MAFIA 45 GAME THREAD - BETWEEN A ROCK AND A...ROCK

[Jamiet99uk]

Vanilla games are a bit tedious.

[dargorygel]

And @worcej. Take another look at my voting. I've voted more than you. This particular repainting of reality also seems scummy.

You start with me each day - I am a constant scum read for you since D1. We're now on D5 and it's still the same.

Yes... i start with you. You remain on my scum list.
But that is not what you are accusing me of.
You wrote that ALL I do is vote you.
Twisting the truth a bit, eh?

[Jamiet99uk]

Notice how Claesar, who is in danger of being hammered, checked in, made a snide remark, avoided answering questions, and left.

Defeated scum going through the motions.

[dargorygel]

I believe Scum's strategy here was for claesar to trigger me so much that the noise of me arguing with him distracted town from finding the last scum.

But I believe I have worked out who the third scum is.

Don't tell us yet.
Your picture of Claesar makes some sense to me.

I don't believe you AND claesar are scum together.... nor you AND worcej.

##VOTE CLAESAR
##END

Really? Wow, I think I've found the last scum as well.

"Your story makes some sense"
"#end"

How are these two things in the same post? That sounds like someone who wants the game to end today.

I'll answer this here, answering other folk's comments too.
Seems to me that our deductions hinge on confirming or not your flip... and I think worcej's.

Why wait to flip?

The morale of the room is low... let's move it along. When we know your alignment, we learn a lot more than we learn by vapor/worcej darg/worcej claesar/everyone repetitive arguments.

[yavuzovic]

I didn't like the push on Claesar. The previous day, scum were highly bussing xorxes but i don't think they would do this again. Claesar wagon is scummy place we should more focus on I think. I will ##vote worcej

Also we should read the NK, they killed MF because we were already on the wrong track and they didn't want us to get much information. We should rrvise our scumreads.

[yavuzovic]

I also didn't like bozo's list of interactions, not scummy but looks useless. I think we should look at their contents, not comparing his interactions with different people.

[yavuzovic]

I want everyone to look at this behaviour from Claesar.

For the entire game he has made unsubstantiated claims and then when challenged or questioned, he just disappears for a while and refuses to respond. The later he comes back and repeats the claims.

This is not town play.

This is not a scum play too. Can you say this is a scum play?
Cleasar is someone can be lynched easily because of his actions but I actually townread him. I could vote him but there are more scummier people, ##vote Jamie I think we should look for scums on Cleasar wagon

[yavuzovic]

Vanilla games are a bit tedious.

Maybe it should be played with less players? We added too much water in vanilla and now it's diluted. I would like to play a smaller game but a big vanilla game, no.

[dargorygel]

I want everyone to look at this behaviour from Claesar.

For the entire game he has made unsubstantiated claims and then when challenged or questioned, he just disappears for a while and refuses to respond. The later he comes back and repeats the claims.

This is not town play.

This is not a scum play too. Can you say this is a scum play?
Cleasar is someone can be lynched easily because of his actions but I actually townread him. I could vote him but there are more scummier people, ##vote Jamie I think we should look for scums on Cleasar wagon

I don't understand this,yavu. Claesar is no more snow easy Lynch than jamiet or worcej. Why are you defending him when he doesn't defend himself, other than by diversion? Why hasn't he told us of his scum slip find? I find that very suspicious. His mind was changed apparently... If it was his own logic, why not tell us? There is no pr to protect... But if the QT talked home into changing his direction... Then this makes sense. Of course there still are more scum. But his flip gives us info about who defended him and who he attacked.

[bozotheclown]

I reviewed the interactions Claesar and worcej had with xorxes, and there was not much. Claesar's only mention of xorxes before D4 was when he was talking about M16.

Claesar joined the xorxes wagon D4:

I just noticed Rdrivera asked us to lynch Xorxes. I'll hold off lynching Jamie for a turn, then.

##vote Xorxes

I think Claesar was looking for a reason to bus xorxes even though he had never scum read him and had first voted for Jamie D4.

worcej didn't seem to scum read xorxes D1 or D2, but on D3 started talking about lynching xorxes for surviving the NKs:

Well, I missed EON again, this EOD time is pretty bad to me.

My scumread were Xorxes, Durga, Yav and a deep one that I don't have a clue. Now I obviously need to start reading as it seems I was utterly wrong again.

Well, Xorxes is still alive and it's D3 - we are close to auto-lynching him because he must be scum.

Xorxes has been very inactive.

Lynch him.

This is growing in my eyes, but I'd rather do it at mylo.

When D3 became brainbomb vs. xorxes, worcej stayed off either wagon for most of the day, and voted for brainbomb 7 hours before EOD when brainbomb was leading xorxes 4-3:

but if you think youve caught scum give it some passion.

No joke read your story, had a welling of compassion for you and everything you said. Made me think of you in a very positive way. This guy just dumped his heart into telling this and I feel for him. He's clearly just as upset about being labeled scum and no one believes him, just like my own situation.

Then I remember that we are playing a game. And you're good at it. And your story made me want to believe you and lynch someone else.

##vote brainbomb - because I actually respect your ability at this game and that personal story made you personable, which naturally makes people want to believe you regardless of their suspicions.

On D4, worcej voted to policy lynch xorxes:

Okay, we're at policy lynch time.

##vote xorxes - if you're town, I'll be shocked.

I think worcej was setting up a possible bus of xorxes D3, waited to see if xorxes became the top wagon, then decided to help get lynch brainbomb over xorxes when it was possible. Then I think he bussed xorxes D4 when xorxes was the obvious lynch.

[damo666]

I think I've sussed the entire scumteam

##end

[bozotheclown]

I am OK lynching either Claesar or worcej today.

##VOTE Claesar

[worcej]

Notice how Claesar, who is in danger of being hammered, checked in, made a snide remark, avoided answering questions, and left.

Defeated scum going through the motions.

Considering most scum go down swinging, I am not so sure I agree with this.

[Claesar]

Claesar: "I will townclear myself later, when I have time."
Jamie, Dargo, Damo: "Oh no, that's bad for us. We don't need more info, because we have a QT to talk in and we knew everything from the start. #end."

Thanks, this is really nice info.

[worcej]

@bozo - in regards to xorxes, I think it is pretty well established if he is still alive beyond N3 that he is probably scum.

[worcej]

Claesar: "I will townclear myself later, when I have time."
Jamie, Dargo, Damo: "Oh no, that's bad for us. We don't need more info, because we have a QT to talk in and we knew everything from the start. #end."

Thanks, this is really nice info.

I definitely do not like this rush to end today already.

[worcej]

I think I've sussed the entire scumteam

##end

Are they just your scum reads? Any more context to establish who they are?

[worcej]

I want everyone to look at this behaviour from Claesar.

For the entire game he has made unsubstantiated claims and then when challenged or questioned, he just disappears for a while and refuses to respond. The later he comes back and repeats the claims.

This is not town play.

This is not a scum play too. Can you say this is a scum play?
Cleasar is someone can be lynched easily because of his actions but I actually townread him. I could vote him but there are more scummier people, ##vote Jamie I think we should look for scums on Cleasar wagon

I don't understand this,yavu. Claesar is no more snow easy Lynch than jamiet or worcej. Why are you defending him when he doesn't defend himself, other than by diversion? Why hasn't he told us of his scum slip find? I find that very suspicious. His mind was changed apparently... If it was his own logic, why not tell us? There is no pr to protect... But if the QT talked home into changing his direction... Then this makes sense. Of course there still are more scum. But his flip gives us info about who defended him and who he attacked.

I actually really disagree with that last bit - the scum don't need to defend themselves at ALL this game. This focus on 'connections' in a vanilla game is foolish - if I were scum, I wouldn't give a fuck about protecting my team, especially with how this game has broken down and been pretty much a long slide of poor town play.

We have yet to actually really find a scum - xorxes was the easy one and knowing him from the last game we were scum. Want some interesting info? Go back and look at Xorxes' interactions with Vecna, Lord, and Myself in M44. You know what he did? He scum read me, nulled Lord, and town read Vecna. This analysis that bozo did with the underlining thought that xorxes would avoid his team is not something he actually has done.

The scum team this game should have known xorxes would be the easy one to get random lynched as the game went on. This is why I look @ bozo's little analysis as a convenient analysis to get dumb town to look at distancing and interactions and setup mislynches.

[worcej]

Xorxes, in M1005, was also scum. Partners: Jamie and Neph.

# of times Xorxes discussed Jaime in a Post: Too damn many to count actually... they talked with each other a lot,
# of times Jamie scum read by Xorxes: 1
# of times Jamie town read by Xorxes: 2

# of times Xorxes mentioned Neph in a Post: 10 times, a lot of them direct interactions.
# of times Neph scum read by Xorxes: 1
# of times Neph town read by Xorxes: 2

The theory of Xorxes intentionally distancing himself from his scum team this game seems rooted in fallacy...

[damo666]

I think I've sussed the entire scumteam

##end

Are they just your scum reads? Any more context to establish who they are?

Yes (including VCA). At night.