MAFIA 43 - GAME THREAD

[Vecna]

all the people that I'm adressing are ignoring me
No seriously I want fox and vecnas thoughts on flash

Well, my read on Flash (if you are interested) is he is acting weirdly. Not because he didn't vote bb (he can be tired of the same joke), but because he has jumped fast on real votes. Other games he was hedgy and didn't push votes this way. Considering he was never scum (as far as I remember) can't say it's scum meta, but something to keep an eye.

nope. high suspicion on Rdrivera.

[Vecna]

this for example is scummy
this is the classic mafia defense, power negotiation
usually, when someone says a wolf is scummy then the wolf just strongly says, prove it.
or
explain.
I've seen this countless times while playing mafia in wolves and sk alike.

I like this attorney guy.

Why? I find this logic bullshit. I have seen town act this exactly same way when accused so many times and get myslinched with bad arguments like this: "you want to defend yourself you must be scum".

Even though factually correct, im surprised rdrivera doesnt understand why xorxes would like attorney here. The vibe of feelings is not there.

[Vecna]

so I should not question people's remarks? are you actually assuming there is no mafia wanting to paint townies as scum?

i am not
is that a slip
hmmmm

there's nothing more scummier than you wanting to hammer so quickly into D1

obvious TvT fight iyam

[Vecna]

explain what's scummy

quote a post and say why

Your first vote on Xorxes was trying to draw a connection between his alignment in a previous game, which has no bearing on this one. And then you did it again.

Your switch to Durga was weird and unjustified, like you noticed you weren't getting traction on Xorxes and wanted to move your vote so it wouldn't draw attention. You tried to make it look like you were pressure voting, but were unconvincing, in no small part because it looks opportunistic rather than pressure.

You initially liked Xorxes' plan, but then pushed back against it because you wanted consensus and then because you thought it was happening too fast and then because Xorxes is just some rando making demands. To me, that looks like scum being afraid that Xorxes plan will work and so trying to both avoid claiming and tank the plan at the same time.

You are grasping at straws rather than making any real analysis.

that sure is a post that is trying very hard to be factually correct.

very confronting though. not sure it fits foxies scumplay.

hmmm.

[Vecna]

I found a minor flaw in my plan: If every town (except for the Party Cop) is required to tell the truth, then at the end of the day scum will know if the PC has lied or not, and so they will know in which side of the house they have to look for them.

Fortunately there's an easy fix: Only conservative townies (other than the PC) are required to be truthful. Most non-conservatives should also be truthful (so as not to add noise into the scumpool) but one or two should probably lie and say they're conservatives, as that helps protect the valuable PC. This way scum don't know where to look for the PC, because they don't know if they lied or not.

Non-conservatives claiming conservative doesn't affect the reliability of the PC's scans. They scan in the non-conservative pool and if they get conservative (or DUP) it's a guilty and if they get anything else it's a clear.

This is a terrible idea. It gives the Mafia an excuse to lie, and undermines the entire exercise. This would only work IF we are certainly lynching from the non-conservative group, AND no mafia lies using the excuse Xorxes gives them.

catching people in the lie is the entire point. very opinionated attack on the plan, while the town response is mostly one if "yeah this could work out nicely"

bad vibes from this slot so far.

[Vecna]

explain what's scummy

quote a post and say why

Your first vote on Xorxes was trying to draw a connection between his alignment in a previous game, which has no bearing on this one. And then you did it again.

Your switch to Durga was weird and unjustified, like you noticed you weren't getting traction on Xorxes and wanted to move your vote so it wouldn't draw attention. You tried to make it look like you were pressure voting, but were unconvincing, in no small part because it looks opportunistic rather than pressure.

You initially liked Xorxes' plan, but then pushed back against it because you wanted consensus and then because you thought it was happening too fast and then because Xorxes is just some rando making demands. To me, that looks like scum being afraid that Xorxes plan will work and so trying to both avoid claiming and tank the plan at the same time.

You are grasping at straws rather than making any real analysis.

My 1st vote on Xorxes was not real
I did specify it was done IN JEST

I switched to Durga because I disliked her 'yikes' reply to one of my post, there's nothing more to that.

There was no pressure vote, you're pulling stuff out of your butt.

I was being honest in wanting to hear people's thought on Xorxes and not just give in to his command.

A scum would simly NOT POST anything than make himself suspicious by openly doubting a plan that favors town.

You have no clue why I hesistated, I have my own reasons.

such a towny response again. as scum, this guy was friendly and avoiding conflict.

here hes direct, cobfrontational, certain of his own reasoning

verdict: hard town

[Vecna]

explain what's scummy

quote a post and say why

Your first vote on Xorxes was trying to draw a connection between his alignment in a previous game, which has no bearing on this one. And then you did it again.

Your switch to Durga was weird and unjustified, like you noticed you weren't getting traction on Xorxes and wanted to move your vote so it wouldn't draw attention. You tried to make it look like you were pressure voting, but were unconvincing, in no small part because it looks opportunistic rather than pressure.

You initially liked Xorxes' plan, but then pushed back against it because you wanted consensus and then because you thought it was happening too fast and then because Xorxes is just some rando making demands. To me, that looks like scum being afraid that Xorxes plan will work and so trying to both avoid claiming and tank the plan at the same time.

You are grasping at straws rather than making any real analysis.

After clicking on all of foxcastles links, this further solidifies my scumread on vapor.
I hadn't looked at the full game yet but this feels like vapor is scum.
I'm gonna look at percy meta, I'm thinking he might be wolf.
##VOTE Vaporwave

meh. question the reasoning though?

[Vecna]

can we please use 'Hi' I really prefer the American style

it sounds much nicer as a greeting.

What further proof of his scumhood do we need? Rule Britannia!
This is the noble land of Britain! The land of hope and glory! I will not sully the beautiful language that we speak with such sad terms as "Hi".
##VOTE VAPORWAVE

God save the Queen!

i sure like this slot for scum

[flash2015]

Vecna, are you going to declare your party...or did I miss it?

[Vecna]

percy is some australian guy who i can never get his alignment right i swear its the worst

hmmm

[ND]

Second scum choice is Vapor and I could vote for him as well.

Did you not see he claimed Jeremy Corbyn? Unless someone CC, he shouldn't be on your scum pile.

I read as fast as I could and must have missed that. Thanks. I'll search for that post on the bot, but I won't vote for Vapor today.

[Nephthys]

Vapor/Attorney interaction early on (~p. 13-15) seems very unlikely to be scum/scum to me.

I don't like Percy's vote for Vapor at the top of 16 (For ref). It looks like a joke vote, but it's at a period where people actually were scumreading Vapor and he was the center of the recent discussion. Seems like a vote to keep momentum going, but in a format that would allow him to absolve himself later, claiming it was just a joke.

damo seems like he's just commenting to comment. Taking things out of context and not really making implications from his comments.

Note: thamrick reappears but doesn't address the conservative question. I still have a few pages to read though.

I agree Vapor/Attorney unlikely to be scum/scum. My take at the moment is town/town.

@xorx what makes you arrive at this conclusion? I got that one was likely scum when I read through.

[Nephthys]

From the Maf QT

Jamie the Great: This QT is closed during the day.

I was expecting much more but still entertained

[Nephthys]

flash, it got more suspicious because of your absence

plus you're conservative and your posts aren't exactly smelling of full bloom townie flavor

I think if you're town, your vote on Attorney cements my belief he's a mafia PR

What??? How would a town flash voting for a scum Attorney make him a PR?

This seems more like a scumslip than anything tbh.

[Vecna]

The shitposting ended wayy too quickly here lmao (was expecting the first 10 pages or so)

where did it all go? Why'd the tone get serious all of a sudden

I can't joke as much, sad sad --different players, different mood, oh well.
______

And the reason I was hedgey is all the posts from my last one until now :D

since it seemed to be moving too quickly, the decision to mass-claim, especially 1) There were two plans, and 2) More than half the players hadn't posted or even read the thread then.

As of now, it seems solid enough that the majority of people can gain info from it, so I'll say that I'm in the great kinky noncon party

not quite getting the same super towny feelings from emc yet this game

[Attorney]

what has bb done to advance the game
anyone voting me should at least have a reasonable explanation on why bb is town

[Attorney]

flash, it got more suspicious because of your absence

plus you're conservative and your posts aren't exactly smelling of full bloom townie flavor

I think if you're town, your vote on Attorney cements my belief he's a mafia PR

What??? How would a town flash voting for a scum Attorney make him a PR?

This seems more like a scumslip than anything tbh.

agreed
also i do not think a real town pr would claim d1 under a low threat of lynch

[Nephthys]

Neph's (smaller) wall

So tham did answer my question but I really don't like the answer. I personally think that to really like someone to warrant posting you townlean is generally when you think they're on the right track, usually pushing good theories (xorx) or catching scum. I've already pointed out how this doesn't add up with the initial post. I think it more likely that he just picked people who he thought were easy TR. Scum lean

As for brain, what Tom said last game really stood out to me. There's no point lynching someone who will obv themselves easily. While overnight he went nuts and I'm suspicious, I'm not 100% yet. Based on last game (sorry brain), I really rate his scum game because its easy to pick up. I think he's best left alone for today put scrutinized tomorrow.

Attorney is really concerning me. Outing a PR is some horrific play. Luckily it was one of the more chill ones (assuming he was telling the truth). Regardless, Attorney needs to chill, he seems to do alright with some of his posting but then just makes some really dodgy decisions...

Vapor is still giving me odd feelings. Feels like he could be trying to buddy me? Not quite as overt as last game but still gives me pause. On the whole I think he's more likely town that Attorney (still think its S/T)

Percy is lacking severely in content which again is really concerning. Thinking a good lynch for tomorrow.

Vecna seems towny, prodding people and providing some content. My one concern is that he kinda pulled the rd susp out of nowhere. I don't feel ready to make a comment about rd yet but I note xorx voted for him just before. Also, I would like to know what this means?

Well, sorry for being late to the party. I confess I don't have a clue about British politics and the roles are a bit confusing to me.

I think Squigs maths seems solid even if he didn't consider Bozo scenario where two scum lie and keep it 11/10, but I don't think it change the odds for the Party Cop, he still have a 1/11 to hit scum and the lynch odds are also the same

So, I am in favour of the claiming and I am a conservative.

Also, it's Carnaval here, so don't expect much from me until Wednesday (if I am still alive).

Rdrivera explicitely not doing the thing

Overall
Scum - Percy, V/A (probs A), Tham
Will out themselves in the next day or two - Brain
Town - Vecna (for now), xorx, bozo

Lynch order
Attorney
Brain/Percy
Percy/Tham

[Vaporwave]

that sure is a post that is trying very hard to be factually correct.

very confronting though. not sure it fits foxies scumplay.

hmmm.

I've replied to his case, he didn't seem to acknowledge or address it

I'm really not sure where I stand on Fox's mind

He defended his skepticism of xorxes in the beginning but when I wasn't sure to claim to early, he used that against me saying I'm trying to not be on board

I think I should retract my townlean on Fox

[Jamiet99uk]

GM NOTE

MOSCOWFLEET has requested a replacement. Stand by.