M1007 — "Mafia, She Wrote" Game Thread

[teacon7]

My end of day actions were incredibly normal actually. If you think about the fact that they come from a towns perspective. I have no idea who scum is. I didn't think it was damo, and thought xorx's reason for voting him was weird. If I had known it was damo, there is NO WAY I would have been so blatant and edgy because I would know that xorx has a good record in getting the lynches he wants.

Let's entertain that idea. Why were you calling for movement at the end there? In what ways is motion at EoD good? You think calling for activity at EoD helps town how? Doesn't that just create panic and chaos?

Teacon you need to point to actual scummy shit.

Cool. Here's one: VVVVVVVV

Wanting another wagon because I was scared of a lack of movement is actually a pretty townie thing for me to do.

why was a lack of motion bad for town? consolidation is one thing. creating new wagons is another.

Lynching damo for cred is what I would have done if I was scum.

So just for clarification, and you heard it from durga, it's in the realm of possibility that: A scumteam would bus (vote+lynch) it's godfather D1 for towncred"

[ND]

Like I don't get it. You had time but instead you are trying to get someone else to start a Percy wagon. Like, you say all this is normal????? But I don't think so.

can you at least acknowledge that xorxes is smarter than you and you should just sheep him on this

Is that what u are doing.. sheeping xorxes? Lol, xorxes is good but I am a free thinker Durga

[VashtaNeurotic]

Vash is busy being confused by this day. Like, can someone lay out the teacon case for me as the one on Durga is very well...simple. EoD looks bad, was always on ND, etc.... Meanwhile the teacon on relies on believing he would set it up so he'd have to vote damo over ND in a game where the most important thing for scum is to just avoid getting lynched (since town only has 3 mislynches and there are only 3 mafia). But I'm not sure what the rest of the evidence is because I am mostly skimming posts and trying to absorb all the content from them (as it becomes more an more dense).

[Durga]

It's things like this that make me think that you don't actually scum read me, but you're looking for reasons to scum read me.

The way you're approaching your entire read of me isn't that I said something that was scummy and therefore you think I'm scum (the way town finds scum - the way xorx found damo for example). But you've decided since before the end of day 1 that you were going to scum read me, and now you're trying to find a line of reasoning that will fit into that narrative. That is how scum tries to get people mislynched.

That's the exact opposite of how I read you. I found these actions scummy in themselves:
a) pushing for an 3rd alternate wagon at EoD
b) pushing for an 3rd alternate wagon at EoD instead of calling for consolidation onto one of the main ones
c) pushing for an 3rd alternate wagon at EoD instead of calling for people to join the one you were on
d) Claiming that you wouldn't "move alone," because there was "no point."


The following actions look scummy in light of damo's flip:
e) pushing for an 3rd alternate wagon at EoD on Percy - who was the next highest wagon.
f) not leaving ND for percy when you asked about it (doing so would break a tie and put damo in the lead. Why not vote damo instead?).
g) disappearing d2 to let pressure and attention dissapate

The following actions look scummy in connection with xorx:
h) trying to hand xorx sole towncred for the damo lynch
i) disappearing d2 to let pressure and attention dissapate while xorx pushes a case on me
j) if you read the greentext, I think you weren't actually scumreading xorx or trying to push a lynch, you were trying to get his attention.

I pushed a wagon on someone I thought is scummy. I didn't have a good read on damo so why would I vote for him? THAT would actually be a sus thing to do. Why do you even suggest it. I really don't understand why you're stating that me saying there was no point to move to percy alone is scummy. How is it even scummy?

I mean sure, it all "looks bad" because damo ended up being scum. So I was wrong about what the right lynch should be. But reading EoD you would know that I was in the dark and not faking it.

I didn't disappear day 2. I had a wedding to attend yesterday. I stated that. EP can confirm I was at a wedding. I'm here now, I'm not hiding. I'm engaging a lot. I've engaged far more than people like Vash and Moscow. Vash, who also voted for ND but was waaay shadier about it.

Getting xorx's attention is.... what? scummy? how

[Durga]

Vash is busy being confused by this day. Like, can someone lay out the teacon case for me as the one on Durga is very well...simple. EoD looks bad, was always on ND, etc.... Meanwhile the teacon on relies on believing he would set it up so he'd have to vote damo over ND in a game where the most important thing for scum is to just avoid getting lynched (since town only has 3 mislynches and there are only 3 mafia). But I'm not sure what the rest of the evidence is because I am mostly skimming posts and trying to absorb all the content from them (as it becomes more an more dense).

your EoD looks equally as bad and you were also on ND. are you claiming to be scum Vashta?

[Durga]

My end of day actions were incredibly normal actually. If you think about the fact that they come from a towns perspective. I have no idea who scum is. I didn't think it was damo, and thought xorx's reason for voting him was weird. If I had known it was damo, there is NO WAY I would have been so blatant and edgy because I would know that xorx has a good record in getting the lynches he wants.

Let's entertain that idea. Why were you calling for movement at the end there? In what ways is motion at EoD good? You think calling for activity at EoD helps town how? Doesn't that just create panic and chaos?

Teacon you need to point to actual scummy shit.

Cool. Here's one: VVVVVVVV

Wanting another wagon because I was scared of a lack of movement is actually a pretty townie thing for me to do.

why was a lack of motion bad for town? consolidation is one thing. creating new wagons is another.

Lynching damo for cred is what I would have done if I was scum.

So just for clarification, and you heard it from durga, it's in the realm of possibility that: A scumteam would bus (vote+lynch) it's godfather D1 for towncred"

a lack of motion means scum is okay with the lynch options because they're both town!!!!!!!!!!

[teacon7]

I obviously wasn't pushing xorx with that post.

I'm not saying that either.
I'm suggesting that you were trying to get his attention.
Fair point though, this means one less wagon you were trying to start.

You keep taking non scummy shit and pretending it's scummy.

I feel the same way about xorx.

Being wrong isn't scummy,

Agree. This is the towniest thing you've said all game.

and the way I went about EoD isn't how mafia would do so.

That's something of a matter of perspective. How do you think maf would handle an EoD like that?

Especially knowing teacon is scum.

How would you know that? I don't undersstand how this sentence fits in with your train of thought. plz advise.

Why would I make myself look bad like that if I knew xorx was pushing him and he was fucked?

It's D1. You didn't know what he was doing. You perhaps thought he was going to move+consolidate to a different wagon (say, percy?)

"Durga should swing today. Will xorx vote for or interact with durga? Is he okay with that lynch? She did ask to lynch him once. Remember?"
This is insanely blatantly manipulative and scummy. Who says this kind of shit.

I'm scumreading xorx.
I'm scumreading durga.
I want to see the two interact so we can get information from it.
Yeah maybe that's manipulative, but it's pro-town manipulative. xorx hasn't responded to me yet so shhhhhh. I want to see if/how he tries to defend you. He's been strangely silent about your wagon all day, which is strange because you've leading the vote count.

[VashtaNeurotic]

Vash is busy being confused by this day. Like, can someone lay out the teacon case for me as the one on Durga is very well...simple. EoD looks bad, was always on ND, etc.... Meanwhile the teacon on relies on believing he would set it up so he'd have to vote damo over ND in a game where the most important thing for scum is to just avoid getting lynched (since town only has 3 mislynches and there are only 3 mafia). But I'm not sure what the rest of the evidence is because I am mostly skimming posts and trying to absorb all the content from them (as it becomes more an more dense).

your EoD looks equally as bad and you were also on ND. are you claiming to be scum Vashta?

I've already gone over why, yes, my day looks bad, but given I just parked my vote on ND and didn't try to work like hell to save damo or lynch ND when I was there with an hour to go, both things you did, my EoD looks comparatively less bad than yours. Anyway, given your life may very well hinge on it, what's the case against teacon.

[teacon7]

I thought she would come back the last hour of phase. She came back six hours early. I am surprised. Wow. But it changes nothing she is ultra scum.

Stop. Playing. Mafia. If. You're. Never. Willing. To. Change. Your. Shit. Reads. Bye.

Hate to say it ND, but she's right on that count.
Town has to be mentally agile. if we get locked into a tunnel, we lose.

[Durga]

I obviously wasn't pushing xorx with that post.

I'm not saying that either.
I'm suggesting that you were trying to get his attention.
Fair point though, this means one less wagon you were trying to start.

You keep taking non scummy shit and pretending it's scummy.

I feel the same way about xorx.

Being wrong isn't scummy,

Agree. This is the towniest thing you've said all game.

and the way I went about EoD isn't how mafia would do so.

That's something of a matter of perspective. How do you think maf would handle an EoD like that?

Especially knowing teacon is scum.

How would you know that? I don't undersstand how this sentence fits in with your train of thought. plz advise.

Why would I make myself look bad like that if I knew xorx was pushing him and he was fucked?

It's D1. You didn't know what he was doing. You perhaps thought he was going to move+consolidate to a different wagon (say, percy?)

"Durga should swing today. Will xorx vote for or interact with durga? Is he okay with that lynch? She did ask to lynch him once. Remember?"
This is insanely blatantly manipulative and scummy. Who says this kind of shit.

I'm scumreading xorx.
I'm scumreading durga.
I want to see the two interact so we can get information from it.
Yeah maybe that's manipulative, but it's pro-town manipulative. xorx hasn't responded to me yet so shhhhhh. I want to see if/how he tries to defend you. He's been strangely silent about your wagon all day, which is strange because you've leading the vote count.

not teacon, damo. what idiot scum blatantly tries to save their teammate like that. i played EoD the way someone who wants a scum read to get lynched plays it. not someone who knows their teammate is very likely to get lynched.

xorx doesn't really defend people, he pushes his scum reads. that's how he plays.

[Durga]

Vash is busy being confused by this day. Like, can someone lay out the teacon case for me as the one on Durga is very well...simple. EoD looks bad, was always on ND, etc.... Meanwhile the teacon on relies on believing he would set it up so he'd have to vote damo over ND in a game where the most important thing for scum is to just avoid getting lynched (since town only has 3 mislynches and there are only 3 mafia). But I'm not sure what the rest of the evidence is because I am mostly skimming posts and trying to absorb all the content from them (as it becomes more an more dense).

your EoD looks equally as bad and you were also on ND. are you claiming to be scum Vashta?

I've already gone over why, yes, my day looks bad, but given I just parked my vote on ND and didn't try to work like hell to save damo or lynch ND when I was there with an hour to go, both things you did, my EoD looks comparatively less bad than yours. Anyway, given your life may very well hinge on it, what's the case against teacon.

why is parking your vote on ND and being silent after that more townie than what I did? i'd argue against that. it can be likely your teammate was going to die, you saw that, and you decided not to get involved in case he flipped and you'd ultimately look bad.

i also didn't "work like hell to save damo or lynch ND". go back to EoD and find out where I did either and please let me know. how is saying I'd move to percy indicative of working like hell to lynch ND. where did I even push hard for either? i didn't. and why would I do ANY Of that if I knew damo was scum???? i would have known the consequences and how i looked.

teacon is scum because of the way he looks at the game. he picked a target and is trying to make non-scummy actions look scummy. he's not scum reading me because i did something scummy. he's scum reading me and trying to make my actions look like something mafia would do. his conclusion has come before the evidence, and that's the way mafia looks at the game. this is evidenced by the fact that he is trying to create silly narratives where i'm either scum with ND or xorx, where my actions can fall into either category.

also he says weird stuff and is highly manipulative. read his posts if you're town vash.

[Durga]

people have been straight up lying and trying to create this narrative that i was "desperate" or "pushed hard" at EoD1. which is honestly not the case, and i invite everyone to go back and reread it. i definitely tried to create movement, but that is NOT scum indicative. and nor was the way i did it scummy or for the intent of saving damo. if my intention was to save damo i would have pushed ND way harder, my intention was to see someone i scum read get lynched, but i wasn't very sure about either pick

[ND]

I am going to consider some things.

[bozotheclown]

Anyone who was around for EoD and saw the way xorx was pushing damo's lynch should figure out that xorx is town. Also the fact that xorx fixated on the weirdest thing about damo to get him lynched is SO classic town xorx. I've never seen him replicate this kind of behaviour as scum. In fact, xorx has told me that he doesn't play full press diplomacy anymore because he just hates lying and sucks at it. Anyone been in a game with him as scum can easily see that too. No way is he suddenly a mastermind.

You should read M1005 if you think xorxes is incapable of putting in effort or beign deceitful as scum.

[bozotheclown]

I think I would find it less suspicious if Durga said she was voting for teacon for self preservation than starting to find reasons to scum read him.

[bozotheclown]

After Vashta's suspicious D1, he seems OK with not getting involved D2 since he is not at risk of getting lynched. I would prefer to see Vashta lynched over Durga or teacon.

[bozotheclown]

This sounds like what I was doing last game to try to make some town members look suspicious, but with a much smaller sample size. I find it hard to believe that you would really think has any use in identifying scum.

I was hoping someone other than you would notice...

But, when you iso damo, it's really striking how few people he interacted with. Damo plays a very shy scum, so I really would not be surprized if he limited his interactions to his teammates.

On what games are you basing this assessment of damo's scum play?

I don't recall any in particular, but I'm sure I have caught him before.
[/quote]

I checked the three previous games where damo was scum, and I am sure that you have not caught him before.

[bozotheclown]

I'm all for lynching Percy today. But I'll move to damo if it's between him and ND. What are you going to do?

It does not seem likely teacon as scum would lock himself into voting for damo over ND when they were the top wagons.

No, but if I'm not mistaken this was a restatement of things he had said before, so he was already locked at this point. Check me on that.

I checked, I could not find anything, but I do not know why a scum teacon would lock himself into a vote on damo earlier either.

[bozotheclown]

@bozo why vashta over Durga? A Durga lynch reveals more information, and she is one of your scum reads.

I find Vashta more suspicious than Durga.

[bozotheclown]

Durga has had plenty of time to post some real content, posted enough times to have some content, and even posted relatively sprinkled throughout.
All Durga has done is respond saying that they're the demon overlord, and jump onto the ND bandwagon and maintain that his meta is scum.

So,
##VOTE Durga

Vashta posted less content and also maintained ND was scum, why Durga over Vashta?