MAFIA LVIII (58) - WITCHFINDER GENERAL - GAME THREAD

[bozotheclown]

You haven't missed much?

I like how his immediate next post talks about killing damo for being useless

So Bob subs in as scum and immediately 2 of his teammates are dead. Might produce something awkward like this.

"I haven't gone over the iso but vecna feels off so far..."

Has bob actually played scum before?

I remember 2 games where Bob was mafia, in the first he was killed D1, and in the second he subbed in D2 and was killed D3.

[bozotheclown]

She may not have been the first scum on the bus. There is still the potential of Vecna and yourself if we are determining ‘first’

So you think that it is possible that with 30 minutes to go, and the top 4 wagons town, 2 of Vecna, summit, and Durga decided it would be a good time to bus a mafia PR? If so, why did ghug sit out the bus?

It may be what happened - you don't know any different unless you're scum yourself.

ghug sat out to probably distance himself. All we can do is hypothesis what happened.

It seems very unlikely to me. We should be looking for the most likely possibilities, and I find it hard to believe you think this is the most likely of all things that are possible.

[bozotheclown]

yeah wait what

Again, there are only 2 mafia left, so if worcej thinks the 2 remaining scum are in Vecna, summit, and Durga, he would have to think that none of the top 4 wagons were mafia.

Where did I say that the last two are in that pile of three?

Find it for me and directly quote it.

I 100% think Durga is scum, but don't think anyone will agree with me at this point.

Then I guess we need to consult with worcej?

worcej, what do you think? *muffled noises into his headset*

Hmm... apparently he thinks you're a tool for that post summit...

Really though? Chaqa asked for a bus and it went down in that way? This would explain his shitposting with an hour or two to go I guess...and durga was the first scum on the bus? She definitely pushed it in a way that nobody else did. Is this one of the reasons you think she's scum?

She may not have been the first scum on the bus. There is still the potential of Vecna and yourself if we are determining ‘first’

[bozotheclown]

Okay - hold on. So, witch auto wins if our 2 PR's die right? So... We should kill for 3p? Not sure how to go about doing this

We have 3 PRs still alive. The mafia would lose also, so they should be motivated to keep damo alive since his power is used.

That would be a dumb mafia team - keeping a town clear alive just to avoid a 3p win makes the scum more likely to be hit.

This sounds like advice to your teammate if you get killed today.

[bozotheclown]

Two things
1. I'm a little pissed off that people are entertaining that I would bus two scum team members when everyone knows I don't bus. Stop wasting time. This is why y'all keep losing as town.

2. Put TrPrado on the 3rd party potential list. He's the perfect amount of null to be there.

Also, I hate 3ps. I just want to catch scum. This extra bullshit is so boring.

I do not believe worcej would really think that.

You keep emphasizing that 'I don't bus' like I used to emphasize 'I don't fake claim'.

Nothing about that is substantial - what if you decided to overly bus this game to try to create distance?

I do not think I have said "I don't bus" this game, if ever. I try to avoid bussing, but I am willing to do it under certain circumstances.

[bozotheclown]

This seems to look good for worcej.

Could be scum distancing.

Just like what Durga has done as well.

There is a difference between distancing and what Durga would have been doing if Chaqa were her teammate.

[BobMcBob]

Okay guys, fair criticism, I haven't actually been reading the game properly. It's mostly due to lack of time, and I'm trying to do the best I can with the information I can pick up from what I do read, and digging into what feels interesting. Of course, that does mean I miss some things, which can be, uh, somewhat awkward. Like you guys take it to mean whatever the heck you want it to, wagon me on it or not, but I am seriously trying to contribute. Maybe I should revise my reading strategy slightly though, it doesn't appear to be actually working...

[Vecna]

##vote EMC

[Hamilton Brian]

Forget what I said about Bo_. After looking at voting and comments, as annoyed as I am with the friggin' walls of text (because I think that distracts and can throw town off), I am convinced Bo_ is town. Voting seems decent and uncontroversial. That frustration and annoyance that comes through seems righteously town, even if their read on Damo was absolutely incorrect.

Pretty convinced that Bo_ is town. So that's 2 that I am certain about.

Back into the depths of it.

[Hamilton Brian]

##vote EMC

That seemed to come...out of nowhere? What's your hunch?

[BobMcBob]

Also, who actually does not check on the EoN outcomes and what caused them? The only logical explanation for that that I can think of is it just being scum that assumed the night outcome would just be a dead towny and never actually read it.

I absolutely checked the EoD outcomes, I knew both ghug and flash had died, but I did not see the point commenting on it and then forgot to check which role could kill mafia. Obviously a poor choice, but your explanation is wrong. And do you really think I saw flash's post and went "Woo, let's copy this"? This is 100% my own unoriginal opinion. There is something odd about how you're playing this game compared to how you usually play. Should I just not provide opinions or would you prefer I provide obviously bad opinions that you can push to kill me with? And you still didn't answer my question, what is up with you this game?

[BobMcBob]

@bozo @summit I would like you two to elaborate your case on worcej because I still haven't heard a convincing reason to vote for him. I even have him as townlean at the moment. What it is it about worcej's play that makes him scum?

There is this comment suggesting early Chaqa voters are scum:

The following slots have unfavourable voting both days

Bob
Bo
ghug
Ham
Worcej

Unfavorable due to what? Important criteria to assess.

Also, yeah my D2 was bad, but I stand by my read. I still don’t feel that Chaqa’s wagon occurred naturally.

Followed by this hard to believe read:

I 100% think Durga is scum, but don't think anyone will agree with me at this point.

At D2 EOD, worcej posted this after not posting for 3.5 hours:

FINALLY got network access back at my workplace...

Catching up ASAP.

Then, 2 minutes later, he posted this:

##vote Hamilton Brian

I don't like flash's wagon and I don't like Chaqa's

I am pissed I didn't have network access or my cell phone until now.

I do not see how he could have caught up enough on 3.5 hours in 2 minutes to have concluded he does not like Chaqa's wagon.

After emc moved his vote to Chaqa, worcej disparaged emc's vote with this:

To be clear, EMC is forcing chaos by tying all the wagons.

On D2, worcej's first mention of summit was him agreeing with TrPrado rather than stating his own reasons to vote for summit:

Summit has consistently been responding to pressure by cherry picking or ignoring it. I told him he ignored my question, he asked me to repeat it and when I did I didn't get an answer. But he REALLY needed to post his EON reads instead. Not liking this.

Couldn't say it any better. I like this wagon.

##vote summit

Then there is Foxcastle early case on worcej.

Okay, I can see that case now. Seems like there were a few things I overlooked when I read him but I'm going to steal some townpoints back from him now.

[worcej]

That's actually a really good case bozo.

Only problem is it's wrong.

[worcej]

not sure if its conclusive, but it fits in the general narrative of him openly protecting his teammates and just protesting a much about nonsensical sounding stuff.

Good lord, just let me swing from the noose.

Like I already said - I am too much of a distraction for most of you at this point.

[worcej]

Eye, Worcej or Bob would definitely be the bet

I think this will be a boring day. Can't see other lynch then Worcej, specially after he almost claimed VT.

Hey now, don't write everyone else off so fast.

Please don't, but lets not kid ourselves you all are going to lynch me and I'll see another string of RIP posts because you dimwits cannot believe anything I have to say.

[BobMcBob]

HB - I can see why he was one of the biggest wagons yesterday. He kind of felt awkward or helpful without being helpful for the majority of day 2. He also fixated on Seth a lot, which I just cannot get as Seth looks like a really strong town to me. I think I'd be down for a HB-sacrifice today if that's still an option.

Quick question HB, why did you see Seth as scum? I feel very much like he was an honest, helpful, active townsperson from what I read of him. Which part of behaviour makes (or made) you think otherwise?

Already laid out my case here: viewtopic.php?p=168867&sid=831b9d9e6d0b ... 84#p168867

This case on the other hand, I am not a fan of. I can totally see why a new player would be scared having a deciding vote, being overwhelmed is a thing that happens with mafia game, and protesting that you are not scum is an incredibly common noob town behaviour as well as for noob scum. Whereas the general vibe I got from him was of a noob who knew a surprising amount about how to play and was genuinely trying to help.

[worcej]

Again, there are only 2 mafia left, so if worcej thinks the 2 remaining scum are in Vecna, summit, and Durga, he would have to think that none of the top 4 wagons were mafia.

Where did I say that the last two are in that pile of three?

Find it for me and directly quote it.

I 100% think Durga is scum, but don't think anyone will agree with me at this point.

Really though? Chaqa asked for a bus and it went down in that way? This would explain his shitposting with an hour or two to go I guess...and durga was the first scum on the bus? She definitely pushed it in a way that nobody else did. Is this one of the reasons you think she's scum?

She may not have been the first scum on the bus. There is still the potential of Vecna and yourself if we are determining ‘first’

Yes, none of this says 'the last two scum are in summit, Vecna, and Durga.'

I believe Durga is scum.

[worcej]

We have 3 PRs still alive. The mafia would lose also, so they should be motivated to keep damo alive since his power is used.

That would be a dumb mafia team - keeping a town clear alive just to avoid a 3p win makes the scum more likely to be hit.

This sounds like advice to your teammate if you get killed today.

This post won't age well when I flip VT.

[worcej]

Could be scum distancing.

Just like what Durga has done as well.

There is a difference between distancing and what Durga would have been doing if Chaqa were her teammate.

Right - she actively created distance by targeting him. This is allowing her to bring up how outrageous it would be if she was on his team and you all are on that same page.

Pretty damn good scum strategy honestly.

[BobMcBob]

Okay, so seeing as I can't read the whole thread due to time constraints and I apparently can't not read the thread without being scumread for "low-effort pretending to be helpful" (like seriously, is that even a remotely smart play as scum? I'm not that dumb), what would you suggest I do instead? I'm in a rather awkward corner here where I can't catch up on reading without lurking, I can't contribute much without skipping bits of reading, and doing so will get me widely scumread. I could throw out uneducated contradictory opinions which will be turned against me, unoriginal opinions which will be turned against me or no opinions, which will be used against me. Which option would you prefer and would offer the most to the game?