Mafia 47 - The Sixth Mass Extinction - GAME THREAD [HIDDEN]

[worcej]

[quote=EspressoPatronum post_id=95339 time=<a href="tel:1564616829">1564616829</a> user_id=6868]
[quote=xorxes post_id=95334 time=<a href="tel:1564615293">1564615293</a> user_id=229]
@Espresso, you think worcej is town? Is his reaction here more like misunderstood town or like resigned scum?

He's town
[/quote]

Why do you think he is town?
[/quote]Why do people think I am scum?

[flash2015]

[quote=EspressoPatronum post_id=95339 time=<a href="tel:1564616829">1564616829</a> user_id=6868]
[quote=xorxes post_id=95334 time=<a href="tel:1564615293">1564615293</a> user_id=229]
@Espresso, you think worcej is town? Is his reaction here more like misunderstood town or like resigned scum?

He's town

Why do you think he is town?
[/quote]Why do people think I am scum?
[/quote]

I am going off the Oracle exchange currently.

[worcej]

Abandoning the quote for now.

@flash - So you scum me because I am hesitant to believe Jamie and I am willing to throw it away? Or because you think I set Jamie up to waste it?

@xorxes - Sorry xorxes, but if I just throw mechanics out then lets just not care about the Human. Indeed, at mylo lets just ignore it and no lynch to lylo

The problem I have is just abandoning mechanics in this setup would be foolish. This is where we catch the scum who got PR roles. Mechanics are important, just like reads are.

I think Jamie is playing with more purpose than he normally does. Normally he tunnels and pushes, but do you feel like he is pushing?

Did I not also bring up flash/food? Notice how they both seem to have life again now. Do you find that interesting at all?

[bo_sox48]

I acknowledge that worcej could be bussing, but is he wrong? I've yet to see anyone demonstrate how he could be wrong and yet all the attention has been shoveled his way. And, for what it's worth, I don't have any way of demonstrating how he's wrong myself if that implication was not strong enough.

[xorxes]

@xorxes - Sorry xorxes, but if I just throw mechanics out then lets just not care about the Human. Indeed, at mylo lets just ignore it and no lynch to lylo

Don't throw it out, just don't make it the only thing you talk about.

The problem I have is just abandoning mechanics in this setup would be foolish. This is where we catch the scum who got PR roles. Mechanics are important, just like reads are.

And yet you want to lynch Jamiet, which, if we go by mechanics only, is about the worst possible choice today (besides the clears and myself).

I think Jamie is playing with more purpose than he normally does. Normally he tunnels and pushes, but do you feel like he is pushing?

No, I'm pretty sure he is scum. Who do you think are his teammates? Do you seriously think I could be his teammate? How do you explain my saving the Doc and the Cop D2, what did I gain by doing that as scum, considering that if I'm scum I was practically guaranteed not to make it to the endgame?

Did I not also bring up flash/food? Notice how they both seem to have life again now. Do you find that interesting at all?

Maybe. Do you think they are trying to save Jamiet? Because Jamiet doesn't need saving today, he is well protected for the day by the Oracle claim.

Who do you think Chaqa's cow target might have been?

[Jamiet99uk]

Either Xorxes or Worcej is definitely town, and the other must surely be scum.

If I'm still alive tonight, I will *not* declare my new target, thus forcing scum to take a huge risk if they NK me. I will then reveal my target when day starts.

Also, tomorrow is D7. Xorxes MUST use the Inno child reveal early on D7. Don't let him come up with any sneaky last minute reason not to confirm his role.

I'm about to go into surgery and this will be my last post for several hours (Worcej is friends with me on Facebook and can confirm I am not faking this).

My scum pool is Xorxes/Worcej, Espresso, Bozo, Flash.

Foodcoats and Bo_Sox seem town to me and Foxcastle/Hosuke are clear.

[Jamiet99uk]

I acknowledge that worcej could be bussing, but is he wrong? I've yet to see anyone demonstrate how he could be wrong and yet all the attention has been shoveled his way. And, for what it's worth, I don't have any way of demonstrating how he's wrong myself if that implication was not strong enough.

Wrong about what? Me? Definitely.

[bo_sox48]

Well I sure would hope you'd say so, Jamie.

[bo_sox48]

I'm going to park on ##VOTE Espresso given that that's the right play here in my opinion, but I'm not closedminded to a Jamie lynch. It does make sense.

[EspressoPatronum]

@Espresso, you think worcej is town? Is his reaction here more like misunderstood town or like resigned scum?

He's town

Why do you think he is town?

Read my posts plz

[EspressoPatronum]

@Jamiet why are you townreading foodcoats?

Plz respond to my annotated foodcoats ISO and tell me why you think he isn't scummy from that.

[EspressoPatronum]

I'm going to park on ##VOTE Espresso given that that's the right play here in my opinion, but I'm not closedminded to a Jamie lynch. It does make sense.

I would join you on Jamie.

What's your read on foodcoats?

[EspressoPatronum]

He's town

Why do you think he is town?

Read my posts plz

But I'll synthesize anyway:
1. He made the Chaqa lynch happen,
2. Darg's ISO makes worcej look better as town
3. I think scum is pushing him
4. He was wrong in the EP/darg vote. I imagine scum!worcej would have followed suit.
5. Lastly, by process of elimination. Other people like food, Jamie, bo_sox are way scummier.

[bo_sox48]

I'm going to park on ##VOTE Espresso given that that's the right play here in my opinion, but I'm not closedminded to a Jamie lynch. It does make sense.

I would join you on Jamie.

What's your read on foodcoats?

I scumread him earlier. I don't suppose it's changed. By process of elimination alone, he could easily be your teammate, and your new buzzing sense of passion for taking him down that you have developed out of nowhere today certainly makes sense if you're teammates. All that said, I'm not very involved in this game right now given the vast majority of my time online the past week or more has been put into development work.

[Jamiet99uk]

@Jamiet why are you townreading foodcoats?

Plz respond to my annotated foodcoats ISO and tell me why you think he isn't scummy from that.

I am out of surgery and am still alive. Indeed it all went according to plan.

I have not played much with Foodcoats, he's pretty new, so I don't know if he has a town or scum meta, but he seems towny to me based on his attempts to look into people's motivations, and his general attitude.

I will respond to your iso post, give me a moment.

[ItsHosuke]

@Jamiet why are you townreading foodcoats?

Plz respond to my annotated foodcoats ISO and tell me why you think he isn't scummy from that.

I am out of surgery and am still alive. Indeed it all went according to plan.

I have not played much with Foodcoats, he's pretty new, so I don't know if he has a town or scum meta, but he seems towny to me based on his attempts to look into people's motivations, and his general attitude.

I will respond to your iso post, give me a moment.

Great to hear you're out of surgery! Hope all is well. I'll try to play catch-up

[Jamiet99uk]

N1 - Vecna death
- says there's one scum in Jamie, bozo, Percy, Vapor [note - the last 2 are dead]

Bozo could still be scum. I'm not but I understand why people might have me as a scumlean.

D2 - EMC lynch
- says we should follow Vecna's reads. [note - they're all dead now]

And? How is that evidence that Food is scum?

N2 - rdrivera death
- apologizes for tunneling EMC [note - he wasn't on the EMC wagon D2!!]

He was talking about tunnelling him D1, I presume. Changing your reads as the game progresses is NOT scum indicative. It's having fixed, unchanging reads that can be a scumtell.

D3 - Vapor lynch
- "xorxes' claim really bothers me." Votes xorxes
- [u[Tries to lowkey discredit the masons: "So what exactly did Fox and Hosuke's posts prove? "[/u]
- his 4 scumreads for bozo's list: Chaqa, bo_sox, worcej, xorxes [note - notice how Chaqa is first? He wants us to see Chaqa as a scumlean. He's voting for xorxes at this point btw]
- Defends me against Jamie's janitor theory: "...EP thought there were only 5 roles for 5 scum. Therefore the janitor would always be in play."
- calls me a "Smokelord, Master of Deduction"
- votes for EP
- goes BACK to voting xorxes
- says he likes bozo's list and we should follow it.
- votes for bo_sox [note - bo_sox was not the top of the list. Foodcoats isn't following the list]
- Votes for me because he doesn't want to waste a vote
- Says he doesn't like the Vapor wagon
- says a bunch of words that shows he doesn't understand the power of a smokescreen [hint: I don't think any of the scum understood it... that's why they all screwed it up]

There's no rule that says you must only vote your top scumread. If he felt Xorxes or Bo_Sox were more viable wagons (and Xorxes might have been as I was calling for a Xorxes lynch too), it's perfectly legitimate to vote for them.

You've attacked me for my response to the smokescreen, and I am town, so I can't see the last point as scum indicative.

D4 - Chaqla lynch
- says we need to lynch EP and darg [note - this is his FIRST post of the day]
- votes for me instead of darg
- claims naked mole rat, VT
- votes for Chaqa "I don't agree with lynching Chaqa, that's a weird backwards bir

So what if it's his first post? Your point being...?

D5 - darg lynch
- Votes for darg. Says he'll read over the CCs.
- "Maybe I'm wrong on this. ##VOTE EspressoPatronum" [Note - this is so hedgy is sickening]
- Says we lynch both bcz SvS
- shades the DP smokescreen theory
- asks Percy why he keeps voting bozo
- "bo you asked earlier why I switched to EP for no reason... I wanted to balance it and see if anyone would swing the wagons. Instead we got a pretty good dog pile." [this does not appear consistent with his play earlier in the day. I think he's backtracking bcz ppl didn't side against me]

This is the strongest part of your case. You're right that his comments around his vote on you look very hedgy.

N5 - Percy death
- Sets up an obvious trap question... "So the only conceivable reason for EP to be town is that it was a misplay by scum.So... how are Chaqa and dargorygel reckoned as players." [note - if you answer yes, you're essentially calling Chaqa and Darg bad players.

I don't see that as a trap. He makes an assumption, but because he states his assumption clearly, anyone with a different view could challenge the assumption and still answer the question. Plus, let's be totally honest, Dargorygel's play this game does look fairly incompetent (sorry Darg).

So in summary I think that apart from the hedgy vote on you, your observations don't add up to much. In particular several of your blue highlighted comments just point out some random thing without offering any detailed analysis or exclaiming why you chose to highlight that specific thing.

I'm not convinced.

[EspressoPatronum]

@Jamie thanks for the comments. I suppose it's better as a summary with annotations than a full case. My comments were meant to provide context for information (in case ppl forgot) and to point out his scumminess when I saw it.

Having now read a summary of his ISO, is there anything that jumped out to you independent of my comments?


Unrelated note - good to hear all went well in surgery!

[EspressoPatronum]

I'm going to park on ##VOTE Espresso given that that's the right play here in my opinion, but I'm not closedminded to a Jamie lynch. It does make sense.

I would join you on Jamie.

What's your read on foodcoats?

I scumread him earlier. I don't suppose it's changed. By process of elimination alone, he could easily be your teammate, and your new buzzing sense of passion for taking him down that you have developed out of nowhere today certainly makes sense if you're teammates. All that said, I'm not very involved in this game right now given the vast majority of my time online the past week or more has been put into development work.

My new buzzing sense of passion is me seeing a way I can live in a way that doesn't necessarily cripple the town. When the SvS theory was in full force, I assumed I would be a mylo liability and therefore would probably have to die regardless of what I did. I'm seeing that the way out is to just double down on scum hunting and going from there.

It's inaccurate to say my foodcoats scumread came out of nowhere. He's been in my list ever since I made me DP smokescreen theory. I haven't pushed him bcz he hasn't been a priority until today.

If you scumread him but also scumread me, just assume I'm bussing and join me on foodcoats. Keep that assumption going until we lynch the rest of the scum team.

[foodcoats]

The problem I have is just abandoning mechanics in this setup would be foolish. This is where we catch the scum who got PR roles. Mechanics are important, just like reads are.

And yet you want to lynch Jamiet, which, if we go by mechanics only, is about the worst possible choice today (besides the clears and myself).

I was about to ask why Jamie is the worst choice mechanically, but then remembered Jamie's alleged Oracle target is Percy.

Considering worcej has been flipping his times tables and mathlording the last few days, it is a little odd. This seems to make it more likely that worcej is scum and that Jamie is the Oracle. Now is the opportune time to dispense with Oracle!Jamie.