If someone's flying an airplane at the building you're in, and that building is a public school, there's really no point in trying to flee. You have more or less the same chances no matter what you do, so bank on not being a target.

given the low level of competence exhibited by mr. bush and crew, the idea that he was aware that it was coming is pretty far fetched. don't get me wrong, he was a terrible president, probably the worst ever, and he used illegal tactics to steal both elections and he should be tried and convicted as a war criminal for authorizing waterboarding. but he didn't know about 9 11

You are drawing a conclusion through *way* too many assumptions.

First, three days is not enough time to alter plans like the terrorists had put in place. So there was little risk of him being a target at the school as the terrorists wouldn't have know he would be there when they put their plans in place months earlier.

Second, the target of the plane that was taken down by the passengers (Flight 93) was believed to be the White House, where the terrorists most likely thought he would be at the time they were planning the attacks.

Third, and most importantly, even if he wasn't the target, a high profile target doesn't cause as much terror as the massive destruction of a heavily populated target, hence going after the WTC.

No, I believe that A) they didn't know it was a terror attack at the time and B) he was right in not scaring the children by departing so quickly. I accept his reasoning as valid and *not* an excuse considering there was nothing he personally could have done at the time.

And how exactly did Bush steal the election from Kerry? Seriously. I want to hear this consipracy theory. I've only ever heard one that claimed the long poll lines in Ohio (which clearly affected *both* sides as *both* sides had to wait in line to vote) somehow helped Republicans who could "take an entire day off work to vote and not get fired". In other words, white collar=Republican and blue collar=Democrat. Stupid fucking assumption on those consiracy nutjobs. But I digress. How do *you* think he stole the election from Kerry?

stay on topic please...

Point taken. omgwhathappened, if you want to start a thread about the other topic, I will happily contribute. But Darwyn is right about staying on topic here. Too early to sidetrack this one yet.

Draug - let me rephrase it a bit...

It's the Secret Services job to protect the President.
No one could have known the President was NOT a target
The Secret Service did nothing to protect the President (they allowed him to stay)

Therefore, they knew the President was not a target. And the only way to know that is to know the targets.

It is the simplest of logic.

Wow....you are truly of fucking moron. An ALTERNATE interpretation is that the Bush Administration had NO IDEA AT ALL that terrorosts were flying above his head, because the Clinton Administration had made sure that various intelligence agencies did NOT share information....thus they could not connect the dots.

You sort of hate-filled, asinine conspiracy theory is the likely result of 1. Being too young (a college student, I'll bet...) and 2. Drugs??

Interesting side note: I watched a ***PBS*** documentary recently that interviewed the kids that were in the classroom Bush was in that day. In retrospect, they were very thankful that Bush remained calm....and yet they were also very scared, because when Bush's aides whispered into his ear what had happened (the attack...) he got very stern and looked angry, and they were afraid that *they* had done something wrong. Bush had a visceral, human reaction of anger to the news that we had been attacked. it was not faked. the children --- who can be *very* perceptive if you have ever had kids/been around kids (which most of you have not, I suspect...) -- tell us the truth.

The idea that Bush was behind the attacks is the *most* idiotic sort of left-wing hate.

It's too bad that Draugnar is such an asshole that he has muted me, becuase we probably agree more on this than we disagree. But then again, Draugnar's muting of me, his refusal to listen to alternate voices....is exactly the kind of ass-holery that makes people not believe his ideas...and in this case mine....becuse he is too much of a prickish asshole to entertain and respond to an alternate viewpoint.

Somebody tell Draug to grow the fuck up.

@darwyn....the idiots flying the planes didn't even know how to land them.....what the hell makes you think that they could alter their course on the fly and target a random building somewhere? You are siply being a total jackass right now.....a jackass that knows ****nothing**** about flying an airplane. You know....they don't just have a pop-up menu in a plane that asks where you want to fly, and then includes the selection : Grade School, zero altitude...." Your suggestion that these asshole terrorists could successfully navigate to wherever Bush was is simply the moronic ramblings of a hate-filled left-winger.

"An ALTERNATE interpretation"?

This is not an interpretation, it is fact and logic. Try taking a cold shower, think about it then get back to me when you have projected a sense of calm. Ok?

".what the hell makes you think that they could alter their course on the fly"

You aren't reading...see above: "Bush's presence at the school had been announced in the media three days before"

And how would they have possibly protected him from a plane flying in excess of 400 MPH? They didn't even know it was a terrorist attack until the second strike. So, by virute of him having made the decision to go to the schools and it being announced only the day before (not three, as you present above: fact check it), he was already in the safest place he could be: where the terrorists would never have planned for him to be.

Also, the Secret Service on the ground protects him from immediate "clear and present threats." There was no clear and present threat to his well being and with the timing involved, moving him could have posed an even greater risk if the terrorists had decided to target him at the school after he had announced where he would be. Attacks like those carried out require months of prior planning and the terrorists couldn't just change their planned flights at the last minute and hijack different flights closer to their potential target just because he was on the move.

Recheck your facts. It was just the day before, not three days. Whoever fed you that lied to you.

Draug - please read it again...

It's the Secret Services job to protect the President.
No one could have known the President was NOT a target
The Secret Service did nothing to protect the President (they allowed him to stay)

"There was no clear and present threat"

You are using the conclusion (inaction) as proof of the assertion (no danger).

@DARWYN....jackas...take a cold shower and then reread my post before dismissing it. Damn, dude....take a fucking chill pill.

The pilots of these planes didn't even know how to LAND them. They were novice, at best. So you are suggesting that some jackass could take a plane in the Washington D.C. area, or New York.....CHANGE COURSE TO FLORIDA....where the President was....Flay ALL THE WAY THERE without ever being shot down....and manage to find a small school building and crash their plane in to it?


It's one thing to bank a fucking plane and hit a giant building. It's a completely different matter to fly hundreds of miles away and manage to find and hit a small school building.

You are simply one fo the most retarded, hysterical left-wing-hate-mongers on this site...

So long as there were unknown number of hijacked airplanes wandering the sky, there was danger.

Yet he stays as if there was no danger.

Darwyn....take you hare somewhere else. You are embarrassing yourself.

krellin, you thinking way too hard here.

It's very, very simple.

Darwyn...he stayed in the school less than 10 minutes. He finished his story and left. You act like he stayed in the school all day long. How fucking retarded are you? More to the point....which demented left-wing blog do you read when you repeat this nonsense?

"You are embarrassing yourself. "

Thanks for you concern, krellin. That's my problem though, not yours.

Darwyn....no....you are the simplistic fool. Probably too many video games have corroded your brain. You actually seem to think that flying a plane wherever you want is just a matter of wishful thinking....lol You are a complete, ignorant jackass.

"he stayed in the school less than 10 minutes."

It was much longer than that. He even claimed to have watched the first plane hit the tower while in his limo...

Darwyn...no....people like you....so full of hate...are a concern for everyone in this nation. that you would try to turn this sort of event into some sort of conspiracy speak to great engths to how demented you and your like-minded fellows are. People wonder why politics are so divided....and here you are...the perfect example...a jackass that thinks a President would kill thousands of his own citizens for personal gain. A president that was just elected...who didn't have time to even plan such an event...

Your argument is just so full of nonsense and holes....it is so idiotic....it is siply hate. It is you showing how utterly and completely incapable you are of accepting different viewpoints that you think anyone that disagrees with you must be akin to a murderer.

I pity you.

Watched the first plane hit the tower in his limo? lol Wow....where are you getting this shit from. he was IN THE SCHOOL ALREADY when the first plane hit! There is video that proves this.

Grow up, bitch.

What should they have done? Put him on a plane of their own so that any hijacked planes in the area could hear the Air Force One call sign and lock onto it like a radar signal? Don't be dense. Running around like a chicken with your head cut off is the worst thing you can do in an emergency, and putting the President in the open, or worse, in the *air* when there are an unknown number of aircraft that could be potential missiles able to lock onto the call sign and might just be snipers targetting him at the school because of the lateness of announcement (one day prior is too late to be changing up terrorists plans - plans that take months to layout: something you refuse to see but the Secret Service would clearly have known and taken into consideration).

Out in the opne was the second *worst* place for him to be. In the air was the *worst*. Have you ever worked security in the armed forces? I did my time in the Marines and know it from *both* sides of the equation. the terrorists would have targetted the most likely place for him, the White House. their backup plan would be to have snipers around the region able to respond within 6 hours to any announcement that put him somewhere else.

Take it from someone who used to work Military Intelligence and Security in the Armed Forces (Marine Corps! Arrugh!). The Secret Service did exactly what they *should* have done. He was indoors away from potential snipers and his plans had been annpounced on such short notice that the school was actually the safest place for him at that time: safer than the White House, which is believed to have been the third target, and safer than Airforce One which would have had a radar target on it in the form of the over the air call sign.

"a jackass that thinks a President would kill thousands of his own citizens for personal gain"

Right, like that's never been done before. Learn some history.

"Your argument is just so full of nonsense and holes"

I've yet to see a hole.

"I pity you."

Thank you for your concern. Why don't you go write a short story or something...

DARWYN: LINK TO YOUR SOURCES. MAN UP AND TELL US WHERE YOU ARE GETTING YOUR INFORMATION FROM SO WE CAN JUDGE YOUR SOURCES.

OTHERWISE, SHUT THE FUCK UP....BECAUSE YOU LOOK LIKE A FOOL.

Not even Obama has ended the wars Bush started as a result of these supposedly fake attacks. Don't you think Obama would have ended ALL the wars if Bush lied? Or is Obama in on the deal, too? lol Dumbass...

"he was IN THE SCHOOL ALREADY'

Actually, you are correct...he claimed to have watched the first plane hit outside the classroom. My mistake.