Mafia 47 - The Sixth Mass Extinction - GAME THREAD [HIDDEN]

[bozotheclown]

Are you reading what I said? Quit asking dumb questions. I am not trying to hurt town by clearing myself. Between the potential of getting scum and the information we gain, lynches are more important to the town than clearing me. I don't even know why I'm explaining this to you.

My crumb was straight to rdrivera. Did you miss that too?



That doesn't sound like me saying bulletproof to me.

I disagree, I think a D1 no lynch for a town clear is a good trade. It certainly would be helpful if you were clear, and not clearing yourself when you had the chance looks suspicious to me.

Were you crumbing a more important role so that rdrivera would not shoot you?

Find the one where I said I scumread rdrivera, and then go reread day 1 and see how I scumread him for his claim and the actions he took from then on. If you're actually openminded and not just leading me down a rabbit hole where you'll say "I disagree" and then dismiss everything I say, at the very least I think you can find it in your heart to see where I'm coming from.

After the vig shot, did you consider asking to be lynched to clear yourself? You said you could have crumbed harder, what were you crumbing?

I was going to ask about that too. Which roles did you crumb?

I didn’t crumb any roles in particular with that post, but I can name at least 7 that the mafia team should have recognized as a possibility from my crumb. There was no reason to crumb anything in particular when I could simply heighten their suspicions. They know I’m town.

Sorry, but that response was not clear to me either. My question was if the crumb you pointed out was intended to keep rdrivera from shooting you if he was the vig.

[bozotheclown]

So worcej now claims he was softing oracle to protect town PRs and draw the NK, but D3 he acknowledged that softing oracle would make scum less likely to vote for him when he claimed he scum read bo_sox for switching his vote to Vapor as a result of him softing oracle.

I would be willing to lynch worcej today.

##VOTE worcej

....

I cannot fix stupid.

Is that your best defense of your contradiction?

[bozotheclown]

So worcej now claims he was softing oracle to protect town PRs and draw the NK, but D3 he acknowledged that softing oracle would make scum less likely to vote for him when he claimed he scum read bo_sox for switching his vote to Vapor as a result of him softing oracle.

I would be willing to lynch worcej today.

##VOTE worcej

That's an interesting point. I haven't actually looked at the "soft claim" but I agree that any hinting that someone is Oracle would theoretically put scum off if they noticed it, because the Oracle either clears a town or confirms a scum. So claiming Oracle makes that player pretty unlikely to be NK'd, regardless of their reads. So... it is the complete opposite of protecting the other PRs, because it is one less NK target scum has to consider. (And if the Oracle takes the hit, they also potentially publically reveal a PR.)

That said, why would we lynch worcej over darg/EP? If we follow the Worcej Doctrine (i.e. math), the odds are much higher of catching scum by focusing on the tracker claimants than on any unclears.

The trackers can wait a day to see what Percy reports, I am more confident worcej is scum than either dargorygel or Espresso individually.

[worcej]

This is the post that should have set off all kinds of alarm bells for you. I had worcej as the Oracle from then on until you claimed it:

**sigh**

Because I have been intentionally softing that I don't care about my death to reaction test people. His jump to vapor seemed to fall into that 'oh shit' response.

And to be crystal clear: I am not claiming anything.

But that isn't a softclaim in itself. It's a post in which he claims to have made softed at a prior time.

@Worcej: Can you actually clarify this for us? Where and how did you soft that you were the Oracle? On what pages, using what words?

There was never an actual claim to be Oracle. It was in these posts I tried to make it clear that I didn't care about dying:

I'm willing to look at Espresso, but Worcej's little performance last night left me thinking ##VOTE WORCEJ is right.

It’s not, but okay. We have a few mislynchs to give so I just hope your ability to analyze improved from last game.

OK let's stir this up

##vote worcej

Now you are making more sense to me.

I welcome the wagon on me and will respond to any and all questions.

Know that I am town and you are making a mistake by pushing me now.

And I could say a similar thing

you're fake as shit in what you've done since this game began.

Your cries about flip is worse than my own moment, at least I warned people to skip it, you're using it to beg people to unvote you

Am I crying about me flipping? Are you so sure about that?

The point of these posts were to catch someone reacting to me not caring about my death. What role doesn't care about dying? The Oracle. Who reacted? Really only Bo - bet you can't guess what I think he is?

I guess I should issue a correction and state I mis-spoke saying I wanted to draw the NK when I wanted to actually see people who would bail on lynching me. The protecting the PRs was in fact to try to draw a lynch, which is kinda true with how I bashed at Fox.

But go ahead and scum me and say I am lying and am caught. No one bothered, other than myself, that xorxes also wanted to keep Chaqa alive to protect Tom (because that made sense right?) but I guess only I can be subject to immediate scumness for making a mistake.

So go ahead, spin this around your little finger as much as you would like scum!xorxes. And yes Bo, I am not implying to ever lynch xorxes until D7, as I have already stated in the quote you decided to omit that portion of.

Bozo looks like a F'ing retard deciding to lynch me now when there is a scum in EP/Darg. Yeah, let's go ahead and lynch the only fucker that pushed with a passion for people to take care of Chaqa. Did anyone notice how bozo pretty much pushed softly at Chaqa but never tried to push it nearly like how I did?

You all are welcome for Chaqa. I take credit for that lynch. And some of you idiots think scum!me would just torpedo the scum deep threat that had little support until near the end? Okay, great. I've busted my ass off this game to try to keep us in it and you're rewarding me with garbage.

After all of this, if you STILL scum me, go ahead and just lynch me then. I literally spelled out how to possibly get one, possibly 2, scum in the next 3 days and you have people like bozo going down another dumb path of retardation and distraction, just like xorxes is doing once again.

@Everyone Left: Once again, this is the town's game plan - or how it should be if you're town and not some scumtard trying to poke your WIFOM theories into it:

D5 (now): EP/Darg. One is scum for sure.
N5: A clear or Percy dies. Percy should submit a scan on either bozo/Jamie/food/flash/Bo_/myself - this will matter for D6. Not sure why xorxes wants to wait to say this, but it's pretty fucking obvious where the scum are hiding among...
D6: If we got EP/Darg wrong, lynch the other. If Percy is alive and we got D5 right, listen to his claim. If he guilts a person, lynch them. If a town dies, then you got Percy dead-to-rights for D7 or D8, depending on Xorxes. If he towns a person, lynch Percy to confirm the town claim. This will generate a town clear based on the Percy flip.
N6: Another clear dies. Or scum gift us something out of pity because ~reasons~.
D7: Xorxes is the only lynch target until he activates his role - then he is a clear. If he doesn't activate, don't listen to his bullshit as to why. Just lynch his ass.
N8: If Xorxes is scum, we are out of clears and now one of the above list of players un-confirmed will die. Otherwise, xorxes gets to depart probably at the latest point he ever has as town.

Please try to spin the above several phase proceedings as "scum!worcej is just trying to live!" or "scum!worcej is just trying to waste Percy's scan!" - I'd enjoy picking apart your idiocy.

I am the towniest person here because I am playing as a team (meaning understanding we may lynch a town player for the greater good once) to beat an organized team while the rest of you are stuck as individuals not trying to coordinate for the win.

P.S.

The trackers can wait a day to see what Percy reports, I am more confident worcej is scum than either dargorygel or Espresso individually.

Again, I cannot fix stupid, especially this level of scum!stupid. Using Percy to possibly confirm one of darg/EP would waste a potential clear chance and if Percy is scum, we'd be running out of mis-lynches and you would just have to trust him. My plan, as outlined, would result in not mylo (unless both EP and Darg are town, which we know isn't true...)

[worcej]

So worcej now claims he was softing oracle to protect town PRs and draw the NK, but D3 he acknowledged that softing oracle would make scum less likely to vote for him when he claimed he scum read bo_sox for switching his vote to Vapor as a result of him softing oracle.

I would be willing to lynch worcej today.

##VOTE worcej

....

I cannot fix stupid.

Is that your best defense of your contradiction?

No, go read my wall.

But seriously, if you're town, you are LVP with your ideas so far this game.

[worcej]

Tldr:
We waste the info a scan could give us and don't prove I'm the Stick bug if I scan the other tracker claim.

How you work your claim is how I addressed in my wall. You need to scan a non-verifiable claim, meaning ignore Darg, EP, and xorxes (and obviously Fox and Hosuke). Darg and EP should be verified pretty much now, unless your a fool and want to lynch someone not EP or Darg...

Anyways...

You should target Jamie, Food, bozo, Bo_, flash, or myself. Anyone telling you otherwise is a fool. If you do otherwise, you're wasting the scan. It may take the town lynching you to verify your town result from the scan, but that adds to a clear once we confirm you. Or, if we get Darg/EP right and you hit a scum via scan, we nail that scum to the cross and parade him down the streets.

[EspressoPatronum]

[...]
Jamiet is hard to read because he's unpredictable. Going from my memory of the thread, his reads feel all over the place and he's being active. He's in my scum list because of the weird DP thing, his obsession with EP! janitor, and the potential for multiple crumbs.

Jamiet was very certain that you were scum at some point. What do you make of him voting for dargo now? And you were certain that he was the RoleThief.

Jamiet was certain I was scum before the CC shenanigans. After dargo's CC with a story that doesn't match him being the real tracker, I'd be more surprised if Jamiet thought I was scum.

Small correction - I did not express certainty in PT!Jamiet. I said I think he's scum, and if he's scum, I think he's the powerthief. I don't express certainty in my reads unless I am close to 100% sure. All of my powerthief discussion was raising red flags for PT!Jamiet, but I can't know for sure.

[bo_sox48]

Unless he is scum with one of them.

Why one? Is a worcej-bo-EP team not on the table?

Nothing is off the table, but scum!worcej implies Oracle is probably a fake role, which implies Jamiet is scum, so there's no room for you there.

That is an interesting thought.

[EspressoPatronum]

I didn’t crumb any roles in particular with that post, but I can name at least 7 that the mafia team should have recognized as a possibility from my crumb. There was no reason to crumb anything in particular when I could simply heighten their suspicions. They know I’m town.

I currently do believe you're town, mostly because I have a full quota already with dargo/Espresso/worcej/Jamiet.

Assume for a moment that I'm town. Who's next?

dargo has practically given up, I don't see town!dargo throwing the game like that.

He's even succeeded, too. Losing a CC but still getting the other claimant lynched after getting flipped is a small win for scum.

But yeah, he's fully checked out at this point.

Espresso is making some effort and that's why I prefer lynching dargo over him, but there are too many pointers to Tracker being a fake role.

I'll take what I can get.

worcej and Jamiet are doing nothing to convince me that I'm wrong about the Oracle thing.

Fair point. Worcej's combativeness isn't helping either.

[bo_sox48]

So worcej now claims he was softing oracle to protect town PRs and draw the NK, but D3 he acknowledged that softing oracle would make scum less likely to vote for him when he claimed he scum read bo_sox for switching his vote to Vapor as a result of him softing oracle.

I would be willing to lynch worcej today.

##VOTE worcej

....

I cannot fix stupid.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

[bo_sox48]

To be perfectly clear, I'm throwing shade at bozo. He keeps missing things, so I'm not sure if he'll catch it if I don't just come out and say it.

[ItsHosuke]

##vote dargorygel

I find him most scummy out of worcej/ep/him

[bo_sox48]

Worcej is not on the table today.

[ItsHosuke]

Worcej is not on the table today.

Exactly

[EspressoPatronum]

I had worcej as pretty likely town before the Oracle stuff. Maybe I'm just misremembering the day, but I honestly don't think Chaqa was going to die without worcej.

Chaqa was the cow. Bussing the cow made perfect sense if worcej thought he could get the cow's target to join him.

Worcej alluded to this in his push against Chaqa, but I'll lay it out here.

First, the strength of the cow is that mafia know who the diseased target it and town does not. Second, a late-game cow can suddenly end the game (this is what worcej and others discussed). For this reason, the cow is a perfect deep threat IF their diseased target is widely townread.

Scum will never kill the diseased target because it's a free kill. After X number of mislynches, town no longer has the ability to selectively join the wagon or else scum can overpower them. So everyone gets on the cow wagon + the diseased target dies.

I think scum knew this and Chaqa was playing for the late game. I can't see scum!worcej throwing this all away for a few days worth of town cred. As I said earlier, worcej was pretty hard town for me after the Chaqa flip. The oracle stuff is weird, but I'm willing to forgive that for now considering he helped avert the Chaqa crisis.


@xorxes, you also stated somewhere that Chaqa was doomed to die eventually because he claimed lover. Town!lover Chaqa doesn't die without worcej's push, as scum will never kill Chaqa bcz they get a free kill when they hit the lover. Look back at yesterday - most of the people on Chaqa's wagon (myself included) expressed our town read of Chaqa while we followed the lynch. Chaqa was a lategame threat thwarted by his lover claim.

[EspressoPatronum]

...
Xorxes did not visit anyone on N2.
1. Assuming ant & knowing that hooker visited Vapor, xorxes is 50% less likely to be maf.
2. Assuming no ant & knowing that hooker visit Vapor, xorxes is 40% less likely to be maf.(note 1)


Bozotheclown did not visit anyone N3. (note 2)
1. Assuming ant & knowing hooker did not visit, bozo is 25% less likely to be maf.
2. Assuming no ant & knowing hooker did not visit, bozo is 20% less likely to be maf.(note 3)
...
[EP's edit - corrected inaccurate assumption %s + updated %s post-Chaqa]

FYI - we can update the numbers as more scum flip.

Updated to reflect our knowledge that Chaqa was one of the scum who did not act at night in a scum ant + hooker team. If no ant, Chaqa could have been the one to carry out the kill.


__________
(note 1) - If no ant, Chaqa could have been the one to carry out the kill.
(note 2) - Bozo's numbers are reflective of my informed knowledge. For those of you who do not believe my claim +/ believe darg's roleblock claim, treat bozo's numbers as those of xorxes until you have confirmation.
(note 3) - same as above.

[EspressoPatronum]

Note 3 should read, "same as note 1"* rather than "same as above."

[TrPrado]

Vote Count 5.2

dargorygel (5): xorxes, EspressoPatronum, flash2015, Jamiet99uk, ItsHosuke
EspressoPatronum (4): worcej, dargorygel, foodcoats, Percy Williams
worcej (1): bozotheclown

The following players still need to cast a valid vote: bo_sox48, Foxcastle
The following player still needs to meet the post count: Foxcastle

DARGORYGEL is currently bound for extinction

11 hours and 58 minutes remain in the day

[Jamiet99uk]

Come on Foxcastle where have you gone?

[Jamiet99uk]

@Percy: Scan me if you like, but I warn you it's likely to lead to Xorxes hard scumreading you when you clear me.