M62: PEOPLE'S DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC OF REVOLUTIONARY MAFIA GAME THREAD!

[Chaqa]

At least you’re honest. I don’t think it’s Ghug, Kgray, celaph, and HR. And it’s not me. That leaves you (bozo), flum, and Chaqa. From scummiest to least scummy, I would say Chaqa you and then flum. It’s all pretty close.

I do want it to be Ghug based on how hard they’re pushing for me but they seem town.

Why not celaph?

Their EOD post from the day where we killed damo seemed very townie.

I think it's dangerous to clear anyone for specific posts like this. Desperate scum could have planned a very towny message to use in that exact situation.

This entire game is WIFOM now.

[kgray]

The context of that was suspecting scum was in Balki or HR, though. And given we now know the alignment of all of the celaph voters except HR (who I presume is the Priest), it seems damo was indeed bussed.

Stop being so cagey, Ray.

Yes, he was clearly bussed, although you wouldn't have known that at the time, right? And if the context was you suspecting scum to be in HR or Balki, then you wouldn't have come to the conclusion that damo bussed, but rather the opposite.

Oh, you're right. My memory is bad. I was right except I forgot who I thought did the bussing lol

@bozo are you seeing this?? He's being so cagey.

[Chaqa]

Yes, he was clearly bussed, although you wouldn't have known that at the time, right? And if the context was you suspecting scum to be in HR or Balki, then you wouldn't have come to the conclusion that damo bussed, but rather the opposite.

Oh, you're right. My memory is bad. I was right except I forgot who I thought did the bussing lol

@bozo are you seeing this?? He's being so cagey.

But you're Cagey Ray!

Sorry, this is never going away

[aarodactyl]

Why not celaph?

Their EOD post from the day where we killed damo seemed very townie.

What about it made it seem towny?

It seemed like a lot of work and they published it without enough time to have it save them.

[bozotheclown]

Are you actually curious or are you just hoping to compare it against all my previous reads?

both

At least you’re honest. I don’t think it’s Ghug, Kgray, celaph, and HR. And it’s not me. That leaves you (bozo), flum, and Chaqa. From scummiest to least scummy, I would say Chaqa you and then flum. It’s all pretty close.

I do want it to be Ghug based on how hard they’re pushing for me but they seem town.

Thanks.

[kgray]

I did not want to NK you because I knew there was a good chance you had a bomb, but I was outvoted.

So many things worked out well for town in that game, and yet we still managed to mess it up

What I couldn't believe was that HR gave you the bomb before knowing you were the jailer. He could have easily killed the jailer that way if it had been anyone else. I thought either you were the jailer who had jailed the inventor and had him give you the bomb, or you were the inventor who had been jailed and gave the bomb to the jailer who passed it back to you.

You know what's kind of hilarious is that I didn't even realize until after the game that I could get killed by the bomb if I tried to jail whoever had it. It wasn't even something I considered. So really I just got super lucky that it worked out that way haha

[aarodactyl]

Why not celaph?

Their EOD post from the day where we killed damo seemed very townie.

I think it's dangerous to clear anyone for specific posts like this. Desperate scum could have planned a very towny message to use in that exact situation.

This entire game is WIFOM now.

I guess that’s fair.

[Fluminator]

Is bozo always wait until late game to tunnel or only when they’re called out for not doing it?

I think it usually happens later in the game when he's town. When I played with scum!bozo he was killed unexpectedly at night without getting too much pressure in the game, so he wasn't called out for not doing his tunneling.

So I don't know lol

I did call him out that game for throwing shade instead of actually pushing his reads that game too.

I feel like Bozo having spent almost every day on seth, throwing shade on other growing wagons to jump on them when they grow and get a miskill, and then going back to voting seth inconsequentially every round has been his contributions to the game.
Usually town Bozo is a bit more inspired then this.

Can any people who townread Bozo give me a reason?

That was the day before he blew up on your bomb though, so I didn't get to see if bozo changed his tactics right after being called out on it.

I'm still a little suspicious that we called him out on playing his scum meta this game too, and as soon as we did, he starts the tunneling we expect from town bozo.
I'm also looking back through Vecna's reads and he scumread bozo, and bozo strikes me as the type of player to kill Vecna before the clears for that, and Balki.

But I'm not locked in on him yet.

[bozotheclown]

Yes, he was clearly bussed, although you wouldn't have known that at the time, right? And if the context was you suspecting scum to be in HR or Balki, then you wouldn't have come to the conclusion that damo bussed, but rather the opposite.

Oh, you're right. My memory is bad. I was right except I forgot who I thought did the bussing lol

@bozo are you seeing this?? He's being so cagey.

Yes, Chaqa saying he forgot something is scum indicative, like the times he claimed to forget Kakarroto and dargorygel.

[kgray]

Their EOD post from the day where we killed damo seemed very townie.

What about it made it seem towny?

It seemed like a lot of work and they published it without enough time to have it save them.

Two minutes is a lot of time. It's twice as much time as Balki had left when he voted for teacon D1, and you eventually agreed with me that that was enough time for things to change.

[aarodactyl]

What about it made it seem towny?

It seemed like a lot of work and they published it without enough time to have it save them.

Two minutes is a lot of time. It's twice as much time as Balki had left when he voted for teacon D1, and you eventually agreed with me that that was enough time for things to change.

It’s enough time for other votes to come in but I don’t know if it’s enough time for someone to read a post, decide to change their vote, and actually change their vote.

I still don’t think they’re as scummy as the other players I mentioned though

[Chaqa]

Oh, you're right. My memory is bad. I was right except I forgot who I thought did the bussing lol

@bozo are you seeing this?? He's being so cagey.

Yes, Chaqa saying he forgot something is scum indicative, like the times he claimed to forget Kakarroto and dargorygel.

I hope you're trolling, because if someone else tries to tell me I did something because I didn't do I'm gonna flip.

[aarodactyl]

I also remember reading celaph at one point and thinking they seemed town. It might be worth redoing that as some point but I’m not going to commit to any more rereadings

[kgray]

Is bozo always wait until late game to tunnel or only when they’re called out for not doing it?

I think it usually happens later in the game when he's town. When I played with scum!bozo he was killed unexpectedly at night without getting too much pressure in the game, so he wasn't called out for not doing his tunneling.

So I don't know lol

I did call him out that game for throwing shade instead of actually pushing his reads that game too.

I feel like Bozo having spent almost every day on seth, throwing shade on other growing wagons to jump on them when they grow and get a miskill, and then going back to voting seth inconsequentially every round has been his contributions to the game.
Usually town Bozo is a bit more inspired then this.

Can any people who townread Bozo give me a reason?

That was the day before he blew up on your bomb though, so I didn't get to see if bozo changed his tactics right after being called out on it.

I'm still a little suspicious that we called him out on playing his scum meta this game too, and as soon as we did, he starts the tunneling we expect from town bozo.
I'm also looking back through Vecna's reads and he scumread bozo, and bozo strikes me as the type of player to kill Vecna before the clears for that, and Balki.

But I'm not locked in on him yet.

He's not doing what he did that game, though, right? He's not sticking with one tunnel but finding reasons to hop on other miskill wagons.

I agree that he started tunneling after he was called out on it, and his first target was you, who were (I think) the first to call him out. But his D2 was still pretty solvey. He didn't focus on every single detail, but it's a big game, and I thought he was hunting. And then we had two confirmed scum and a large distraction, and nobody was really being very solvey for a few days.

I think him doing the tunneling thing after being called out makes sense for town!bozo and I don't find it suspicious. Although bozo himself wants us to view potentially scummy things as being scummy, so I guess he can have half a scumpoint for that

[Hellenic Riot]

Aite so you have three more shots to find the last scum, which should still be more than enough. As a parting gift, my evaluation of the remaining players, from towniest to scummiest:

kgray - Do not daykill
ghug - Do not daykill
celaph - Do not daykill

Chaqa - Probably don't daykill. Pure paranoia suggests Chaqa being right on 4 of the 5 dead scum members is fishy, but still. Surely not. Surely not?!

Bozo - The only person who seems to be throwing shade at multiple people and thus could theoretically be 'lining up the miskills' that the scum would have to be doing here, given he seems to be after Aaro and also Flum, whilst also not exactly fighting hard to prevent Bona's death. Beginning to therefore look a bit more sus. Still struggling to imagine he hardbussed Damo there, but Bozo has been known to bus in the past so it isn't completely out of the question

Aaro - Perhaps I'm wrong on his towniness, though I still struggle to see it. He has been overly concerned with self-protection recently, but is that even especially surprising or damning for a newbie? Bona also spent most of the game only reacting to people scumreading him after all. In pure VCA terms Aaro doesn't really get any credit for any of the deaths though.

Fluminator - Back to the top of my suspicions now that the low-hanging fruit have been removed. Definitely capable of bussing, and there's been plenty discussion of the various issues with things he did D1 & D2... And I do still think he was tying me and Damo together there. Doesn't really get any credit for Damo D5 either, given he voted me and then Bona for most of the day and only joined the Damo wagon when it was in the lead.

Can you explain why you have ghug town read this much? I agree that he feels very townie, but for some reason I have far more paranoia around him than kgray.

He'd have been right more often if he were scum

[kgray]

Can you explain why you have ghug town read this much? I agree that he feels very townie, but for some reason I have far more paranoia around him than kgray.

He'd have been right more often if he were scum

Would he though? He only bussed one teammate in M60.

[Hellenic Riot]

Can you explain why you have ghug town read this much? I agree that he feels very townie, but for some reason I have far more paranoia around him than kgray.

He'd have been right more often if he were scum

Would he though? He only bussed one teammate in M60.

He spent a lot of time doing weird dances around townreading other teammates like Durga, though. And yes, his last-minute change to Damo is pretty massively town.

As for celaph, his EoD list could certainly have been planned. But I really really struggle to believe the last second post where he thought he was being miskilled and said to look into ghug for being on another miskill was faked - I don't believe he had time to see those changes and then think of a reaction to fake and then make it before the day ended, and it was just so massively town.

[ghug]

Was Bozo? Literally no one I remember bought bozo's reasoning that damo was the smuggler. Everyone voted him for their own different reasons.

It sounds like the only person who changed their mind at all that day was Tom because of Kgray's arguments.

I remember kgray buying it.

Eh, kind of. I already thought damo was scum, and I'm always suspicious of you. But yeah, if damo turned out to be the smuggler I'd have for sure voted you the next day.

And that's part of why I'm hesitant to give you much credit for damo's DK. Because if you're scum you knew he wasn't the smuggler and wouldn't have been worried about that connection. All of a sudden the biggest push against you disappears when damo flips goon.

This is a weird argument. It's like you've forgotten it's bad for scum when their teammates die.

[ghug]

Is bozo always wait until late game to tunnel or only when they’re called out for not doing it?

I think it usually happens later in the game when he's town. When I played with scum!bozo he was killed unexpectedly at night without getting too much pressure in the game, so he wasn't called out for not doing his tunneling.

So I don't know lol

I did not want to NK you because I knew there was a good chance you had a bomb, but I was outvoted.

Yeah, it was a calculated risk that we probably shouldn't have taken.

[Hellenic Riot]

I did not want to NK you because I knew there was a good chance you had a bomb, but I was outvoted.

So many things worked out well for town in that game, and yet we still managed to mess it up

What I couldn't believe was that HR gave you the bomb before knowing you were the jailer. He could have easily killed the jailer that way if it had been anyone else. I thought either you were the jailer who had jailed the inventor and had him give you the bomb, or you were the inventor who had been jailed and gave the bomb to the jailer who passed it back to you.

I just like to watch the world burn