why are my support holds failing??

[FlaviusAetius]

http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=241092

Once in Autumn 1904(I lose Belgium despite support holding it with English channel)
and
Once in Autumn 1910(I lose West Med despite support holding it with North Africa)

In both instances, on the map, its shown me doing nothing, but in the order log, it says it failed, despite it suppose to be working??

[90kicvesb]

A support hold on a unit ordered to move does not count.

[FlaviusAetius]

[dargorygel]

This is actually one of the more common misconceptions we fall into. A support order must either be supporting to move, or supporting to hold.

[marperra]

And what about this case:
A support hold B.
B is ordered to move to C, but can't actually move because of a standoff.

So does the support of A count, in case somebody else attacks B, or is it cut?

[Claesar]

And what about this case:
A support hold B.
B is ordered to move to C, but can't actually move because of a standoff.

So does the support of A count, in case somebody else attacks B, or is it cut?

Nope, the order fails because the unit is ordered to move.

Only actions for a unit supported to hold are "Hold", "Support" and "Convoy", if you want the support hold to be successful.

[dargorygel]

It is naturaly (but wrong) for folk to think that a support order fails or succeeds based on what actually happens, instead of based on what is ORDERED to happen.
Apparently, generals and admirals circa 1901 were quite robotic.

[Claesar]

It is naturaly (but wrong) for folk to think that a support order fails or succeeds based on what actually happens, instead of based on what is ORDERED to happen.
Apparently, generals and admirals circa 1901 were quite robotic.

Even though the move fails, the army does march. They fight a valiant battle, but are ultimately forced to retreat.

[FlaviusAetius]

And what about this case:
A support hold B.
B is ordered to move to C, but can't actually move because of a standoff.

So does the support of A count, in case somebody else attacks B, or is it cut?

Happened to me in both situations, I was like hey just order it to move, and if it fails, who cares! I'll still be able to hold Belgium, but NOPE

[Mercy]

By the way, you can always see failed support orders on the big map.

[ziran]

Also, you can do something like: Bur-Mun; Mar S Par-Bur; Par-Bur. Even though Bur is moving, someone will need three or more supports to get into Bur. And you can't dislodge your own units.

[Percy Williams]

Question: so I had Fleet in Marseilles, and the was an army in Spain.there was also a unit in Burgundy. I attack Spain, hoping to cut support move on me, but despite Spain being the supporting unit, support was not cut, and the unit in Burgundy takes Marseilles. Why did this happen?

[Squigs44]

Question: so I had Fleet in Marseilles, and the was an army in Spain.there was also a unit in Burgundy. I attack Spain, hoping to cut support move on me, but despite Spain being the supporting unit, support was not cut, and the unit in Burgundy takes Marseilles. Why did this happen?

Was the unit attacking Spain and cutting support Marseilles? A unit cannot cut support for an attack on itself.

[FlaviusAetius]

you have to think of it in numbers if you have 2 units versus 1 unit, the 2 units will always win, no matter what the 1 unit does

[Percy Williams]

Question: so I had Fleet in Marseilles, and the was an army in Spain.there was also a unit in Burgundy. I attack Spain, hoping to cut support move on me, but despite Spain being the supporting unit, support was not cut, and the unit in Burgundy takes Marseilles. Why did this happen?

Was the unit attacking Spain and cutting support Marseilles? A unit cannot cut support for an attack on itself.

Can you link that rule for me? It was cutting support against Marseilles, but I've never heard of that rule before. I'd love to read up on it.

[Squigs44]

Question: so I had Fleet in Marseilles, and the was an army in Spain.there was also a unit in Burgundy. I attack Spain, hoping to cut support move on me, but despite Spain being the supporting unit, support was not cut, and the unit in Burgundy takes Marseilles. Why did this happen?

Was the unit attacking Spain and cutting support Marseilles? A unit cannot cut support for an attack on itself.

Can you link that rule for me? It was cutting support against Marseilles, but I've never heard of that rule before. I'd love to read up on it.

Sure. The complete rulebook is listed in the FAQ: http://webdiplomacy.net/faq.php
It's under the tab that says something like I want to learn all the rules or something. In that PDF, go to page 10 for cutting support. Diagram 16 is especially useful in your scenario

[Squigs44]

The FAQ just got redone, so it's under the tab saying I want to learn how to play or something along those lines. The link is Avalon Hills rulebook

[jmo1121109]

Question: so I had Fleet in Marseilles, and the was an army in Spain.there was also a unit in Burgundy. I attack Spain, hoping to cut support move on me, but despite Spain being the supporting unit, support was not cut, and the unit in Burgundy takes Marseilles. Why did this happen?

Was the unit attacking Spain and cutting support Marseilles? A unit cannot cut support for an attack on itself.

Can you link that rule for me? It was cutting support against Marseilles, but I've never heard of that rule before. I'd love to read up on it.

All Adjudicator rules are outlined on this page with links to the rules for processing games that all online diplomacy sites are *supposed* to follow.
http://webdiplomacy.net/datc.php#section4

6.D.15 - Passed
TEST CASE, DEFENDER CAN NOT CUT SUPPORT FOR ATTACK ON ITSELF

http://web.inter.nl.net/users/L.B.Kruijswijk/#6.D.15

[TrPrado]

I love every time the DATC gets a shoutout

It helped me learn the rules as well as I know them