so last game in M12, DL came out with an accusation against me saying i was bussing TrPrado. I challenged him about not voting TrPrado then if the primary argument against me is how i'm bussing TrPrado. DL basically ignored me and kept his vote on me. I see OB doing something very similar to me that DL did that game.

I don't say you're playing poorly wj, I say that SS is saying you're playing poorly. I read you as town. Look at the bottom of my first post above. I say maybe you are just that obnoxious, in that since I think you're town right now, you're obnoxiousness is not a tool you only employ when you are scum. Hence, maybe you're just that obnoxious.

I agree with that read, y2.

@OB: Yeah, and I think you're being unkind.

at the least.

You're mincing your words anyway -- you said "wj may be playing poorly". This is spin.

I'd be surprised you're not scum after that dire reads list. It's like a piece of trash literature.

@y2k - You're right, I don't commit to any particular read on a lot of people. That's what an open mind looks like. Also, it wasn't a reads list, it was my notes. I called it my notes, not a reads list.

They're reads whether you call them notes, reads, or candypops.

OB, an open mind, or flexibility with who you can justifiably vote for?

and please spell out the details of this choreography between me and balki