Forum
A place to discuss topics/games with other webDiplomacy players.
Page 710 of 1419
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Dan Wang (1194 D)
15 Feb 11 UTC
Gunboat, anonymous, 60 points, 24 hour phases
2 replies
Open
Thucydides (864 D(B))
15 Feb 11 UTC
ATTN: Members of the webdip community.
Assistance needed with anthropological project studying webdip community. See inside.
83 replies
Open
Sargmacher (0 DX)
16 Feb 11 UTC
High Stakes Classic Game
We need 4 more people.
250 D 1 day, 12 hours phase: gameID=50534
0 replies
Open
Troodonte (3379 D)
16 Feb 11 UTC
New Gunboat?
I'm starting another WTA Gunboat, anonymous.
Big pot (or not).
Who's interested?
14 replies
Open
mruhlen (100 D)
16 Feb 11 UTC
Admin request: please cancel old game
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=25371#gamePanel

has been stranded for a very long time, and I'm the only one of the players who's still using the site. It'd be great if it could be canceled. Thanks.
1 reply
Open
radiodiplomacy (100 D)
16 Feb 11 UTC
Join the game NOW!
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=50516

Few minutes left.
0 replies
Open
Eggzavier (444 D)
16 Feb 11 UTC
What have you walked away from?
For those of us who refuse to resign from a game, any game, even a live game, I was just wondering what real world random (or not so random) events have come up that you just had to miss because you refused to resign and a live game continued way longer than you thought it would?
3 replies
Open
deagles (100 D)
16 Feb 11 UTC
Mod request: change deadlines?
I've got a private game with some friends, and we originally set it up with 7-day deadlines. We'd like to change it to 4-day deadlines to enforce a slightly faster pace of play. Can a moderator change the setting for us?
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=47370
Thanks in advance.
3 replies
Open
gjdip (1090 D)
15 Feb 11 UTC
Replacement needed for league D1
We need a replacement for league D1. We promise fun and excitement with a dash of despair and obscenities. Contact [email protected].
4 replies
Open
Haert (234 D)
15 Feb 11 UTC
Should I take the tainted win?
Or what's considered fair play?
gameID=50505
9 replies
Open
basvanopheusden (2176 D)
15 Feb 11 UTC
Insert something amusing
Can I get a pause, or should I find a sitter? gameID=47099
2 replies
Open
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
04 Feb 11 UTC
Ghost-Rating Challenge Game!
Been a while since we had one of these.
Great way to meet new, high-quality players.
Signup ends Friday, Feb. 11th.
180 replies
Open
fuzzyhartle1 (100 D)
15 Feb 11 UTC
game
come and join my game its five min phase and for people who dont know how to play this game that well like me
2 replies
Open
Centurian (3257 D)
14 Feb 11 UTC
Centurian Marches Again
After an almost year gone, perhaps it is time for some nostalgic stabbing?
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=50437
Let me know if you want the password
6 replies
Open
aoe3rules (949 D)
12 Feb 11 UTC
This post is self-referential
discuss
12 replies
Open
Philalethes (100 D(B))
11 Feb 11 UTC
Hey, are you from Montreal?
Check this out.
16 replies
Open
Katsarephat (100 D)
15 Feb 11 UTC
Mods: Unpause request?
Hi mods,

In gameID=49540, Germany requested a pause and said he'd unpause on Monday. If Tuesday rolls around on the International Date line and it's still paused, is there any chance the game could be unpaused?
10 replies
Open
Zencore (100 D)
14 Feb 11 UTC
Question about supporting to Hold, non-holding armies
See inside
10 replies
Open
Eggzavier (444 D)
15 Feb 11 UTC
Help a newb out?
Comments please.
34 replies
Open
djbent (2572 D(S))
03 Feb 11 UTC
a game with old chatty pals
paging jbalcorn, LanGaidin, Xapi, fortknox, Noirin, Ursa, Hereward77, and other fun, chatty types...

game for a game?
63 replies
Open
peterwiggin (15158 D)
29 Jan 11 UTC
SoW Undergrad 2
The main thread dropped off, so I'm starting a new one.
28 replies
Open
aoe3rules (949 D)
15 Feb 11 UTC
Let's Play a Game Man 4 Post-game
inside
23 replies
Open
Eggzavier (444 D)
14 Feb 11 UTC
WTA gah...
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=50407
Good game to all.
I really think the game would have ended differently had Germany not made one key descision.... but whatevers.
Good game everyone.
6 replies
Open
Dharmaton (2398 D)
13 Feb 11 UTC
I'd like to introduce a new player !
She is a Girl! But, don't get ideas, a FB friend... she's a Lady programmer, more (in both senses) my age... & a complete Newb. = ( Caerulean )
71 replies
Open
Maniac (189 D(B))
07 Feb 11 UTC
Arguments for posting ‘cheater’ accusations in the forums.
See inside
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Maniac (189 D(B))
07 Feb 11 UTC
As we all know it is presently considered bad form to post accusations about your suspicions that someone is cheating in the forum, one should email a mod who will investigate the matter. But is this really the correct way of doing things?

One of the arguments forwarded is that we can not have a ‘witch hunt’ and ‘mob rule’ just doesn’t work. Well, who is this mob? That’s right, you and me. I thought we were semi-articulate respected members of a gaming community, but apparently not. We’re a mob, unable to differentiate between an accused person and a guilty one. Only the mods have the intellect and balanced reasoning to determine whom amongst us is cheating.

Whilst I may not always agree with my fellow respected/mob* members (delete as applicable), I think that they should have the opportunity to express their suspicions and if needs be add to the evidence for and against the accused. If we continue to protect the accused identity this opportunity is lost.

It would appear that many accusations are made against people who play gunboat games. I think presenting the evidence in public and debating how two or more players could have choreographed moves also helps newer players understand the subtleties of the game.

Another factor to take into consideration is that justice should be conducted as far as possible in the public arena. People are accused and banned if necessary for the benefit of all of us – that justice is seen to be done is important.

I also believe that public accusations and ‘trails’ will deter many people who may be tempted to cheat, knowing that they will have to account publicly for their actions.

Some may say that people will have their good reputations tainted by false accusations. As someone who has been accused, I can say that I have never felt sidelined by other members just because someone accused me. I trust you guys to give an accused person the benefit of any doubt and only campaign for their removal if the evidence against them is conclusive.

I have some sympathy for the argument that ‘mud sticks’ and that falsely accused players have every right to feel aggrieved. However, we should remember that we are not accusing people of buggering a dead cat in Westminster Abbey. If people really feel so aggrieved that there good name has been tarnished, it isn’t beyond the wit of man to correct this injustice by allowing them to change their screen name.

I think that we may have to decide on some etiquette for accusing people, it may be best to wait until after a game has finished, or we may prefer the original accuser to cite more than one alleged instance for example.

☺ (1304 D)
07 Feb 11 UTC
The arguments on both sides of this have been posted a number of times, and I have sympathy for a number of your points. And I wouldn't necessarily have a problem if someone posted something along the lines of "Hey can anyone explain peoples moves in this game to me? I don't understand what's going on." That's a very passive way to get answers about the same question. You're not even naming names, and if it's obvious, then people (I've done this) will e-mail the mods on your behalf, and they'll look into it.

What I would personally like to see happen is a list of the results of any mod investigations done after they're completed. Someone wouldn't necessarily be posted if they were deemed completely innocent, but I for one would like to keep track of people who "play with friends". These people are often not banned, but also not revealed to the community. I want to know who these people are, because I'll avoid them. When I'm hosting/joining an invitational game, I will for sure check these people and make sure they're not "playing with their friend" again. And if I were in a game where someone cheated, I'd like to be informed of that, namely so I can remove it from my statistics spreadsheet.
☺ (1304 D)
07 Feb 11 UTC
I think, at a minimum, the person who originally informed the mods of a suspected cheater should get a reply e-mail back with the decision, both to clear the innocent and satiate the curiosity of the original player.
cjva (374 D)
07 Feb 11 UTC
I'm skeptical. Right now I'm new to this site, and have no idea of how active/inactive the mods are, but if the moderators on this site are at least semi active I believe that the best course of action is to report suspicious behavior to the mods, and let them solve it.

We might be respected and such, but since I joined (less then 24 hours ago) Iv seen at least 1 thread where one guy went rampant and called other players idiots etc. I have no troubles believing that people in this state of anger also would accuse other players of being cheaters, and that is not a good community to play and have fun in.
Draugnar (0 DX)
07 Feb 11 UTC
First - It isn't just bad form, the mods have declared it against the rules. Get off it already, Maniac.

Second - I've always gotten an email both when they receive the accusation and when they resolve their investigation, no matter the outcome.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
07 Feb 11 UTC
"I think, at a minimum, the person who originally informed the mods of a suspected cheater should get a reply e-mail back with the decision, both to clear the innocent and satiate the curiosity of the original player."

We already try to do this.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
07 Feb 11 UTC
@Maniac

A number of the mods (including myself) have just recently explained our position to you. I will not repeat myself.

However, I will add the following two points to what I said earlier.

It is a waste of time for an accused player to justify themselves to the entire community (that, by the way, is not privy to the info that the mods have). Furthermore, many people do not frequent the forums and a non-response is sure to be considered a sign of guilt by most of the community.

Finally, I will remind you once again that there are few mods who do this on their own time in order to make the community better. You are proposing a much more stressful and time-consuming method for the mods, who will continue to receive no compensation. Furthermore, by continuously bringing this up, you continue to make our lives more difficult.
☺ (1304 D)
07 Feb 11 UTC
@ Abge:

I didn't know that. I've never received a reply e-mail though. :-P
Draugnar (0 DX)
07 Feb 11 UTC
abgemacht +1

Respect! You, figle, and all the mods have my utmost respect and I really wish Maniac would get off his soapbox.

I recently reported a suspicious situation I found when I was looking for a game to join. I didn't join the game in question because of my suspicions. But the mods checked it out and, after completing their investigation, sent me an email confirming my suspicions and banned the accounts in question.

The mods here rule!
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
07 Feb 11 UTC
@ : )

There was a few months when poor figle was working all by himself. Now that we have more mods, you should be getting replies to your emails.
☺ (1304 D)
08 Feb 11 UTC
@ abge:

Cool. And I didn't mean to sound ungrateful. You all do a lot of thankless work.

Any comment on the posting a weekly (or monthly, I'm not really sure how often you all ban people) report on what decisions were made? Or just post (if they were convicted/whatever) in the forums when a decision is made? I can't imagine it would be that much more work - mostly just communication issues.
spyman (424 D(G))
08 Feb 11 UTC
I think Maniac makes some good points, and he right to express his opinion and state his case, even if the general consensus has been decided. Debates are healthy.
I pretty much agree with Maniac. Sometimes it is best to get it all out in the open. The outcome might be that a new player gets to find out how one can legally communicate in a gunboat.
However, I do recall when I first started playing here that I had a game tainted someone playing two accounts. At that time there was no established etiquette regarding this sort of thing, and I don't think the mods yet had a special email address. But I tracked a mod down and asked him to investigate as I didn't feel comfortable naming names in the forum. So while I agree with Maniac in theory, in my own personal practice I wouldn't use the forum to out people. But when players have been outed and they have been guilty I have appreciated knowing who they were. Pregame colluders and multi-accounters have the privilege of knowing who they can trust from the outset, why should the rest of us have the privilege of knowing who we definitely can't trust.
That all said I come to accept the main opinion around here and that is "don't post cheating accusations in the forum"
Maniac (189 D(B))
08 Feb 11 UTC
@abgemacht - I appreciate the work that mods do, but that doesn't mean that your opinions on certain matters outweight those of us lesser mortals. I can understand you not wanting to continue a debate, and I have no issue with that, but I find it difficult to accept someone joining a debate only to say they won't repeat themselves and complain that by my raising an issue again that I'm making your life more difficult. If you don't won't to debate the issue stay silent, if you do want to debate it try and bring a better argument than, "I'm a mod, I do it for free, therefore I'm right." I raely criticise mods but I do believe that some mods regard themselves as pope rather than a mod of a gaming site.

@Draugnar - I have plenty of other soapboxes to get on, if I get off this one. Again, you seem to want to reduce a debate to some kind of personality contest, the mods are gods, therefore right and Maniac is an annoyance and therefore wrong. If you want to debate the issue that's fine, if not stay silent.
spyman (424 D(G))
08 Feb 11 UTC
yeah I didn't get that part about a soapbox either.
Draugnar (0 DX)
08 Feb 11 UTC
the soapbox reference is because maniac has brought this up before and refuses to let go. perhaps you don't know what getting up on a soapbox is, but it very much applies to someone who insists on returning to a topic instead of moving on.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
09 Feb 11 UTC
@ : )

That is an interesting idea. Although, I would prefer weekly/monthly installments over a post for each iteration, as that could clutter the forum. Like anything else, the chance of that coming to fruition will depend more on free time and less on merit. : (

@Maniac

I continue to partake in these discussions because I want you and the other readers to know that the mods value the community's opinion. A number of us have given very good reasons for the way things are. Would you prefer that the mods remained silent on these issues?

Furthermore, I think it's perfectly reasonable to point out that we've had this discussion less than a week ago, so it isn't unreasonable for me to not want to outline my entire argument again.

Finally, I'm a little offended by this sense of entitlement you keep trying to pin on the mods. The mods never treat the rest of the community as second-class citizens and for you to use phrases such as "us lesser mortals" is really disingenuous to the type of relationship that we have here on webdip.
Maniac (189 D(B))
09 Feb 11 UTC
@abgemacht

It;s interesting that you seem to be happy to discuss at length why you don't want to debate at lenght. I'm happy for you to join the debate, but please don't try and sideline the issue by talking about not talking. As I said previously i'm happy for you to debate or to stay silent.

As I recall figles used the phase 'mob rule' won't work. And I pointed out that the #mob# he was referring to was the general membership. It is central to the debate that in effect people with power (mods) don't trust other members to differentiate between suspected cheaters and those found guilty. I have faith in my fellow members to treat accused as innocent until proven guilty and the mods appear to not trust their fellow members and want to reserve the right of judge to themselves. Whilst the phase 'us lesser mortals' is perhaps unmeritted, the question remains, why do you think that mods could receive a notification about an alledged cheater and still treat that member fairly whilst you feel the ordinary members couldn't hear such accusations?

I also note that no one has reaponded to my point that if those found innocent feel that their reputation has been tarnished that the mod could simply allow them to change their screen name.
spyman (424 D(G))
09 Feb 11 UTC
Change their screen name? It would be shame if it came to that. I don't think the thought of that helps the case for an open forum on cheats, even though I think you make some valid points.
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
09 Feb 11 UTC
I am with Maniac on this one.

The mods do a good job, but it's unrealistic to expect them to be able to catch and deal with every single case. More importantly, the mods have adopted a policy where they only act when they have sufficient proof - which is how it should be - but the downside is they are effectively unable to do much unless the cheater is really obvious and consistent in his actions - and clearly some cheaters are smarted than this.

In real life we have law enforcement and judiciary who work like this, but we also have free press and the ability to speak up when something looks wrong - and there's no requirement to be able to prove it all beyond reasonable doubt, is there? Thus, if the majority of the population think someone is cheating they can take some action (e.g. avoid this person) and not have to wait for an official decision.

Here's what I don't like about the current system:
1. I was under the impression that stopping cheating is the main objective here, as of late we're mostly talking about forum censorship. What happened?
2. If I post a cheating accusation with some evidence (maybe not 100% conclusive, but enough to make most people seriously think) are you really going to ban me?.. I guess not... I mean you aren't banning people for almost obvious cheating and you'll ban me for a forum post...I don't buy this. Why make rules you cannot enforce?
3. You're only making your life harder this way. There are situation where the Mods (being the official site reps) won't have the option to take a decision. Having a public channel to sort out cases like this will help - both for sorting these out and for prevention. I'm not really sure what the problem is with having a few topics like - actually I'd assume that having a couple of these always on the first page of the forum will only help long-term. People should know this is persecuted with all means necessary - and I believe this is where the current policy is totally wrong.

Finally, if someone is accused falsely they should have no problem dealing with it. I've been accused at least 3 times in the forum and investigated after. I see no problem with that and am pretty sure others won't take it that personally either. That's a requirement for having a better community and if haven't done anything wrong you have nothing to worry about anyway.
Inspector Rex (0 DX)
09 Feb 11 UTC
Ivo- is that an essay??? I agree with u tho
Xapi (194 D)
09 Feb 11 UTC
"why do you think that mods could receive a notification about an alledged cheater and still treat that member fairly whilst you feel the ordinary members couldn't hear such accusations?"

(I'm answering this because I understand a support the administration's position on this.)

Because with a little power comes great responsibility, and the mods are very serious about that.

If the mod team was randomly picked, I'd say you'd be about right. But it's not, and furthermore, the mods are heavily instructed to err on the side of cautios by Kestas.
spyman (424 D(G))
09 Feb 11 UTC
I would hope that the falsely accused wouldn't feel their reputation tarnished. There would have to be some compelling evidence for mud to stick. And when accusations are clearly baseless, that usually becomes apparent in the thread. But when the mud does stick there's probably a reason.
Inspector Rex (0 DX)
09 Feb 11 UTC
From what I've learned in games, you're banned before you can even ask for 'mud to sticj' ESP if innocent. But such is a free unpaid site for ya.
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
09 Feb 11 UTC
I haven't heard of anyone getting banned without good cause. Do you actually know of such case, or just speculating? :)

There are other sites, some paid, if this is so important for you :)

Plus you can always donate to this one.
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
09 Feb 11 UTC
@Maniac

I am not sidelining the conversation. I am directly responding to points you've made. As to your main argument, you've added nothing since the last time we talked, so what else is there to say?

@Ivo

Since you are new to the conversation, let me address your concerns:

1) There really is only 1 thing that is censored and that is cheating accusations. As we've seen from some very nasty posts, anything else seems to go on this forum. As this thread proves, even talking about not talking about accusations is allowed. Now, new suggestions (such as :)'s) are always welcome and will be considered.
2) No we will not, but if it becomes an epidemic the rules may change and that may be a shame. Also, I'd like to point out that I don't make the policies, I only enforce them.
3) OK, this is where your argument breaks down. Let me be clear:

A *vast* majority of people who are accused have *never* posted on the forum. Furthermore, a large percent of people who are accused are innocent.

So, this is what will happen: A person (innocent) is accused. They don't visit the forum. People take that as a sign of guilt. They unleash a firestorm of hate against this player. Eventually, someone tells the player they should visit the forum. What do they find? 100 posts of people damning him for cheating, calling him names, cyber stalking him. So, he leaves the site.

Tell me you don't think this would happen, because, honestly, this is what my personal fear is.

@Inspector Rex

You of all people should know that this isn't the case.
djbent (2572 D(S))
09 Feb 11 UTC
Maniac,Ivo, and spyman -- i don't really understand what the problem is with the current setup. and i don't think having people say stuff in the forum will help. i remember when someone called Ivo a cheat -- that was just silly, but Ivo is an established player who is quite confident. a new player might not a) be given the benefit of the doubt or b) feel like dealing with it.

as for Maniac's point about us being the mob -- there's a lot of mob member who i'm not interested in having judge me or anyone else. i don't think that the general membership of the site, via the forum, could better police cheating than the mods currently do. sure it might uncover a couple cases, but i think the potential damage of false accusations outweighs that.
Maniac (189 D(B))
09 Feb 11 UTC
@Abgemacht - I honestly don't think your fears will be realised.

You complained earlier that I had used the phrase "us lesser mortals" and you said that the mods would never treat the ordinary members as second class citizens, so why do you believe that people would take the fact that a person doesn't visit the forum as a sign of guilt? Would you or any other mod?

You say I haven't added anything to the debate but I asked you specifically "why do you think that mods could receive a notification about an alleged cheater and still treat that member fairly whilst you feel the ordinary members couldn't hear such accusations?" and unless I'm missed something you haven't provided an answer.

I get the distinct impression that you are more concerned with being right than listening to reason. You appear to be creating a vision of apocolyse just to justify your arguments; you fear "firestorms of hate"; "name calling" "innocents leaving the site" and even "cyber stalking"!

Most civilised societies in real life cope well with accused people being tried in public, many would argue that it is essential to prevent an abuse of power by the executive. I’m not claiming that everyone on here is always civilised or that the executives would abuse their powers, but if open justice works in real life, I think we could safely give it a try.

Whilst I do not share your fears about innocents leaving the site, I would be happy to receive any evidence that anyone falsely accused has left and stated the accusation as a reason for leaving.
Maniac (189 D(B))
09 Feb 11 UTC
@djbent - it has been bad form / against the rules to post cheating allegations on the forum for some time, yet still it persists. If we can't stop the allegations appearing, then I think we should accpt it and move to a more open system where people can post accusations; the accused and others could offer their opinions if they wish and the mods could enlighten us about any evidence or otherwise they have in their possession. Once we accept that public examination is acceptable we can then take strides to mitigate the negative effects that some of the mods fear.
Draugnar (0 DX)
09 Feb 11 UTC
@Maniac - the mods can't change screen names. It's not built into the system. And more to the point, why the fuck should I have to change my screen name cause some asshole n00b decided to accuse me of cheating? I'm Draugnar. I own Draugnar.com and Draugnar Productions. I have used this name for more than 15 years.

And with regards to "mob rule"... Individuals may be smart, but mob mentality has nothing to do with individual intellect. It would still happen. A brilliant gunboat *would* result in two or more people being accused of meta/multi gaming and because it was so brilliant, others *would* jump on the bandwagon and tarnish their reputations.
Maniac (189 D(B))
09 Feb 11 UTC
@djbent - you say that you wouldn't want the mob to judge you so I assume that you are happy with teh mods judging you in private? I would prefer the opposite, if I'm accused, then let it be publicly examined by my piers and not by an unpaid overworked mod.

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95 replies
The Fox (115 D)
14 Feb 11 UTC
New Game 12 hr PPSC Ancient Med Mod
http://www.webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=50419

Looking for players
0 replies
Open
Kind.of.slow (746 D)
14 Feb 11 UTC
about retards
Please dear mods, ban the IPs of handicapped centers and mental health institutions. We will lose a few players, but it's for a greater good. Thanks.
45 replies
Open
AncientMemories (635 D)
13 Feb 11 UTC
Stalemated game
This is a stalemate right?
http://www.webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=47858&msgCountryID=7
neither of the alliances are going to break, and i am pretty sure the game has stalemated.
41 replies
Open
Zachattack413 (1231 D)
14 Feb 11 UTC
Does anybody have this email or something like it? They were signed up for the winter league and haven't shown up yet. If anyone has any information please let me know!
0 replies
Open
Dan Wang (1194 D)
12 Feb 11 UTC
Gunboat, anonymous, 60 points, 24 hour phases
4 replies
Open
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