MAFIA 67 OFFICIAL GAME THREAD —//—//— CURSE OF THE AZURE BONDS [hidden]

[ghug]

Why don't you ever vote, celaph?

Catching up at the moment. I meant to vote you last night though something came up and I forgot about it when I went to bed. Still leaning there at the moment, but I'm going to catch-up first.

I'm really bothered by how the Chaqa wagon took place. It feels like you were relatively happy to see Chaqa go even if he was town which means you're either scum or town playing in an anti-town fashion.

Yeah that's a (imo the only) fair reason to be suspicious of me. Perplexity wasn't happening, I wasn't taken with the damo wagon, I sought some excitement, and I'm firmly on the record that Chaqa dying is good for town regardless of his role.

[celaph]

I think that we can almost guarantee one of HR's scumreads was right. Why? well...

He's the poisoner, and I think it very unlikely that he held, so why was there no death?

1. JOAT healed someone.
Why would any JOAT do this? Only JOAT!Damo protecting himself could cause this. (and the HR hits damo; also unlikely)

2. HR hit the mound.
This makes perfect sense. He targeted a scumread and stuck gold. Only to be killed and have the poison nullified.

TL;DR I think the Mound is within HR's scumreads

For one, I don't think it's entirely unreasonble for HR to hold N1. If he's one of the strongest advocates for ghug or Damo's deaths and they die D2 he has soft outed himself.

Secondly, why are you discounting JOAT Damo self-heal? If you assume that Damo's telling the truth, then self-healing was a very reasonable action there as he's target for scum.

[celaph]

It strikes me as rather awful, if you are the JOAT, and we’re set to lose or have neutralized a second of three PRs on D2, that you are PR fishing.

+1

On one hand, it sounds like a terrible idea to be killing an unCC'd PR. Why would scum be afraid of HR being cop when it would be impossible for cop HR to have scanned Damo already? Then again, it bothers me how scummy Damo feels atm.

The thing you're missing is cop!HR would've immediately known damo was full of shit because the cop knows who the JOAT is. I thought HR was the cop with how ballsy he was about staying on damo during EOD1.

Awwww, thanks. Missed this. Appeal of Damo kill growing.

[celaph]

Alternatively, ill ask you the counter-point

Do you think its more likely that Scum Ghug tries to out himself the way he did to save teammate damo? Or that he was trying to gently push a wagon on Chaqa in the hopes that Damo could stay hidden?

Maybe I have too high of an estimate of Ghug. But I dont think he started that wagon on Chaqa randomly for the sake of it.

I don't credit ghug with starting the Chaqa wagon at all. He voiced approval in it happening, but really Demon and then damo started it and ghug then tied it between damo and Chaqa, making it viable for other people to stumble onto.

In my head, who strongly thinks damo is scum, my gut is ghug made his move to try to shift the wagon onto Chaqa to save damo before shit hit the fan.

Do you think the Chaqa wagon happens if not for ghug? I feel like his call for interest in a speedwagon got it going.

[gimix]

I'm firmly on the record that Chaqa dying is good for town regardless of his role.

Now, why on earth?

[ghug]

I'm firmly on the record that Chaqa dying is good for town regardless of his role.

Now, why on earth?

Because Chaqa plays 95% of games like he did this one: not trying. The other 5%, he puts in a bunch of effort, they usually come after he's finally been called on his BS, and everyone thinks he's turned a corner and townreads him. He's invariably scum in those games.

[gimix]

I'm not going to change my vote, for now at least, but why, why does worcej sound increasingly scum to me?
Do not ask me to explain, it's just a feeling, but it's getting stronger

[ghug]

I'm not going to change my vote, for now at least, but why, why does worcej sound increasingly scum to me?
Do not ask me to explain, it's just a feeling, but it's getting stronger

That's just the effect he has on people.

You should change your vote though.

[celaph]

I'm not sure if worcej is misguided well intentioned town or crafty scum but as you will have read I'm increasingly coming round to the fact he is scum. Demon I just don't get.

Haven't a clue about lfischl but he wouldn't be on my vote list (apart from self pres ofc).

Why are you reaching that conclusion?.

To me, he's clearly trying and displaying his thought process, which are both things that lead me to lean town on him.

If damo is the sniper guy, this post comes off terribly to me.

I assume you think that ghug is signalling, but I'm not sure what you think he's actually signalling. To kill you for being town? That you're fellow scum?

[celaph]

To be explain this even better:

If I was scum and damo was town, I would've never left it to chance to have damo scan or track, regardless of the odds of success for damo. It wouldn't be worth the risk when you can 100% ensure he doesn't scan or track and can still waste a heal.

He would've been jailed and the same level of suspicion would exist by other players on if he was telling the truth or not or is scum.

I don't think it's fair to say that Damo would have the same suspicion if he was jailed. It would probably be similar, but I think it would be slightly less. If he's JOAT they have to take a risk to leave him unjailed and taking that risk comes with increased suspicion on him.

[celaph]

Until I actually see a mafia team pass up a free roleblock on a power role just to meme on town I'm not going to give that idea credit. If this is the game that happened then good for them. I don't think it is. ##END

This happened literally last game.

As a scum team we were thinking that the WW might take care of darg in which case he wasn't worth a kill. Also, 3 of us had just hard bussed demon and weren't likely cop targets.

[gimix]

Just so everybody knows.
* I'm vanilla town, I believe that is obvious
* The sheer volume of posting is too much for me, so not only this is my first game but it will probably be the last one - I simply cannot devote so much time - and so btw I don't care being killed, on the contrary it would come as a blessing
* Hence I'm totally sincere. I still think Damo is probably scum, but the risk of miskilling the healer is too high; I believe ghug is scum, and I strongly suspect worcej and perp.

[celaph]

And to be crystal clear - they thought darg was going to DIE that phase, which he should've died if HB didn't play badly at the 3rd party role.

Nah, I think it was fine for HB to not kill Darg there. Mafia are a bigger late game threat to WW than town and so having cop around isn't bad. That said, he probably should have killed Darg towards the end for DK immunity.

[ghug]

Until I actually see a mafia team pass up a free roleblock on a power role just to meme on town I'm not going to give that idea credit. If this is the game that happened then good for them. I don't think it is. ##END

This happened literally last game.

As a scum team we were thinking that the WW might take care of darg in which case he wasn't worth a kill. Also, 3 of us had just hard bussed demon and weren't likely cop targets.

Hmm, I hadn't considered the second point.

[ghug]

Just so everybody knows.
* I'm vanilla town, I believe that is obvious
* The sheer volume of posting is too much for me, so not only this is my first game but it will probably be the last one - I simply cannot devote so much time - and so btw I don't care being killed, on the contrary it would come as a blessing
* Hence I'm totally sincere. I still think Damo is probably scum, but the risk of miskilling the healer is too high; I believe ghug is scum, and I strongly suspect worcej and perp.

Aww, sorry it's not for you. Thanks for giving it a try.

You should vote for perp.

[ghug]

And to be crystal clear - they thought darg was going to DIE that phase, which he should've died if HB didn't play badly at the 3rd party role.

Nah, I think it was fine for HB to not kill Darg there. Mafia are a bigger late game threat to WW than town and so having cop around isn't bad. That said, he probably should have killed Darg towards the end for DK immunity.

And town shouldn't have killed him when he was clearly targeting scum.

And everyone should have killed you when I said "if I die kill celaph".

C'est la vie.

[DemonRHK]

And to be crystal clear - they thought darg was going to DIE that phase, which he should've died if HB didn't play badly at the 3rd party role.

Nah, I think it was fine for HB to not kill Darg there. Mafia are a bigger late game threat to WW than town and so having cop around isn't bad. That said, he probably should have killed Darg towards the end for DK immunity.

And town shouldn't have killed him when he was clearly targeting scum.

And everyone should have killed you when I said "if I die kill celaph".

C'est la vie.

Damo & ghug are scum

Game solved, see ya next time.

[worcej]

Alternatively, ill ask you the counter-point

Do you think its more likely that Scum Ghug tries to out himself the way he did to save teammate damo? Or that he was trying to gently push a wagon on Chaqa in the hopes that Damo could stay hidden?

Maybe I have too high of an estimate of Ghug. But I dont think he started that wagon on Chaqa randomly for the sake of it.

I don't credit ghug with starting the Chaqa wagon at all. He voiced approval in it happening, but really Demon and then damo started it and ghug then tied it between damo and Chaqa, making it viable for other people to stumble onto.

In my head, who strongly thinks damo is scum, my gut is ghug made his move to try to shift the wagon onto Chaqa to save damo before shit hit the fan.

Do you think the Chaqa wagon happens if not for ghug? I feel like his call for interest in a speedwagon got it going.

Eh, saying some one should die doesn’t feel like starting a wagon to me.

The people who actually vote it does.

Also - ghug wanting Chaqa dead is NAI, just like it is if he voted to kill me.

[celaph]

This is frustratingly stupid.

Wagons are Town v (I think) Town

Could we please try and dk a scumbo?

Worcej Preplex Demon

Any one of these will do. Maybe even emc.

Anybody want to help an old JOAT?

I'd happily kill anyone in that group other than worcej.

The thing I don't understand is why no one has CC'd Damo if we are voting. Also, when are you gonna reveal what action you did. Why wouldn't you do it N1 in case you died

Why would someone CC if Damo is going to die anyway? If you assume that Damo is scum then actual JOAT is happy with Damo being top wagon and doesn't cc. And if you assume that Damo is actual JOAT then obviously you get no cc. You can't draw something from the lack of cc here.

[worcej]

I'm not going to change my vote, for now at least, but why, why does worcej sound increasingly scum to me?
Do not ask me to explain, it's just a feeling, but it's getting stronger

That's just the effect he has on people.

You should change your vote though.

Cannot argue with the first part. Second part is bad advice.