This is a perfect example of what happens when you have a city that has decade after decade of 100% Democrat control, where the Unions ran the show and raped the citizens for every dime they had....and then raped them some more.

You drive through the city at night, half the street lights don't work, the city is literally covered in garbage and debris, vacant buildings, rarely do you see a cop except in the few business districts around the casinos, the stadiums, GM building, etc...but leave those few blocks of protected zone and it's no-man's land.

This bankruptcy is probably going to be the best thing to happen to Detroit in decades.

You can only blame big corporations and other liberal bogeymen for so long. The truth is that corrupt machine politics in a one-party system devoted to the liberal social model wrecked an entire city and thousands of lives beyond repair.

"corrupt machine politics in a one-party system " That one-party System in Detroit...in fact Wayne County in general (in which Detroit exists) is LIBERAL DEMOCRAT.

DEMOCRAT RULE List of FAILED CITIES:
Detroit , MI (1st on the poverty rate list) hasn't elected a Republican mayor since 1961;
Buffalo, NY (2nd) hasn't elected one since 1954;
Cincinnati , OH (3rd)...since 1984;
Cleveland , OH (4th)...since 1989;
Miami , FL (5th) has never had a Republican mayor;
St. Louis , MO (6th)....since 1949;
El Paso , TX (7th) has never had a Republican mayor;
Milwaukee , WI (8th)...since 1908;
Philadelphia , PA (9th)...since 1952;
Newark , NJ (10th)...since 1907.

GM produces cars like this:

http://img.timeinc.net/time/2007/50_cars/pontiac_aztec.jpg

And people wonder why the city failed. Sheesh.

Gm is not Detroit, moron. One is a corporation, one is A GOVERNMENT ENTITY.

A GOOD CITY actively seeks to expand its business base so that one corporate.failure doesn't destroy the city...

That's arguably the ugliest human built apparatus I have ever seen in my life.

Further there are 3 automakers in the region. Further. No city around Detroit is Bankrupt/in financial distress EXCEPT other Democrat cities : Flint, Pontiac, etc

I owned an Aztec - ugly as shit at the time, today there are all sorts of vehicles that took design cues from it. But, it was a FANTASTIC vehicle. I loved it despite its looks and would drive one again.

Its funny, in fifty years the Aztek will probably be worth a lot of money if you have one in good condition.

Hey Krellin, I don't know where you got your numbers from, but only the actual City of Cincinnati is hurting. The region is propspering, and Cinci City is on a pretty good recovery now if they'd just stop wasting money on shit like light-rail trolley systems that run from downtown to UC and don't connect the rest of the metropolitan area. The money in Cincinnati is all out side Cincinnati. It's in other parets of Hamilton County, Butler County and Warren County as well as in parts fo Northern Kentucky. It's in places like Indian Hill, Kenwood, Montgomery, Blue Ash, Fairfield, West Chester, Mason, Deerfield Township, Crestview Hills, Florence, Edgewood... It's in business and shopping districts like Voice of America Park, Union Center, Bridgewater Falls, Olde Montgomery, Deerfield Towne Center, Crestview Hills Towne Center, Florence Mall, Florence's Houston Road shopping and business district.

We still have strong companies like Procter & Gamble and GE Evendale and 5/3rd Bank.

So while Cincinnati may be driving the city itself into the ground through stupid council decisions and wasteful spending, the region is caring for itself and prospering.

Draug, same with Detroit. Oakland county is prospering. Border cities are fine. Detroit is just a fucking cesspool.

Hey Redhouse, try these on for size:

http://getcars.ru/upload/wallpaper/nissan/cube/2.jpg
http://0.tqn.com/d/cars/1/0/Y/d/2/12_smart_fortwo_pure.jpg

I think the second is for women and the first is for blind people.

Well, Detroit is physically bigger than Cincinnati, I think. Cincinnati has a very small population and would have fallen off the map long ago if it weren't for the fact that the surrounding region props it up by coming downtown to work and going to Bengals and Reds games and that the city managed to get Hamilton County to help them build to stadiums then raise the money for them and supposedly a couple county jails) by raising sales taxes all for things built within the city limits. Combine that with two major universities (UC and Xavier) and the city isn't gonna go under cause the region won't let it. Personally, if I were in charge, I'd separate downtown and the river front and make them a new City (New Cincinnati anyone?) and then wall off all of old Cincinnati and make it into a prison ala "Escape from New York". The problem is there are some pearls amongst the swine, some gemstones in the muck and mire. Places like the campus of UC, the Zoo, the Museum Center at Union Terminal, Mt. Adams, Eden Park with the Playhouse and Art Museum, The Banks, and even some community improvement happening thanks to good corporate citizens (the key is we don't rely on one industry and none of our industries are hurting like the auto industry was/is) so even the old cesspools like Over-the-Rhine are experiencing recovery, no thanks to city council's dumb ass decisions. But city council is elected by the citizens of the actual city, so the welfare collecting and the blue collar workers and the prostitutes, drug dealers, and homeless people that Acorn busses to the polls keep a liberal city council. The rest of the region (i.e. Greater Cincinnati) tends to be more conservative and it prospers. Technically, Greater Cincinnati is red on the politcal maps of Ohio with just part of Hamilton County being blue and Hamilton County itself being purple.

Anddddd of course Detroit turns into Cincinnati when Draug showed up.

Cincinnati comes first in the alphabet but krellin mentioned it.

"Nigee, Detroit is 100% a craphole. There is almost no redeeming qualities there, and true, I have not been there for quite some time (10 years maybe) however, them filing for bankruptcy proves that nothing has changed for the better,."

This is actually beyond wrong. In the past 10 years several large businesses have moved into the area. This carved out a few areas surrounding Greektown, the hockey arena, the baseball stadium, and mainly the Renaissance Center. In the past 3 or 4 years there have been month to year long wait lists on the living accommodations in this area, which is rapidly expanding outward in an area that's considered "safe". Companies like Quicknloans, GM, Compuware, EPrize and several others have been bringing new talent into the city in droves.

Don't get me wrong, the city is still crap, but it's improving dramatically each year and is far better than 10 years ago.

I'd still rather live in Detroit than Cincinnati. At least things happen in Detroit.


As has been said, this bankruptcy is something of a godsend to the city. It is the only way possible for the public pension system to be reformed so that it at least resembles economic reality. Now, that won't fix the crime or high taxes or urban decay or any of the myriad issues keeping the city down, but it's a hell of a good start. Much like how other great cities like Venice or Lisbon will never, ever reach the heights they had before, so will Detroit. But there's a decent chance it'll become a tolerable place to live again, even though the economic center may move to Grand Rapids.

Must. Not. Repsond. To. Invictus'. Taunt.

Actually, my wife and I are going down to Detroit tonight. Probably hit Greektown casino, and then walk around the (admittedly small) Greektown area and get dinner.

We've taken the kids down to Greektown and walked around past the RecCen (now the GM Building), up to the stadiums to see Ford Field and Comerica park, and when there is a game beign played, that area is just hopping! Good restaurants the Fox theater is there....

...there is a *core* of vibrant business life in Detroit, and now they will expand upon that when they build the new Hockey arena to expand on this area, and you will *almost* have a few mile stretch of business and *safety* extending from the Riverfront, past Greektown, to the sports centers and then up to Mid-Town, where the Detroit Art Museum is and parts of Wayne State University.

There are investors buying up property at bargain prices and moving businesses downtown...so Detroit is far from dead, and I believe they hit bottom a few years ago and are coming back....

...but it's like that kid with really bad acne, and he goes to the doc and finally figures out what's wrong with this diet and he gets on the right medications, etc. He has hit bottom and is on the way to healing...but at first, he's still covered in sores and you can't see the healing below.

Detroit is a pimple-faced teenager. It's only a few hundred years old...this is a hiccup in its history.

Maybe Detroit did hit bottom awhile ago. But that doesn't mean it'll travel all that far up now.

Take Chicago. The national news stories about it are almost exclusively about the high levels of shootings and militant teachers' union. But it the Loop is doing as great as ever and lots of other neighborhoods are really wonderful places to live. There's still an inertia keeping economic activity there despite the wide swaths of the South and West sides that are ravaged by gang warfare. A lot of this is simply because so much transportation infrastructure is designed to go through Chicago that it's simply impossible for it to collapse like Detroit did. When railroads, interstates, river shipping (Chicago's still the only way to get from the Mississippi to the Great Lakes), and one of the busiest airports all line up then the city will endure no matter what. People HAVE to deal with Chicago, taxes, crime, corruption and all. Geography demands it.

Detroit, on the other hand, does not share that fortune. Without the auto industry, there's not much going for it. Like I said, it can become livable again, but it'll be a very minor city indefinitely now, barring some awesome renaissance. Hope I'm wrong, but I'm probably not.

Invitus...that is why I mention that Detroit is a TEENAGER...a few hundred year old.

It may never be as great as it once was in our lifetime...but it will be here a thousand years from now - and who knows what will become of it when it begins producing the Easy-Install Mind-Control Chips that will revolutionize social engineering come 2032...

Oh - as for infrasturture -- Detroit boasts the largest border crossing between the US and Canada, meaning a hell of a lot of trade passes through Detroit. We have a huge airport which is an international hub, plus we are connected to the same waterway as Chicago, etc.

So don't play the "Chi-town is better than the D because we have shipping" card. :P

As for industry, yes, heavily revolving around the auto industry -- we are also home to one of the most successful mortgage copmanies in the US and the metro-Detroit area does a hell of a lot of military work. Automotbiles and tanks are here to stay for the foreseeable future...so I'm not too concerned about our industry.

Yes, we have to diversify, both within the city and as a State...which (Republican and businesman) Rick Sneider is trying to do, and I will actaully give a nod to (D-for-Dumbass) Jenny Granholm for also trying to diversify (as she also fucked up the tax structue beyond workability and drove businesses out of the state...)

A thousand years? It's a waste of time to think on those timescales.

For you it is a waste of time...I'm just saying, in the scope of things, Detroit is passing through a phase. Saying, "I won't behere to see x, therefore I don't give a shit" is an assholish way to view the world and manage our assets.

The rhetoric -- "Detroit is dead, blah blah blah" is tiresome and ridiculous. Detroit will be here in a thousand years...it isn't dead...it's got acne...so, instead of writign the city off, do what's right, fix the city, throw out the Democrats and let's move on.

"So don't play the "Chi-town is better than the D because we have shipping" card. :P"

I'm not trying to get into a tinkling contest. I don't even live particularly close, being at the border of Cook and Lake counties and even then just for a few more weeks till I move to where my law school is. I just mean that Chicago, due to geography and infrastructure, is much better insulated from the same problems as Detroit. People can write off Detroit (as they have), but can never do the same for Chicago.

And no one thinks on thousand year timescales. Ever. That's an impractically huge length of time for our primate brains. Stop trying to make yourself seem far-sighted and wise. You're a phoney. One lifetime out is as good as planning gets, if that.

I was just about to say, limit yourself to 100 years. Then I saw Invictus' "one lifetime" which is about 100 years!